The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Revolver Forum

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old February 24, 2013, 03:59 PM   #1
Junior member
Join Date: October 9, 2009
Posts: 125
Webley 45 ACP rim..loads?

Im writing this only to get a confirmation from someone with experience with the Mark 6 Webley .455 (converted to American 45 ACP)

From what I gather, I can load 180-230gr lead (reduced charge) loads in a 45 ACP casing. Now do I also need the casings clipped with (half/full moon clips) before firing the modified cylinder?

The alternative seems to be to buy and use 45 auto rim casings with the same load. Because theyre rimmed, can they be used w/o the clips?
A concern here is rim thickness.

Anyone willing to do a trade for 45 auto rim will be appreciated.
I have 30-06, 308 and 45 ACP brass to offer.
Ervin is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 04:04 PM   #2
Senior Member
Join Date: May 3, 2009
Location: Nebraska Panhandle
Posts: 3,825
You can shoot without moon clips, though you will need somehting to remove the cases from the cylinder with. Due to the fact that there are no rims there is nothing for the extractor to grab. I have seen a guy shooting one without moon clips. He used a ball point pen body to remove the cases with. It was a slow process for him. He was testing the gun while waiting on clips that he had ordered.
No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.
m&p45acp10+1 is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 05:05 PM   #3
Senior Member
Join Date: November 23, 2009
Posts: 3,963
You do need the clips for convenience. Let me know if you can't find any.
kilimanjaro is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 05:28 PM   #4
Mike Irwin
Join Date: April 13, 2000
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 40,094
Actually, it depends on how the cylinder has been altered.

Some "conversions" simply reamed the chambers so that the .45 ACP would headspace at the correct point and allow the action to close. Ejection of fired cases would have to be done with a stick, unless the chamber mouths were altered so that a .45 Auto Rim case could be loaded.

Other "conversions" shaved the cylinder on a lathe so that half moon clipped rounds could be used.

Just depends on who did it when.
"The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza

Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.
Mike Irwin is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 06:44 PM   #5
Bob Wright
Senior Member
Join Date: July 10, 2012
Location: Memphis, Tennessee
Posts: 2,796
The "moon" or "half moon" clips are primarily for extraction. Since the .45 Auto Rim case is rimmed, no clips are necessary when using these in a revovler.

Bob Wright
Bob Wright is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 07:24 PM   #6
Senior Member
Join Date: July 20, 2009
Location: PA
Posts: 1,369
I use the same Rim-Z plastic moon clips in my Colt and S&W 1917s, and my shaved Webley MkVI. I also use the same target load, 200gr. LSWC with a light-ish load of Bullseye. I usually use .45ACP cases, but I have a hundred or so Auto-Rim cases that I load the same, just for an occasional change of pace.
2016 PA Cartridge Collector Show!!!
Buy...Sell...Trade All Types of Ammunition & Ordnance
jonnyc is offline  
Old February 24, 2013, 08:38 PM   #7
Senior Member
Join Date: January 27, 2010
Location: AR
Posts: 1,395
45 AR is the way to go. I think some of the ammo manufacturers still make these cases, but they make them in small batches once every year or two.
chiefr is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 01:50 AM   #8
Senior Member
Join Date: June 24, 2008
Posts: 2,227
Remington and Starline have 45AR brass. Midway has Remington in stock:

Be sure to use reduced loads with lead, preferably swaged lead, bullets.
natman is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 03:26 AM   #9
44 AMP
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 18,938
My Webley Mk VI has been "shaved" and works only with S&W half moon clips. AR brass has too thick a rim to work in my gun. Full moon clips I have tried are also too thick for my gun. My gun will still fire .455 ammo, but ignition is undependable.

Cast bullets are ok, but hard cast are not needed. The loads you should use are in the 600-700fps range, depending on bullet weight. The Webley is sighted for a 265gr bullet, so expect a differnt point of impact with lighter slugs.

Standard GI ball level .45acp loads are a proof level load for the old Webley, do not use them.

Check the cylinder on your gun. There are numbers around the back edge. If these numbers have their bottoms cut off, your gun has been converted to use .45acp BRASS, and Auto Rim brass might work. IF only the very bottom of the numbers is gone, AR brass might be too thick. If about the bottom 1/4 of the numbers is gone, AR brass should work.
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.
44 AMP is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 01:52 PM   #10
Senior Member
Join Date: March 1, 2000
Location: Western WA
Posts: 7,729
I might suggest loading the biggest ".45" bullets that you can find. I have a S&W Hand Ejector Mk. II that was converted to .45 ACP via a new cylinder, but the bore is still way oversized for any bullets that will be found loaded in ACP cases.
I've handloaded .454" bullets with some success, but even those are undersized, and I don't know that bullets of any larger diameter will fit in the cylinder; that shouldn't be a problem for a gun originally chambered for larger bullets.
RickB is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 03:26 PM   #11
Senior Member
Join Date: July 20, 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 10,184
For handloading in a .455 Webley ("shaved" or not) the Remington 250gr LRN would seem like a good bullet to use. This is fairly close to the original weight so it should shoot reasonably close to the sights, it's a .455 diameter which is correct for .455 Webley Mk. II ammunition, and it also has a concave base that will likely obturate to the bore.
Smith, and Wesson, and Me. -H. Callahan
Well waddaya know, one buwwet weft! -E. Fudd
All bad precedents begin as justifiable measures. -J. Caesar
Webleymkv is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 07:56 PM   #12
James K
Senior Member
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 24,383
"You can shoot without moon clips, though you will need somehting to remove the cases from the cylinder..."

Nope. That Webley is not an S&W or Colt 1917. It was made for .455 and does NOT have shoulders in the chamber to support a .45 ACP on the case mouth. The .45 ACP round will drop down into the cylinder too far to fire. You have no choice execept to use the .45 ACP with the old type thin steel clips or .45 Auto Rim.

I concur completely with using a much reduced load in that old Webley. Those guns were designed for a pressure around 12k psi, not the 21k of the standard .45 ACP load. Some have blown up with GI .45 ammo.

Jim K
James K is offline  
Old February 25, 2013, 08:18 PM   #13
Senior Member
Join Date: May 27, 2007
Posts: 5,261
Try 45 Auto Rim cases. I would also recommend never ever fire 45 ACP level loads in a Webley. Download, download a lot. It does not take much to bend the topstrap of a Webley, these are very weak actions.

I used the largest lead bullets I could buy, 454", they shot OK, the rechambering job was poorly done, and I used a light load of Bullseye.

45 Auto Rim

455 Webley MkVI rechambered 45ACP
manufactured Enfield 1923

255 LSWC (.454) 3.5 grs Bullseye thrown, R-P AR cases, CCI300 primers

Ave Vel = 541
Std Dev = 10
ES = 42.44
Low = 522
High = 565
N = 24
Shot to point of aim 25.0 yards
If I'm not shooting, I'm reloading.
Slamfire is offline  
Old February 27, 2013, 04:40 PM   #14
Junior member
Join Date: October 9, 2009
Posts: 125
I'm stocked up on .452 230gr RN lead bullets for 45 ACP.
Can I safely use 230grs with a 3gr charge of W231 and still be in the safe Webley pressure range?
Ervin is offline  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:32 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent:
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.07102 seconds with 7 queries