Fair price for a Walther PPK .32? Anyone?

45automan · January 16, 2001, 05:42 PM

Hey guys I came across a Walther PPK German made .32 cal.
Now it's a war production gun but not military issue. It seems to be in fair shape. Now he is asking $400 for it. I feel it's too high. The gun has some slight pitting on one side,they could be scratches too. The bluing is also pretty worn. I want the gun and it's been there for months,5 at least. This leads me to belive that others find the price too high also. Mechanicly it seems pretty tight and the bore is good. So guys what do I do? I have never seen another Walther,German made before or since. I tried to deal with him but he won't budge. Should I try again?
Thanks,45automan

Greg G · January 16, 2001, 05:53 PM

There are a lot of police trade-ins floating around. I saw several at a gunshow last weekend and seems like prices ranged from a little less than $300 upwards to close to $400. Some looked like they had been refinished and others had holster wear on them.

I'm not saying the one you are looking at is a police trade-in but they could drive prices down. These are German made PPK's.

45automan · January 16, 2001, 06:19 PM

Hi I think it is a PPk it is small enough where you can throw it in your pocket. It is not a TPH. I'am sure of that.
I have seen the Walther's that aim surplus has and it's not that big either. I'am confused here. Is there a Walther expert here on TFL?
Thanks,45automan

Trevor · January 16, 2001, 08:28 PM

I am not an expert, but I have been reading lately "The Walther Handgun Story : A Collector's and Shooter's Guide" by Gene, Jr. Gangarosa. This book, especially the section on the PPK, should be helpful. The price you are quoting sounds ballpark; it depends though on just what type of German WWII production the pistol is. Some are more valuable than others. The book can help you narrow it down.
Pre-war and WWII production is approx. 1931-45. Post-war production pistols were imported into the U.S. until the Control Act of 1968 prohibited their import.

Meanwhile, the Walther PP, the PPK's larger sibling, was imported into this country until 1999, the year Walther quit its production entirely. There are some German police surplus Walther PP pistols on sale now in the U.S. that are not bad. Meanwhile, American production of the PPK and PPK/S continues.

It is true the German PPK pistols have a very nice trigger. Whether you are looking for something to collect or shoot is your call. Personally, I would have an older German one restored as something to carry and shoot. I am sure the true collectors would be mortified at this idea.

If you spend $300 to $400 on the one you mention, you are probably doing well.

Greg G · January 16, 2001, 10:59 PM

Trevor you are right, the police trade-ins are the PP model. They look like they would make good shooters for not too much money.

James K · January 17, 2001, 12:30 AM

The police PP's now available for around $250 are post-war guns made in Ulm. Early post-war guns were made by Manurhin in France. Some of the police guns are very nice (I have seen absolutely new ones) but they are mainly shooters. The pre-war and wartime guns, made in Zella-Mehlis, Thuringia, are much more valuable as collectors items. A nice Z-M gun is worth more than $400; how much more depends on a lot of things besides condition, mostly markings. Beware, though, of going by book knowledge in this area, as there are a lot of faked markings.

Generally, the Polizei Pistole Kriminal (PPK) brings more than the Polizei Pistole (PP) mainly, I think, due to Bond, James Bond.

Jim

Rodger Parrish · January 17, 2001, 04:14 PM

Jim, I am far from being well versed on Walther firearms but I thought that the "K" in "PPK" stood for Kurz.
Just wondering.
--Rodger

hipwr40 · January 17, 2001, 06:35 PM

Rodger, I saw The History of the Gun last night on the History Channel and they did a story on the PP and PPK. The "K" in PPK is kriminal, not kurtz.

I hate watching tv specials like that, because then I want to go out and buy one. Of course, they followed up the Walther story with the Beretta 92f, then the Glock...which I just added to my collection last week (model 21).

glockjeeper · January 17, 2001, 07:30 PM

K does stand for Kriminal in PPK. Which was for detectives, whereas the PP would be used for uniformed officers. The K standing for Kurz (short, as in short PP) makes sense, but that is not the original meaning.

Rodger Parrish · January 18, 2001, 11:47 AM

The saying is true you really do learn something new everyday!

-Rodger

Strayhorn · January 18, 2001, 04:56 PM

Look at the left side of the slide - it'll say what the model is. If it is indeed a pre-war PPK, then $400 is a fair price. I saw one in a shop last year in about the same condition as you describe for $450, and worked for six months to talk the guy down to $400. I finally did it on the last day of the year by reminding the shop owner that if he didn't sell it, he'd just have to pay inventory tax on it. I took it home and it's been one of my two CCW pieces ever since.

The price of Walthers have been going up in recent months, so I say that $400 is fair to you and to him.

If you intend to carry it, the Fiocchi 65-gr SJHP and their 73-gr FMJ are hot little numbers which work fine in the PPK. Be sure you get the imported Fiocchi ammo.

Another note - the plastic grips are notorious for cracking. Check the grips on the gun offered for sale and if they are uncracked, you are a lucky man. If you do carry the pistol, buy a set of the wooden grips that Hogue offers. The screw hole is a bit off center for pre-war pistols (they fit post-war pistols just fine) but a few minutes with a Dremel tool fixes that. Be sure to check that the new grips don't rub the connecting piece that runs from the trigger to the sear, or you'll have a full-auto PPK. Very exciting, but it draws frowns from the range safety officer.

You might want to strip the slide and see if the hammer block is still in the frame. These were often lost by people stripping the slide who were unaware that the block just sits in a cavity on top of the frame. If it's gone, Earl's Service sells them for $40.

Wolff Gunsprings sells a service pack for pre-war Walthers for a mere $12. It's a good investment, and it's a fun pistol to take apart completely - just l ike a little Swiss watch!

Also check to see if the magazine is stamped with the serial number of the handgun. Pre-war Walthers came with two mags numbered to the gun. Finding both mags is pretty rare, but having at least one is nice. Mec-Gar is the current maker of magazines for Walther and is producing "legacy" mags for the PP series pistols, including the PPK. They run between $17 and $25.

It's a fine little pistol for concealed carry if you need to be really careful. It fits in most suit jacket pockets - I usually have my PPK in one pocket and my Motorola StarTac cell phone in the other, and neither "prints" the fabric. If the bore and mechanicals are in good shape they are surprisingly accurate for a pocket pistol.

Ken Strayhorn
Hillsborough NC

Jspy · January 18, 2001, 09:06 PM

I just noticed some of the PP's at my local shop for $279 in good shape. I am not that familiar with all the ins and outs but hope this helps.

7th Fleet · January 18, 2001, 09:48 PM

I saw Walther PP's in todays Shotgun News for $229.00 but that is without shipping, dealer markup and tax.

7th

cocojo · January 19, 2001, 03:23 PM

I much prefer the ppk in 32 auto than in 380. It has nothing to do with recoil it's in function. I own two walther ppk's one in 380 and the other 32 auto. Two thousand rounds through the 32 without one malfunction, it's just smoother in feeding and function. The 380 is a joke I have sent it back to factory twice with broken parts it just plain sucks. If anyone ever buys the ppk buy it in 32 auto you won't be sorry.

January 16, 2001, 05:42 PM	#1
45automan Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2000 Posts: 304	Hey guys I came across a Walther PPK German made .32 cal. Now it's a war production gun but not military issue. It seems to be in fair shape. Now he is asking $400 for it. I feel it's too high. The gun has some slight pitting on one side,they could be scratches too. The bluing is also pretty worn. I want the gun and it's been there for months,5 at least. This leads me to belive that others find the price too high also. Mechanicly it seems pretty tight and the bore is good. So guys what do I do? I have never seen another Walther,German made before or since. I tried to deal with him but he won't budge. Should I try again? Thanks,45automan

January 16, 2001, 05:53 PM	#2
Greg G Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Posts: 378	There are a lot of police trade-ins floating around. I saw several at a gunshow last weekend and seems like prices ranged from a little less than $300 upwards to close to $400. Some looked like they had been refinished and others had holster wear on them. I'm not saying the one you are looking at is a police trade-in but they could drive prices down. These are German made PPK's.

January 16, 2001, 06:19 PM	#3
45automan Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2000 Posts: 304	Hi I think it is a PPk it is small enough where you can throw it in your pocket. It is not a TPH. I'am sure of that. I have seen the Walther's that aim surplus has and it's not that big either. I'am confused here. Is there a Walther expert here on TFL? Thanks,45automan

January 16, 2001, 08:28 PM	#4
Trevor Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 1999 Posts: 386	I am not an expert, but I have been reading lately "The Walther Handgun Story : A Collector's and Shooter's Guide" by Gene, Jr. Gangarosa. This book, especially the section on the PPK, should be helpful. The price you are quoting sounds ballpark; it depends though on just what type of German WWII production the pistol is. Some are more valuable than others. The book can help you narrow it down. Pre-war and WWII production is approx. 1931-45. Post-war production pistols were imported into the U.S. until the Control Act of 1968 prohibited their import. Meanwhile, the Walther PP, the PPK's larger sibling, was imported into this country until 1999, the year Walther quit its production entirely. There are some German police surplus Walther PP pistols on sale now in the U.S. that are not bad. Meanwhile, American production of the PPK and PPK/S continues. It is true the German PPK pistols have a very nice trigger. Whether you are looking for something to collect or shoot is your call. Personally, I would have an older German one restored as something to carry and shoot. I am sure the true collectors would be mortified at this idea. If you spend $300 to $400 on the one you mention, you are probably doing well.

January 16, 2001, 10:59 PM	#5
Greg G Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Posts: 378	Trevor you are right, the police trade-ins are the PP model. They look like they would make good shooters for not too much money.

January 17, 2001, 12:30 AM	#6
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	The police PP's now available for around $250 are post-war guns made in Ulm. Early post-war guns were made by Manurhin in France. Some of the police guns are very nice (I have seen absolutely new ones) but they are mainly shooters. The pre-war and wartime guns, made in Zella-Mehlis, Thuringia, are much more valuable as collectors items. A nice Z-M gun is worth more than $400; how much more depends on a lot of things besides condition, mostly markings. Beware, though, of going by book knowledge in this area, as there are a lot of faked markings. Generally, the Polizei Pistole Kriminal (PPK) brings more than the Polizei Pistole (PP) mainly, I think, due to Bond, James Bond. Jim

January 17, 2001, 04:14 PM	#7
Rodger Parrish Member Join Date: October 3, 2000 Posts: 62	Jim, I am far from being well versed on Walther firearms but I thought that the "K" in "PPK" stood for Kurz. Just wondering. --Rodger

January 17, 2001, 06:35 PM	#8
hipwr40 Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2000 Posts: 149	Rodger, I saw The History of the Gun last night on the History Channel and they did a story on the PP and PPK. The "K" in PPK is kriminal, not kurtz. I hate watching tv specials like that, because then I want to go out and buy one. Of course, they followed up the Walther story with the Beretta 92f, then the Glock...which I just added to my collection last week (model 21).

January 17, 2001, 07:30 PM	#9
glockjeeper Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2000 Location: Ashland, KY Posts: 226	K does stand for Kriminal in PPK. Which was for detectives, whereas the PP would be used for uniformed officers. The K standing for Kurz (short, as in short PP) makes sense, but that is not the original meaning.

January 18, 2001, 11:47 AM	#10
Rodger Parrish Member Join Date: October 3, 2000 Posts: 62	The saying is true you really do learn something new everyday! -Rodger

January 18, 2001, 04:56 PM	#11
Strayhorn Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2000 Location: Central NC Posts: 339	Look at the left side of the slide - it'll say what the model is. If it is indeed a pre-war PPK, then $400 is a fair price. I saw one in a shop last year in about the same condition as you describe for $450, and worked for six months to talk the guy down to $400. I finally did it on the last day of the year by reminding the shop owner that if he didn't sell it, he'd just have to pay inventory tax on it. I took it home and it's been one of my two CCW pieces ever since. The price of Walthers have been going up in recent months, so I say that $400 is fair to you and to him. If you intend to carry it, the Fiocchi 65-gr SJHP and their 73-gr FMJ are hot little numbers which work fine in the PPK. Be sure you get the imported Fiocchi ammo. Another note - the plastic grips are notorious for cracking. Check the grips on the gun offered for sale and if they are uncracked, you are a lucky man. If you do carry the pistol, buy a set of the wooden grips that Hogue offers. The screw hole is a bit off center for pre-war pistols (they fit post-war pistols just fine) but a few minutes with a Dremel tool fixes that. Be sure to check that the new grips don't rub the connecting piece that runs from the trigger to the sear, or you'll have a full-auto PPK. Very exciting, but it draws frowns from the range safety officer. You might want to strip the slide and see if the hammer block is still in the frame. These were often lost by people stripping the slide who were unaware that the block just sits in a cavity on top of the frame. If it's gone, Earl's Service sells them for $40. Wolff Gunsprings sells a service pack for pre-war Walthers for a mere $12. It's a good investment, and it's a fun pistol to take apart completely - just l ike a little Swiss watch! Also check to see if the magazine is stamped with the serial number of the handgun. Pre-war Walthers came with two mags numbered to the gun. Finding both mags is pretty rare, but having at least one is nice. Mec-Gar is the current maker of magazines for Walther and is producing "legacy" mags for the PP series pistols, including the PPK. They run between $17 and $25. It's a fine little pistol for concealed carry if you need to be really careful. It fits in most suit jacket pockets - I usually have my PPK in one pocket and my Motorola StarTac cell phone in the other, and neither "prints" the fabric. If the bore and mechanicals are in good shape they are surprisingly accurate for a pocket pistol. Ken Strayhorn Hillsborough NC

January 18, 2001, 09:06 PM	#12
Jspy Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2000 Posts: 214	I just noticed some of the PP's at my local shop for $279 in good shape. I am not that familiar with all the ins and outs but hope this helps.

January 18, 2001, 09:48 PM	#13
7th Fleet Senior Member Join Date: January 28, 2000 Posts: 1,469	I saw Walther PP's in todays Shotgun News for $229.00 but that is without shipping, dealer markup and tax. 7th

January 19, 2001, 03:23 PM	#14
cocojo Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2000 Location: Hooksett,NH Posts: 520	I much prefer the ppk in 32 auto than in 380. It has nothing to do with recoil it's in function. I own two walther ppk's one in 380 and the other 32 auto. Two thousand rounds through the 32 without one malfunction, it's just smoother in feeding and function. The 380 is a joke I have sent it back to factory twice with broken parts it just plain sucks. If anyone ever buys the ppk buy it in 32 auto you won't be sorry.