Pyrodex and .45 colt loads

caligula · July 19, 2020, 08:46 PM

I just dug up a box of .45 Colt loads I made up a couple years ago with Pyrodex P. The fired cases came out with the identical satan-inspired ugliness I got from black powder loads years ago. I inherited a bottle of the stuff years ago and decided to use it up in my Bisley clone. Hate the idea of scrounging up some chromium trioxide just to clean 50 cases.

S o o o o - two things: Why was this stuff even invented and is there a 'modern' way to clean fouling from brass cases?

Jim Watson · July 19, 2020, 10:48 PM

Wet tumbler with ceramic or steel pin media in soap + citric acid bath.

Pahoo · July 20, 2020, 11:45 AM

Quote:

S o o o o - two things: Why was this stuff even invented

You are referring to Pyrodex and possibly and other M/L replacement propellant???

Long story short, these were upgrades to BP as well as Pyrodex, as some folks did not like BP and Pyrodex. BP is classified as a Class-A explosive and the others as "combustible" mixture, where shipping and storage is not a big problem. However, folks who dislike working with BP/Pyro still want some of the properties of BP so now you have "Easy-Cleaning" propellant, which is mostly, not true. ......

A friend of mine who is a dedicated reloader, wanted to load some .45 LC. I gave him some BP replacement. About a month later, he returned the powder, and measure and won't quote his comment .....

Be Safe !!!

skywag · July 20, 2020, 12:47 PM

Dan Pawlak(RIP,) inventor of Pyrodex, in his lab. About 1971

Hawg · July 20, 2020, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Why was this stuff even invented and is there a 'modern' way to clean fouling from brass cases?

BP is classified as an explosive. Pyrodex is classified as a propellant. Pyrodex is basically bp made with potassium perchlorate instead of potassium nitrate. It's good stuff. The best way to clean fired cases is as soon as you fire them drop them in a jug of Windex without ammonia. When you take them out of the Windex tumble them. They may not come out sparkly clean but they won't have the black discoloration.

caligula · July 20, 2020, 04:13 PM

Thanks, Guys! Easy to see that I'm on my way to Diamond for cases. Dixie doesn't offer online access to chromium trioxide anymore and the cost of 50 once-fired cases is the easier to bear of all the options. If I ever whip up a batch of Liebigs to resurrect the poor ugly brass things, I'll post the results. The "explosive" vs "propellant" info. is a neat insight.

zxcvbob · July 20, 2020, 05:15 PM

Chromium trioxide? Are you sure that's what you're looking for? Chromium (VI) is bad stuff. I think chromium (III) oxide is pretty safe and is used as a polish.

arcticap · July 20, 2020, 05:41 PM

Try the original Lemi Shine dishwasher detergent in tumbling media. --->>> https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...#post-10989104

I think this is it. --->>> https://www.amazon.com/Lemi-Shine-Di...SAAEgJ4tfD_BwE

darkgael · July 22, 2020, 07:15 AM

About BP.....black powder is classified as “low” explosive. This means that it ignites and burns (deflagrates) at subsonic speed in contrast to high explosives which produce a supersonic shock wave.
Smokeless powder is also a low explosive (a flammable solid). Unconfined, it burns substantially slower than BP. That changes when smokeless propellant is confined and subject to pressure....then its speed of deflagration increases dramatically. BP is way less affected by pressure.

Dave T · July 25, 2020, 06:32 PM

caligula,

My experience with Pyrodex is possibly older than you are (mid-1980s) and I became convinced back then that it was in fact more corrosive than GOEX black powder. I've neither seen or read anything that would change my mind so in the future, for the sake of your firearms and your brass, avoid the stuff like the plague.

YMMV,
Dave

Hawg · July 26, 2020, 03:19 AM

Quote:

My experience with Pyrodex is possibly older than you are (mid-1980s) and I became convinced back then that it was in fact more corrosive than GOEX black powder. I've neither seen or read anything that would change my mind so in the future, for the sake of your firearms and your brass, avoid the stuff like the plague.

It's no more corrosive than black. I sometimes let my guns sit for two or three days without cleaning and have gone as many as nine days with no signs of rust or corrosion.

44caliberkid · July 26, 2020, 08:36 PM

I also found Pyrodex to be more corrosive than real BP. Back in the early 2000's I used APP if I wanted to use a sub. Have used a little Triple 7 since then, but mostly stick with the real stuff. I used to take a quart jar with water and Simple Green to the cowboy shoots and drop my empty brass in there. When I got home I dumped them in the sink with dish soap and water and gave the inside of each case a swab with a 45 caliber brass brush. They don't polish up bright, but don't corrode either.

TruthTellers · July 26, 2020, 09:11 PM

I have a Pietta NMA that has quickly turned into a rusty mess thanks to Pyrodex. Even after I clean it with a Ballistol and water mix and pure Ballistol, a week later the gun will continue to accumulate rust.

It's the only gun that I will shoot the rest of the Pyrodex I have and once all that Pyrodex is gone it's never getting replaced. I'm a Triple 7 guy now and will be from now on. Easier to clean and more power anyway.

The only good think I can say about Pyrodex is it's cheap and accurate, but not so much more accurate that it makes it more worth using over Triple 7.

July 19, 2020, 08:46 PM	#1
caligula Member Join Date: November 1, 2017 Posts: 42	Pyrodex and .45 colt loads I just dug up a box of .45 Colt loads I made up a couple years ago with Pyrodex P. The fired cases came out with the identical satan-inspired ugliness I got from black powder loads years ago. I inherited a bottle of the stuff years ago and decided to use it up in my Bisley clone. Hate the idea of scrounging up some chromium trioxide just to clean 50 cases. S o o o o - two things: Why was this stuff even invented and is there a 'modern' way to clean fouling from brass cases?

July 20, 2020, 05:15 PM	#7
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	Chromium trioxide? Are you sure that's what you're looking for? Chromium (VI) is bad stuff. I think chromium (III) oxide is pretty safe and is used as a polish. __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

July 22, 2020, 07:15 AM	#9
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	About BP.....black powder is classified as “low” explosive. This means that it ignites and burns (deflagrates) at subsonic speed in contrast to high explosives which produce a supersonic shock wave. Smokeless powder is also a low explosive (a flammable solid). Unconfined, it burns substantially slower than BP. That changes when smokeless propellant is confined and subject to pressure....then its speed of deflagration increases dramatically. BP is way less affected by pressure. __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member Last edited by darkgael; July 22, 2020 at 07:21 AM.

July 25, 2020, 06:32 PM	#10
Dave T Senior Member Join Date: April 17, 2000 Location: Mesa, Arizona Posts: 1,458	caligula, My experience with Pyrodex is possibly older than you are (mid-1980s) and I became convinced back then that it was in fact more corrosive than GOEX black powder. I've neither seen or read anything that would change my mind so in the future, for the sake of your firearms and your brass, avoid the stuff like the plague. YMMV, Dave __________________ RSVN '69-'71 PCSD Ret

July 26, 2020, 09:11 PM	#13
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,954	I have a Pietta NMA that has quickly turned into a rusty mess thanks to Pyrodex. Even after I clean it with a Ballistol and water mix and pure Ballistol, a week later the gun will continue to accumulate rust. It's the only gun that I will shoot the rest of the Pyrodex I have and once all that Pyrodex is gone it's never getting replaced. I'm a Triple 7 guy now and will be from now on. Easier to clean and more power anyway. The only good think I can say about Pyrodex is it's cheap and accurate, but not so much more accurate that it makes it more worth using over Triple 7. __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

July 19, 2020, 10:48 PM	#2
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 19,157	Wet tumbler with ceramic or steel pin media in soap + citric acid bath.

July 20, 2020, 12:47 PM	#4
skywag Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2011 Posts: 255	Dan Pawlak(RIP,) inventor of Pyrodex, in his lab. About 1971

July 20, 2020, 04:13 PM	#6
caligula Member Join Date: November 1, 2017 Posts: 42	Thanks, Guys! Easy to see that I'm on my way to Diamond for cases. Dixie doesn't offer online access to chromium trioxide anymore and the cost of 50 once-fired cases is the easier to bear of all the options. If I ever whip up a batch of Liebigs to resurrect the poor ugly brass things, I'll post the results. The "explosive" vs "propellant" info. is a neat insight.

July 20, 2020, 05:41 PM	#8
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	Try the original Lemi Shine dishwasher detergent in tumbling media. --->>> https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...#post-10989104 I think this is it. --->>> https://www.amazon.com/Lemi-Shine-Di...SAAEgJ4tfD_BwE

July 26, 2020, 08:36 PM	#12
44caliberkid Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2017 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,271	I also found Pyrodex to be more corrosive than real BP. Back in the early 2000's I used APP if I wanted to use a sub. Have used a little Triple 7 since then, but mostly stick with the real stuff. I used to take a quart jar with water and Simple Green to the cowboy shoots and drop my empty brass in there. When I got home I dumped them in the sink with dish soap and water and gave the inside of each case a swab with a 45 caliber brass brush. They don't polish up bright, but don't corrode either.