Starline brass in 32 acp . . . help!

Prof Young · September 19, 2022, 08:30 PM

Loaders:

With a dearth of 32 acp on the store shelves, I ordered some Starline 32 acp brass and set out to make my own.

The brass goes up in to the sizer die with a click and takes super power strength to pull them back out leaving a line around the brass.

I readjusted the die etc.

No change.

See pic below.

What the heck is going on?

Life is good.
Prof Young

FITASC · September 19, 2022, 08:35 PM

Those are 32ACP? Maybe it ia the angle and lighting, but they look too long. Assuming it is just my old eyes, are you using 32acp dies and not trying to use one of those 32 dies that cover a range of brass?
Are they carbide dies?
Decapping/resizer should just slightly kiss the shellplate. RCBS instructions are great and tend to work with other brands as well

**44 AMP** · September 20, 2022, 12:39 AM

agree, they look too long in the picture...

What does the case headstamp say?

How long is the brass???

.32ACP case max length is 0.680, according to my old Lyman manual.

Are you using a .32acp sizer die? Who's?? Carbide?? regular steel? Lube??

a little more info would help rule out some possibilities..

FrankenMauser · September 20, 2022, 11:20 AM

Agreed. That doesn't look right.
How are the dies marked?

Is the ring concentric? Some of those cases look like they got bent by the die -- from, say, the wrong shell holder or one that the rims don't fit well.

Some thoughts, while we wait on a response:
The 'click' may just be a bur on the case mouth. I've seen this several times with Starline brass. It could also be a loose carbide insert, if using a carbide die.

Hornady dies tend to leave weird sizing marks, since the internal finish is often worse that most other brands.

Lee .32 Auto and .32 S&W die sets are piecemeal affairs. They don't actually have all ".32 Auto" or all ".32 S&W" dies; and they seem to change up what is in the sets based on what is in stock.
Lee also shipped some sets recently with .30 SC sizing dies, which won't resize the case properly - but in the opposite direction from what you're getting.

Prof Young · September 21, 2022, 12:35 AM

Head stamp says 32 Auto. Is that not the same as 32 ACP?

I'll get the calipers out, measure one and get back to you all.

Thanks.

Life is good.
Prof Young

ligonierbill · September 21, 2022, 06:00 AM

Yes, the same. Does sound like a die problem. Mislabeled perhaps? This round is a straightforward loading proposition.

**44 AMP** · September 21, 2022, 01:09 PM

.32 Auto, .32 ACP and 7.65mm (Kal 7.65mm or 7.65mm Browning) are the same cartridge.

There are other .32s and even other 7.65mm cartridges (the 7.65mm Luger is known in the US as the .30 Luger, and there is an obsolete French round the 7.65mm MAS) that are much different cases than the .32ACP.

Please measure the cases you have, so we know if they are actually out of spec, or if it is just the perspective and camera angle of the picture that makes them look "too long".

Also, please let us know exactly what sizer die you are using, (what brand, and how it is marked).

Starline has a reputation for making pretty good stuff. But mistakes are always possible. IF a batch of their brass is significantly too long, and it got past their QC, they need to know about it.

If the brass is ok, and you're using the wrong die, or your die is bad, you need to know about it.

eagerly waiting for more information on this curious problem...

reddog81 · September 21, 2022, 02:25 PM

Using a steel die without lube will cause the issues you describe.

Electrod47 · September 21, 2022, 02:58 PM

No. 1 "More Lube"

Schlitz 45 · September 21, 2022, 03:44 PM

"That's what she said"

Prof Young · September 21, 2022, 03:50 PM

Loaders:

First, thanks for all the help.

The brass is 0.673 inches so that can't be it.

I'm using a Lee carbide sizing die, so that's most likely not the problem.

I'll try some case lube. I've never had to lube pistol brass before, but there's always a first time. Will let you know how it goes.

Life is good.
Prof Young

Mike38 · September 21, 2022, 07:39 PM

I use carbide Lee dies for .32acp without lube and have never had this problem. Strange. My first guess after reading only the first post was the brass is .32 S&W. But I guess not.

P Flados · September 21, 2022, 08:21 PM

When I got into 327 Fed reloading, I bought a big bag of Starline Brass and a set of Lee dies.

They were very hard to size and they were very hard to run through the expander.

Eventually I started getting a few case splits well before I should have. I realized I was wearing out my brass by sizing it down much more than needed.

My problem was that the Lee dies seemed to be set up to size down the thinnest wall 32 brass and still have a tight fit for a 0.308" bullet. Not a good thing as I load 0.314 cast bullets and my brass is probably thicker than some 32 brass.

Measure the ID of your all of the brass that you have run a least a little bit into the sizer. Pick the biggest measurement you found. The die is probably smaller than you need if it is more than say 0.004" smaller than the smallest bullet diameter you expect to load.

I have a Mini lathe. I chucked up my die, put a fine grit diamond burr in a dremel and removed a little material off of the surface of the carbide ring. I then did some lapping. I checked, and found I had not removed enough material. I repeated this process a few times until my sized brass would run through the expander with light effort. The finish on the ID of the die is not a smooth as I would like but it is working fine. It is easy to use now and it is and not scratching the brass or scraping the oxide off of the brass.

My die is "too big" for some 32 reloading now. I am ok with this given how much better it is for my application. Note that a replacement die is probably cheaper (should I ever want one) than another bag of 327 brass (that I would have likely needed soon if I had not fixed my sizer).

P Flados · September 21, 2022, 08:31 PM

When I got into 327 Fed reloading, I bought a big bag of Starline Brass and a set of Lee dies.

They were very hard to size and they were very hard to run through the expander.

Eventually I started getting a few case splits well before I should have. I realized I was wearing out my brass by sizing it down much more than needed.

My problem was that the Lee dies seemed to be set up to size down the thinnest wall 32 brass and still have a tight fit for a 0.308" bullet. Not a good thing as I load 0.314 cast bullets and my brass is probably thicker than some 32 brass.

Measure the ID of your all of the brass that you have run a least a little bit into the sizer. Pick the biggest measurement you found. The die is probably smaller than you need if it is more than say 0.004" smaller than the smallest bullet diameter you expect to load.

I have a Mini lathe. I chucked up my die, put a fine grit diamond burr in a dremel and removed a little material off of the surface of the carbide ring. I then did some lapping. I checked, and found I had not removed enough material. I repeated this process a few times until my sized brass would run through the expander with light effort. The finish on the ID of the die is not a smooth as I would like but it is working fine. It is easy to use now and it is and not scratching the brass or scraping the oxide off of the brass.

My die is "too big" for some 32 reloading now. I am ok with this given how much better it is for my application. Note that a replacement die is probably cheaper (should I ever want one) than another bag of 327 brass (that I would have likely needed soon if I had not fixed my sizer).

**44 AMP** · September 22, 2022, 03:21 AM

Quote:

I'm using a Lee carbide sizing die, so that's most likely not the problem.

actually, I'd say that most likely is the problem.

I will admit I don't like Lee dies. Its mostly a feature and finish thing, but I have noticed that in other pistol calibers the Lee sizers I've used size the brass smaller than my RCBS and Lyman dies do.

OK, so case length is good, you might also check an unsized case diameter but I suspect it will be within normal range, as well, so that kind of leaves the die as the likely culprit.

A carbide sizer die should not be super tough to use, nor require lube. That's the whole point of the carbide sizer. Lube doesn't HURT and makes things even easier, but it shouldn't be needed.

There is a possibility that the carbide sizer ring in your die is "loose" (maybe that's where the "click" is coming from? Might or might not be "loose" to finger pressure and only move during the pressure of resizing.

I'm guessing at this point...

I would recommend getting a set of RCBS carbide dies and see what kind of difference that makes. (and get the RCBS shellholder too, one less variable to worry about)

also, if you can get your hands on any .32acp brass that isn't starline, run some of that through your sizer and see if it acts any differently.

Good Luck!

308Loader · September 22, 2022, 07:00 PM

I use the lee carbide die set and star-line brass with no lube, no issue. Die set 32 Auto - 765 browning, 3 die set with shell holder (can't find part #) just my 2 cents but sounds like your die might be out of spec? have you contacted Lee with this issue? I hear they have good customer service, haven't had to call them yet to find out.

Marco Califo · September 22, 2022, 07:36 PM

I would call Starline, and ask them about it. My experience with Starline brass has been that I do not need to size it before loading. I drop it into a case guage and if it drops right in (always has), no need to size it. I do debur the case mouth, chamfering I believe that is called. I do like to then use an expander die (I like Redding and Lyman for this), and adjust just until a bullet will stay in the brass and support its weight and the brass's weight. Then when placing a bullet on that brass it goes into the seating die.
Starline may have heard of this from customers, and would know if it is getting reported to Starline. They may also have insight into how to remedy.
https://www.starlinebrass.com/contact/

Scorch · September 24, 2022, 04:04 PM

I have seen that before when the rims of the cases were just a little too thick. They hang up not quite all the way into the shell holder then "click" all the way in as you start up into the die. The first part of the case ends up being slightly out of round so it won't come back out of the die easily and has to be sized again on the down stroke. Measure the rims, and maybe polish the shellholder slot to give the cases just a smidgeon more room to fit.

berettaprofessor · September 24, 2022, 04:43 PM

Prof, what is the marking on your Lee sizing die? It should have some stamping like "32ACP Sizing B6"

**Unclenick** · September 24, 2022, 09:25 PM

Scorch's explanation makes sense because it explains why the ring isn't in the same location on each case. Some went more fully into the shell holder than the others.

If you ever looked at a chart of shell holders and which cases they will accommodate, you will find there is no universal agreement among manufacturers as to which cases should share the same holder, which means some makes will be tighter than others. Lee should be a number 7, but assuming that is what you have, I would remove it from the press and insert a case manually to see it can be inserted completely. If it can't, look for where the hangup is. If you can't slide your caes fully up against the back of the holder cut and can't spot why, or if the holder looks uneven in any way, send it and a couple of sample cases to Lee (call them first) so they can correct it. If you don't want to wait and you have an LGS with reloading equipment, the universal shell holder by Lyman (#23) or RCBS (#17) will work.

jetinteriorguy · September 25, 2022, 08:15 AM

Not to bash Lee, I use plenty of their stuff, some good, some great, some meh. I have shell holders from all the different manufacturers and the only one I’ve ever had issues with have been Lee. My personal preference are RCBS, but Lyman have worked fine, and Hornady have been excellent. I need Hornady’s in all my rifle calibers due to the hole in them being big enough to work on the Hornady neck turning tool, other brands won’t work on this tool. I have a lot of shell holders for each rifle caliber because I keep dedicated ones for each step in reloading. One for body sizing, one for neck sizing with a collet die, and one for bullet seating. I know that’s crazy, but I have dedicated single presses for each step when loading rifle ammo and need a shell holder for each one.

zeke · September 25, 2022, 10:16 AM

imo, always a good idea to start off with same brand sh as die

**Unclenick** · September 27, 2022, 06:08 PM

I expect the OP did, but is having problems.

Nathan · September 30, 2022, 08:04 AM

Measure brass od at rim, base and neck. Measure ID at the neck. Measure length.

Post your results and compare to manual.

Lube 1 case well. FL size and measure the result.

September 20, 2022, 12:39 AM	#3
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 30,465	agree, they look too long in the picture... What does the case headstamp say? How long is the brass??? .32ACP case max length is 0.680, according to my old Lyman manual. Are you using a .32acp sizer die? Who's?? Carbide?? regular steel? Lube?? a little more info would help rule out some possibilities.. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

September 20, 2022, 11:20 AM	#4
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 26, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,774	Agreed. That doesn't look right. How are the dies marked? Is the ring concentric? Some of those cases look like they got bent by the die -- from, say, the wrong shell holder or one that the rims don't fit well. Some thoughts, while we wait on a response: The 'click' may just be a bur on the case mouth. I've seen this several times with Starline brass. It could also be a loose carbide insert, if using a carbide die. Hornady dies tend to leave weird sizing marks, since the internal finish is often worse that most other brands. Lee .32 Auto and .32 S&W die sets are piecemeal affairs. They don't actually have all ".32 Auto" or all ".32 S&W" dies; and they seem to change up what is in the sets based on what is in stock. Lee also shipped some sets recently with .30 SC sizing dies, which won't resize the case properly - but in the opposite direction from what you're getting. __________________ -Unwilling Range Officer -Unwilling Match Designer -NRL22/PRS22/PRO -Something about broccoli and carrots

September 21, 2022, 12:35 AM	#5
Prof Young Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2007 Location: Illinois - down state Posts: 2,511	Hmmm . . . Head stamp says 32 Auto. Is that not the same as 32 ACP? I'll get the calipers out, measure one and get back to you all. Thanks. Life is good. Prof Young

September 21, 2022, 01:09 PM	#7
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 30,465	.32 Auto, .32 ACP and 7.65mm (Kal 7.65mm or 7.65mm Browning) are the same cartridge. There are other .32s and even other 7.65mm cartridges (the 7.65mm Luger is known in the US as the .30 Luger, and there is an obsolete French round the 7.65mm MAS) that are much different cases than the .32ACP. Please measure the cases you have, so we know if they are actually out of spec, or if it is just the perspective and camera angle of the picture that makes them look "too long". Also, please let us know exactly what sizer die you are using, (what brand, and how it is marked). Starline has a reputation for making pretty good stuff. But mistakes are always possible. IF a batch of their brass is significantly too long, and it got past their QC, they need to know about it. If the brass is ok, and you're using the wrong die, or your die is bad, you need to know about it. eagerly waiting for more information on this curious problem... __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

September 21, 2022, 03:50 PM	#11
Prof Young Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2007 Location: Illinois - down state Posts: 2,511	Hmmm...maybe it's lube thing . . . Loaders: First, thanks for all the help. The brass is 0.673 inches so that can't be it. I'm using a Lee carbide sizing die, so that's most likely not the problem. I'll try some case lube. I've never had to lube pistol brass before, but there's always a first time. Will let you know how it goes. Life is good. Prof Young

September 19, 2022, 08:35 PM	#2
FITASC Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2014 Posts: 6,645	Those are 32ACP? Maybe it ia the angle and lighting, but they look too long. Assuming it is just my old eyes, are you using 32acp dies and not trying to use one of those 32 dies that cover a range of brass? Are they carbide dies? Decapping/resizer should just slightly kiss the shellplate. RCBS instructions are great and tend to work with other brands as well __________________ "I believe that people have a right to decide their own destinies; people own themselves. I also believe that, in a democracy, government exists because (and only so long as) individual citizens give it a 'temporary license to exist'—in exchange for a promise that it will behave itself. In a democracy, you own the government—it doesn't own you."- Frank Zappa

September 21, 2022, 06:00 AM	#6
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,646	Yes, the same. Does sound like a die problem. Mislabeled perhaps? This round is a straightforward loading proposition.

September 21, 2022, 02:25 PM	#8
reddog81 Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,659	Using a steel die without lube will cause the issues you describe.

September 21, 2022, 02:58 PM	#9
Electrod47 Senior Member Join Date: April 27, 2021 Location: SE Mississippi Posts: 105	No. 1 "More Lube"

September 21, 2022, 03:44 PM	#10
Schlitz 45 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2018 Location: Colorado Posts: 414	"That's what she said"

September 21, 2022, 07:39 PM	#12
Mike38 Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 2009 Location: North Central Illinois Posts: 2,758	I use carbide Lee dies for .32acp without lube and have never had this problem. Strange. My first guess after reading only the first post was the brass is .32 S&W. But I guess not.

September 21, 2022, 08:21 PM	#13
P Flados Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2017 Location: Wilmington NC Posts: 265	When I got into 327 Fed reloading, I bought a big bag of Starline Brass and a set of Lee dies. They were very hard to size and they were very hard to run through the expander. Eventually I started getting a few case splits well before I should have. I realized I was wearing out my brass by sizing it down much more than needed. My problem was that the Lee dies seemed to be set up to size down the thinnest wall 32 brass and still have a tight fit for a 0.308" bullet. Not a good thing as I load 0.314 cast bullets and my brass is probably thicker than some 32 brass. Measure the ID of your all of the brass that you have run a least a little bit into the sizer. Pick the biggest measurement you found. The die is probably smaller than you need if it is more than say 0.004" smaller than the smallest bullet diameter you expect to load. I have a Mini lathe. I chucked up my die, put a fine grit diamond burr in a dremel and removed a little material off of the surface of the carbide ring. I then did some lapping. I checked, and found I had not removed enough material. I repeated this process a few times until my sized brass would run through the expander with light effort. The finish on the ID of the die is not a smooth as I would like but it is working fine. It is easy to use now and it is and not scratching the brass or scraping the oxide off of the brass. My die is "too big" for some 32 reloading now. I am ok with this given how much better it is for my application. Note that a replacement die is probably cheaper (should I ever want one) than another bag of 327 brass (that I would have likely needed soon if I had not fixed my sizer).

September 21, 2022, 08:31 PM	#14
P Flados Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2017 Location: Wilmington NC Posts: 265	When I got into 327 Fed reloading, I bought a big bag of Starline Brass and a set of Lee dies. They were very hard to size and they were very hard to run through the expander. Eventually I started getting a few case splits well before I should have. I realized I was wearing out my brass by sizing it down much more than needed. My problem was that the Lee dies seemed to be set up to size down the thinnest wall 32 brass and still have a tight fit for a 0.308" bullet. Not a good thing as I load 0.314 cast bullets and my brass is probably thicker than some 32 brass. Measure the ID of your all of the brass that you have run a least a little bit into the sizer. Pick the biggest measurement you found. The die is probably smaller than you need if it is more than say 0.004" smaller than the smallest bullet diameter you expect to load. I have a Mini lathe. I chucked up my die, put a fine grit diamond burr in a dremel and removed a little material off of the surface of the carbide ring. I then did some lapping. I checked, and found I had not removed enough material. I repeated this process a few times until my sized brass would run through the expander with light effort. The finish on the ID of the die is not a smooth as I would like but it is working fine. It is easy to use now and it is and not scratching the brass or scraping the oxide off of the brass. My die is "too big" for some 32 reloading now. I am ok with this given how much better it is for my application. Note that a replacement die is probably cheaper (should I ever want one) than another bag of 327 brass (that I would have likely needed soon if I had not fixed my sizer).

September 22, 2022, 07:00 PM	#16
308Loader Senior Member Join Date: August 24, 2014 Location: Minnesota Posts: 639	I use the lee carbide die set and star-line brass with no lube, no issue. Die set 32 Auto - 765 browning, 3 die set with shell holder (can't find part #) just my 2 cents but sounds like your die might be out of spec? have you contacted Lee with this issue? I hear they have good customer service, haven't had to call them yet to find out. __________________ Just a dude with stuff.

September 22, 2022, 07:36 PM	#17
Marco Califo Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: LA (Greater Los Angeles Area) Posts: 2,722	I would call Starline, and ask them about it. My experience with Starline brass has been that I do not need to size it before loading. I drop it into a case guage and if it drops right in (always has), no need to size it. I do debur the case mouth, chamfering I believe that is called. I do like to then use an expander die (I like Redding and Lyman for this), and adjust just until a bullet will stay in the brass and support its weight and the brass's weight. Then when placing a bullet on that brass it goes into the seating die. Starline may have heard of this from customers, and would know if it is getting reported to Starline. They may also have insight into how to remedy. https://www.starlinebrass.com/contact/ __________________ ............

September 24, 2022, 04:04 PM	#18
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,249	I have seen that before when the rims of the cases were just a little too thick. They hang up not quite all the way into the shell holder then "click" all the way in as you start up into the die. The first part of the case ends up being slightly out of round so it won't come back out of the die easily and has to be sized again on the down stroke. Measure the rims, and maybe polish the shellholder slot to give the cases just a smidgeon more room to fit. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

September 24, 2022, 04:43 PM	#19
berettaprofessor Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2008 Posts: 1,103	Prof, what is the marking on your Lee sizing die? It should have some stamping like "32ACP Sizing B6" __________________ "What most people forget is that the first country the Nazi's conquered was their own." 44AMP on thefiringline.com

September 24, 2022, 09:25 PM	#20
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,738	Scorch's explanation makes sense because it explains why the ring isn't in the same location on each case. Some went more fully into the shell holder than the others. If you ever looked at a chart of shell holders and which cases they will accommodate, you will find there is no universal agreement among manufacturers as to which cases should share the same holder, which means some makes will be tighter than others. Lee should be a number 7, but assuming that is what you have, I would remove it from the press and insert a case manually to see it can be inserted completely. If it can't, look for where the hangup is. If you can't slide your caes fully up against the back of the holder cut and can't spot why, or if the holder looks uneven in any way, send it and a couple of sample cases to Lee (call them first) so they can correct it. If you don't want to wait and you have an LGS with reloading equipment, the universal shell holder by Lyman (#23) or RCBS (#17) will work. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

September 25, 2022, 08:15 AM	#21
jetinteriorguy Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 2013 Posts: 3,475	Not to bash Lee, I use plenty of their stuff, some good, some great, some meh. I have shell holders from all the different manufacturers and the only one I’ve ever had issues with have been Lee. My personal preference are RCBS, but Lyman have worked fine, and Hornady have been excellent. I need Hornady’s in all my rifle calibers due to the hole in them being big enough to work on the Hornady neck turning tool, other brands won’t work on this tool. I have a lot of shell holders for each rifle caliber because I keep dedicated ones for each step in reloading. One for body sizing, one for neck sizing with a collet die, and one for bullet seating. I know that’s crazy, but I have dedicated single presses for each step when loading rifle ammo and need a shell holder for each one. Last edited by jetinteriorguy; September 26, 2022 at 07:20 AM.

September 25, 2022, 10:16 AM	#22
zeke Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 1999 Location: NW Wi Posts: 1,759	imo, always a good idea to start off with same brand sh as die

September 27, 2022, 06:08 PM	#23
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,738	I expect the OP did, but is having problems. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

September 30, 2022, 08:04 AM	#24
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,820	Measure brass od at rim, base and neck. Measure ID at the neck. Measure length. Post your results and compare to manual. Lube 1 case well. FL size and measure the result.