Brass ID

olddav · February 1, 2010, 06:02 PM

I have some 30 cal brass (for a M1 Carbine) that has the following markings on the bottom: "L C 54". My question is, how do i tell if its of military or civilian origian, and does it even matter?

jepp2 · February 1, 2010, 06:15 PM

Probably, Lake City, 1954 military brass.

A very good link to check headstamps:

http://www.afte.org/ExamResources/ga...Letters_001/L/

Not sure on the 30 carbine, but military brass is normally thicker which means you need to reduce your starting charge (results in higher pressure due to lower internal volume). 10% is the normal suggested starting reduction.

It may have crimped primers, and if so you need to remove the crimp prior to priming. The crimp can also make initial depriming more difficult.

olddav · February 1, 2010, 08:43 PM

Thanks for the info, once again ya'll have come through.
By the way, what is it worth (high-low). If its not too much trouble.

jepp2 · February 1, 2010, 09:15 PM

Looks like some similar brass sold on GunBroker for about $0.12 per round - $61 for 500 once fired mixed brass.

olddav · February 1, 2010, 09:46 PM

jepp2,
thanks again for your help.
Man oh man is this place a wealth of info or what.

medalguy · February 2, 2010, 12:32 AM

The carbine brass is not crimped primers, I don't believe any carbine brass was crimped, so that's one less worry.

And remember, military or not, ALWAYS start with a lower load and work up!

Sevens · February 2, 2010, 10:40 AM

I disagree... I've got a pretty good handful of old 50's LC military .30 Carbine brass and they've got a crimp in them. Easy to decap, no trouble at all, but I have to give 'em a couple twists with the chamfer tool to remove enough ring if I want to prime the cases. Otherwise, the primers simply crush when I try to seat them.

It's not a big deal, but the LC brass I have is indeed crimped.

closetgunnut · February 3, 2010, 10:20 AM

Some 30 Carbine cases DO have a crimp as Sevens said. I have some mixed cases than I got in a trade and some have a crimp but most don't.

Since a picture is worth a 1000 words, here you go......

Closet

Sevens · February 3, 2010, 10:28 AM

Yep, that's what I'm looking at, too.
It's kind of a "slight" crimp, as in, if you happen to have primers on hand that are slimmer than others... and you happen to have your priming tool lined up PERFECTLY, and you use a smooth, even motion, you might even seat those primers without issue.

But if something in the equation isn't perfect and you ham-fist it, you'll either crush that primer so that it all shredded to hell and needs to be removed, or you'll simply EXPLODE it in the press. And if you are loading on a progressive machine, all the more chance that with so many other operations being performed, you won't feel the resistance that alerts you to a problem.

Strazznah · February 3, 2010, 10:43 AM

Not sure if it will work on .30 carbine, but I use a Dillon 600 Super Swage to remove military crimps on 7.62 NATO.....

olddav · February 3, 2010, 01:33 PM

I guess that I'll have to pay attention while I inspect the casings.

omeratwood · February 3, 2010, 11:15 PM

Yea, the Lake City brass is thicker, and I cannot get 16 gn. of IMR 3031 to fit into the military brass. Thicker case wall means less volume, so with the same load as commercial brass, you get higher pressure / faster muzzle speed and your groups will be higher.

I got the best results with IMR 4227 with 15 gn. into Lake City trimmed to 1.290"

110 Gn. RN .308" DIA. 18" BBL. 1.680 C.O.L. Rem. 6½ Pr.
IMR 4227 15.0gn. 2100fps.

Also 16gn. 4227 primed with Wolf SR set at 1.655 gets close to 2300 fps. wth Horady 110gn. Round nose FB FMJ.

February 1, 2010, 06:02 PM	#1
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	Brass ID I have some 30 cal brass (for a M1 Carbine) that has the following markings on the bottom: "L C 54". My question is, how do i tell if its of military or civilian origian, and does it even matter?

February 1, 2010, 06:15 PM	#2
jepp2 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,476	Probably, Lake City, 1954 military brass. A very good link to check headstamps: http://www.afte.org/ExamResources/ga...Letters_001/L/ Not sure on the 30 carbine, but military brass is normally thicker which means you need to reduce your starting charge (results in higher pressure due to lower internal volume). 10% is the normal suggested starting reduction. It may have crimped primers, and if so you need to remove the crimp prior to priming. The crimp can also make initial depriming more difficult. Last edited by jepp2; February 1, 2010 at 06:16 PM. Reason: clarification

February 2, 2010, 10:40 AM	#7
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,775	I disagree... I've got a pretty good handful of old 50's LC military .30 Carbine brass and they've got a crimp in them. Easy to decap, no trouble at all, but I have to give 'em a couple twists with the chamfer tool to remove enough ring if I want to prime the cases. Otherwise, the primers simply crush when I try to seat them. It's not a big deal, but the LC brass I have is indeed crimped. __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

February 3, 2010, 10:28 AM	#9
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,775	Yep, that's what I'm looking at, too. It's kind of a "slight" crimp, as in, if you happen to have primers on hand that are slimmer than others... and you happen to have your priming tool lined up PERFECTLY, and you use a smooth, even motion, you might even seat those primers without issue. But if something in the equation isn't perfect and you ham-fist it, you'll either crush that primer so that it all shredded to hell and needs to be removed, or you'll simply EXPLODE it in the press. And if you are loading on a progressive machine, all the more chance that with so many other operations being performed, you won't feel the resistance that alerts you to a problem. __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

February 3, 2010, 11:15 PM	#12
omeratwood Member Join Date: January 5, 2010 Location: Summerfield, Florida Posts: 23	.30 carbine brass Yea, the Lake City brass is thicker, and I cannot get 16 gn. of IMR 3031 to fit into the military brass. Thicker case wall means less volume, so with the same load as commercial brass, you get higher pressure / faster muzzle speed and your groups will be higher. I got the best results with IMR 4227 with 15 gn. into Lake City trimmed to 1.290" 110 Gn. RN .308" DIA. 18" BBL. 1.680 C.O.L. Rem. 6½ Pr. IMR 4227 15.0gn. 2100fps. Also 16gn. 4227 primed with Wolf SR set at 1.655 gets close to 2300 fps. wth Horady 110gn. Round nose FB FMJ.

February 1, 2010, 08:43 PM	#3
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	Thanks for the info, once again ya'll have come through. By the way, what is it worth (high-low). If its not too much trouble.

February 1, 2010, 09:15 PM	#4
jepp2 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,476	Looks like some similar brass sold on GunBroker for about $0.12 per round - $61 for 500 once fired mixed brass.

February 1, 2010, 09:46 PM	#5
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	jepp2, thanks again for your help. Man oh man is this place a wealth of info or what.

February 2, 2010, 12:32 AM	#6
medalguy Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,033	The carbine brass is not crimped primers, I don't believe any carbine brass was crimped, so that's one less worry. And remember, military or not, ALWAYS start with a lower load and work up!

February 3, 2010, 10:20 AM	#8
closetgunnut Member Join Date: January 17, 2008 Location: Western Pa. Posts: 83	Some 30 Carbine cases DO have a crimp as Sevens said. I have some mixed cases than I got in a trade and some have a crimp but most don't. Since a picture is worth a 1000 words, here you go...... Closet

February 3, 2010, 10:43 AM	#10
Strazznah Member Join Date: January 12, 2009 Location: O'Fallon, MO Posts: 47	Not sure if it will work on .30 carbine, but I use a Dillon 600 Super Swage to remove military crimps on 7.62 NATO.....

February 3, 2010, 01:33 PM	#11
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	I guess that I'll have to pay attention while I inspect the casings.