Considering bullet weight change in 223.

[Shadow9mm]

So I feel like I am really over thinking this. I started out with 55g bullets, the Hornady bulk FMJ as they seemed to be the most common weight, most available, and cheapest at the time. Both in bullets for reloading and loaded ammo.

I am currently at the point where I need to, and seem to be able to replenish my supplies.

Looking at 3 bullets, the 55g and 62g Hornady bulk FMJ, and the 75g Hornady match bullets.

The 62g bullets have a better bc of .274 vs .243 of the 55s. they cost $8 more per 1000, however they save enough powder due to the lighter charges to balance the cost out and possibly save a few dollars.

The 75s have a great BC of .395, but cost about $102 more per 1,000, a little less than double the 55/62s, and as I am using a slower powder there is no real savings in powder.

So I guess my options are these
stick with 55s and keep the 75s for occasional fun
change to 62s and keep the 75s for occasional fun
go all in in the 75s and deal with the price increase, possibly shoot a little less.

Estimated costs
55s, $339.99 per 1,000
62s, $337.72 per 1,000 (0.7% savings over the 55s)
75s, $439.99 per 1,000 (29% more than the 55s)

Running a 16in 1:7 and 1:8 twist. I am regularly able to shoot 100yds, and am able to get out to a 500yd range a few times a year. Primary use is recreational target shooting and training for backup defensive use.

[kilotanker22]

I generally go for the mid-heavy weight bullets in any cartridge. 5.56/223 is no different, i shoot the 62 grain bullets for that cartridge.

The 75 grain Hornady is a great bullet too. I use the 75 grain BTHP for bolt guns, and the 62 grain for my AR rifles. If you want my honest opinion, I would use both the 62 and 75 grain as I do now.

If your goal however is to have something that works all the time at the lowest cost possible (no shame in that), then the 55 grain fmj bullets will always be cheaper and more available.

I consider this dilemma to be a good thing. There have been times when we had almost no options at all. If you want to save money, as you pointed out, the 62 grain are still cheap and use less powder.

The reason I shoot the 62 grain in my AR style rifles is because I try to duplicate the M855 round. I figure the purpose of my AR rifles is recreation and SHTF/WROL roles. For that reason I try to conform my ammunition to that which the armies of the world would likely be carrying, or what is likely to be the only thing available by any means at some point.

[jetinteriorguy]

I’ve pretty much switched to 62gr bullets. I do have a lot of 55gr bullets that work just fine, but for longer distances I’ve had better performance from the 62gr bullets. Like you say, cost wise it’s pretty much a wash. That being said, for best accuracy in my main target AR I get the best grouping from 68gr match grade BTHP bullets.

[GeauxTide]

My 9" twist will not spin a 75.

[lugerstew]

My favorite bullet for that twist rate is Sierra 77g hpbt, they are fairly reasonable cost for box of 500, and they are very accurate.
Any twist slower than 1-8 probably won't stabilize.
I have tried Hornady generic 55g fmj bullets, they are cheap, but I never get good groups from them.

[stagpanther]

Depends on your type of weapon--if an AR then you'll be limited on your COL--but if you're shooting bolt action and your magazine allows more than 2.26-- I wouldn't hesitate to push the 75 grs seated long--even if an AR you'll be fine up to 69 gr. no problem with your twists.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Depends on your type of weapon--if an AR then you'll be limited on your COL--but if you're shooting bolt action and your magazine allows more than 2.26-- I wouldn't hesitate to push the 75 grs seated long--even if an AR you'll be fine up to 69 gr. no problem with your twists.

Yes, ar platform.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by lugerstew

My favorite bullet for that twist rate is Sierra 77g hpbt, they are fairly reasonable cost for box of 500, and they are very accurate.
Any twist slower than 1-8 probably won't stabilize.
I have tried Hornady generic 55g fmj bullets, they are cheap, but I never get good groups from them.

I played with the 77s but they are running $403.98 pet 1000 vs the hornadys at 224.99 per 1000. I just cant jusify the sierras

[stagpanther]

The 75 gr edl's shoot great in valkyrie and 22 nosler--but I think you'll run into trouble with cartridge OL of 2.26 in an AR; however the 75 gr BTHP's should fit in an AR. I know it's not on your list--but for over-all performance in 5.56 I'd be looking at 69 grs.

[BobCat45]

Midsouth has 77 grain Sierra Matchkings for $145/500 - claims to be "in stock" - as of right now.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...king-500-count

Nobody seems to have 80 grain SMKs but who knows what tomorrow might bring?

[HiBC]

Another possibility would be the 69 gr bullets from Sierra or Nosler if you want match type HPBT's With these,I like Varget. A 1 in 9 twist works fine.
The 75 gr Hornady HPBT match bullet works fine loaded to AR mag length
Note the 75 gr AMAX does NOT work at magazine length. You will be pushing ogive into the neck.
My #1 choice for this bullet is RE-15. My barrel is 1 in 8

For either the 69 or 75, H4895 can be used.

[Shadow9mm]

Cant get varget or 4895. Looked at re-15 but im waitng for re-15.5 to come in stock in my area. Picked up 1lb of TAC to play with.

Currently using bl-c(2), getting 2652fps just below max sd10.19 es35 out of my 16in barrel. I was hoping for 2700p, and got it at max but the sd was 36.22 with an es of 117. Backed off 0.8 and things smoothed out. Also got ejector swipes at max and 0.2 below, so i needed to back off.

[Shadow9mm]

Guess i just figured if i was gonna go heavy i would go heavy since i have enough twist to stabilize them. I tried the 68-69s a few years back and didnt have good luck, but i have learned some better techniques that might help them perform better. Just dont knowvif its worth trying more bullets when the 75s are working well so far.

Price for the hornadys is about identical. But bc is better with the 75s at .395, vs .355 for the 68s.

[44 AMP]

If you can afford to plink with match grade (and cost) bullets, you're doing better than I am.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

If you can afford to plink with match grade (and cost) bullets, you're doing better than I am.

I generally run 60-100rnds a month, some drills and precision work. When im talking 339 to 439 for 1000 its not a huge difference but its a difference. But i could buy almost another 1000 bullk bulkets for the $100 difference. But for a year of shooting its not a huge ammount more.

[totaldla]

Originally Posted by Shadow9mm

So I feel like I am really over thinking this. I started out with 55g bullets, the Hornady bulk FMJ as they seemed to be the most common weight, most available, and cheapest at the time. Both in bullets for reloading and loaded ammo.

I am currently at the point where I need to, and seem to be able to replenish my supplies.

Looking at 3 bullets, the 55g and 62g Hornady bulk FMJ, and the 75g Hornady match bullets.

The 62g bullets have a better bc of .274 vs .243 of the 55s. they cost $8 more per 1000, however they save enough powder due to the lighter charges to balance the cost out and possibly save a few dollars.

The 75s have a great BC of .395, but cost about $102 more per 1,000, a little less than double the 55/62s, and as I am using a slower powder there is no real savings in powder.

So I guess my options are these
stick with 55s and keep the 75s for occasional fun
change to 62s and keep the 75s for occasional fun
go all in in the 75s and deal with the price increase, possibly shoot a little less.

Estimated costs
55s, $339.99 per 1,000
62s, $337.72 per 1,000 (0.7% savings over the 55s)
75s, $439.99 per 1,000 (29% more than the 55s)

Running a 16in 1:7 and 1:8 twist. I am regularly able to shoot 100yds, and am able to get out to a 500yd range a few times a year. Primary use is recreational target shooting and training for backup defensive use.

Unless you specifically set up for it, the higher BC will do absolutely nothing for you. I'm old school and as such I firmly believe that learning to shoot is much more important than adherence to the wannabe sniper narrative popular today.

So save the $ so you can shoot more.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by totaldla

Unless you specifically set up for it, the higher BC will do absolutely nothing for you. I'm old school and as such I firmly believe that learning to shoot is much more important than adherence to the wannabe sniper narrative popular today.

So save the $ so you can shoot more.

I know how to shoot, and i enjoy making small groups at longer distances(for the cartridge) but my main focus is training and drills in the 25 to 75yd range and maintaining my skills. And i would tune the 75s to my gun. Along with drop tables

With thats ssid 55 and 62 are neck and neck price wise. And doing 55/62 would let me shoot roughly 300 extra rounds a year for the price of the 75s.

[HiBC]

For what you describe (mostly range work inside 100 yds) the low cost of 55 gr Hornady military type bullets might win out. For those,a powder that is not wrong is H335.
Sadly,the owners of the ranch I had access to have passed on,but most of my AR shooting was breezy North Colorado (just south of Wyo) at longer ranges.
In my case,the 75s have advantage.

[Shadow9mm]

so I ran a few more numbers for consideration.

max range before going trans sonic/subsonic
55 600yds
62 650yds
75 850yds

Drop between the 3 at 600yds was only about a 24in difference best to worst with the 55 being worst and the 75yd being best. nothing I can't hold over in my optic.

energy retained at 600yds (max range for the 55s to compare evenly) thinking ringing steel and hitting it hard enough to be able to hear/see it. I have seen videos with 223 guns at 500 and the hits on the steel are hard to hear and barely move the plate.
55g 164ft lb
62g 217ft lb
75g 372 ft lb

Also, so thinking about this more. I generally shoot 720-1200rnds per year of 223, give or take a little.

If I load up 1200 its a difference of right around $122 for the year between the 62s (cheapest) and the 75. $122 a year is not a huge difference. However spending that $122 towards the less expensive ammo would net me an extra 292rnds of 62s for the same price. or about an extra 25rnds per month if I wanted it. but Most likely I would keep shooting 60-100 per month.

[Metal god]

AR platform I mostly shoot 55's and 69's , 55gr's are Hornady and Winchester with Win being more accurate . Sierra match kings for the 69gr bullets . I have and do shoot 77's but not a lot . I like the 77's best but they are/were spendy and I always seemed to be able to find better deals on the 69's so I settle in there over time .

I voted stay with the 55's but that's only to "stay" with that weight . If you have load work-ups for the 62's and the only issue is choosing one , then do just that . I often don't change bullets because what I have works for my needs and over the years I've started disliking load development . There was a 5-ish year period where if I was shooting it was most likely 90% load development and that got old because I wasn't having fun . I enjoyed it but it was more work then fun and I wanted to get back to having fun at the range .

Point being if you don't already have loads using the 62's , I would not switch . To much wasted time at the range trying to get back to where you already were .

FWIW , I've tried the 68's and 75's and although OK , It's was always easier to get the Seirra bullets to shoot better faster with less development . I'm sure you all are starting to see a pattern here haha , less work more fun .

I'm looking forward to my new 308 barrel that should be coming in June but not looking forward to the load development because I'll be using bullets I don't typically use which means more testing then I like .

[Shadow9mm]

Yeah, i feel like the last year or so most of what i have been doing is load development. But i have done a lot of learning, really upped my game, and enjoyed it. But im definitely starting to feel ready to be done working up loads, and do more shooting.

I have 55s worked up, but i need to tweak my load based on the new techniques i learned, but i can do that in 1 range trip. 75s need 1 more range trip to be done. I also ordered some 62s to play with, just 100. I should be able to work a load up and test with 100.

Part if it, is i want to select something good, and be done with working up. But i dont want to just grab something and be second guessing or regretting my choice the next couple years.

[totaldla]

Originally Posted by Shadow9mm

I know how to shoot, and i enjoy making small groups at longer distances(for the cartridge) but my main focus is training and drills in the 25 to 75yd range and maintaining my skills. And i would tune the 75s to my gun. Along with drop tables

With thats ssid 55 and 62 are neck and neck price wise. And doing 55/62 would let me shoot roughly 300 extra rounds a year for the price of the 75s.

Thanks for making my point. It is popular nowadays to think shooting is sitting at a bench, sandbagged up and putting little holes in distant targets. And that is one tiny part of "shooting".

But there is more, much more to shooting. For example, I watched a YT video of Jerry M shoot multiple steel targets, at 400yds, against a timer, offhand. That is some kind of shooting for a 63yr old.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by totaldla

Thanks for making my point. It is popular nowadays to think shooting is sitting at a bench, sandbagged up and putting little holes in distant targets. And that is one tiny part of "shooting".

But there is more, much more to shooting. For example, I watched a YT video of Jerry M shoot multiple steel targets, at 400yds, against a timer, offhand. That is some kind of shooting for a 63yr old.

You only make your point if you take my words out of context. Read what i wrote. There are many disciplines in shooting, such as benchrest, bullseye, 3 gun, and many more. Some of which are entirely focused on shooting small groups from benches. Some of which is focused on speed and target engagement.

I do enjoy shooting small groups at distance. I feel that it helps me focus on my technique and fundamentals because small mistakes translate to bigger groups.

But as i said, my main focus is on practical drills. I try and work off of whatever shooting positions are in my environment, as well as unsupported and ones i am not familiar and or comfortable with.

Jerry is an amazing shooter and so is his daughter. I use 2 of her practical low round cound drills regularly and highly reccomended both.

Lena Miculec's drills

Rifle, 60rnds
https://youtu.be/A8NkLvJff2w

Pistol, 50rnds
https://youtu.be/F8MvKIiXC2M

[totaldla]

So Jerry, the amazing shooter, uses 55gr for his 400yd offhand shooting. Why then do you worry about BC for your 75yd drills? I'm not understanding.

[tangolima]

55gr bullet hitting a steel target doesn't make loud enough "ding!" sound, and it took me a while to learn to pick it up 100yd away. Can't tell for sure by looking at the target as it barely swings. Heavier bullets work better in that regard as it has more energy.

However, anything other than 55gr costs significantly more, heavier or lighter. I stay with 55gr and save the other bullets for special occasions, unless I come across better prices.

55gr costs slightly more than $0.1 a round. 62gr is close to $0.2.

-TL

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