10mm Power Pistol vs. W231

Tex S · November 5, 2017, 11:03 PM

Anybody have any experience using these powders in the 10mm?

I have a box of Berry's plated 180gr flat point plated bullets I want to load.

I have a ton of 231 but I feel like it may not be as accurate in 10mm when compared to PP.

I'm shooting a commander size Dan Wesson 1911. The recoil spring is stiff and I want the slide to lock back on an empty mag, but I'm not looking for a full powerhouse load... just something that will be accurate and make the gun run.

Any advice? Which one would be the cleaner of the two?

Tex S · November 5, 2017, 11:12 PM

I just found 1lb of VV N105 too...

Astocks2622 · November 5, 2017, 11:35 PM

I use 5 gr W231 in my accuracy loads, but they are bunny fart loads, doing right around 700 with a plated 180gr. I haven't tried to ramp that powder up to normal 10mm power levels, but I have found it to be VERY accurate for me. I am able to just about keep up with the other guys shooting 5-6" barreled 22 autos in informal plinking matches. I'm shooting a Tanfoglio Stock 1, and run a 9 lbs spring for all but my hot loads where I bump up to an 18 lb.
I found Power Pistol to be flashy and snappy when compared to my other mid range loads using AA #7. I didn't notice an accuracy advantage to PP over anything else, but I'm shooting an entirely different platform

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Nick_C_S · November 6, 2017, 05:21 PM

I lean toward fast powders as much as any loader I know. But W231 is awfully spunky for 10mm Auto.

I have loaded 180gn (X-treme plated) 10mm with AA#2, and it's in the same speed range as W231. But I kept them to very tame rounds - just strong enough to cycle the action, and for me to get used to shooting my compact G29 (890 f/s, G29; 904 f/s, G20). My basic range ammo for 10mm 180g is with AA#5 - which is considerably slower than W231. And my AA#5 rounds aren't very strong (1019 f/s, G29; 1039 f/s G20).

Overall, I don't recommend using W231 for 10mm. It can be done, but your charge weight margin of error is going to be small. And performance (velocity) won't be much without sending pressures skyward.

If you really want to use W231 for 10mm Auto, at least consider moving to a lighter bullet - that'll buy you some forgiveness.

Power Pistol is a much better choice. It'll make great ammo for your 10mm. But it'll still come up short of max velocity. You'll need to go with something even slower for that.

mikejonestkd · November 6, 2017, 06:01 PM

I use both win 231 and power pistol in 10mm under berry's 180 grain plated bullets.

231 seems to work well for light plinking loads around 5.6 grains.
I run 7.9 grains of power pistol under 180 gr berrys, and that is a healthy load, but not max.

AA5 or AA7 work better on the top end for 10mm and 180 grain bullets, IMO

brasscollector · November 6, 2017, 07:49 PM

W231 will work but as stated above it is not ideal for pretty much any 10mm load. I experimented with PP and 180s in my 10mms. I found that once I tried to go any hotter than a warmed up 40 load my SD went through the roof and it showed on paper too.

Tex S · November 6, 2017, 08:50 PM

Quote:

231 seems to work well for light plinking loads around 5.6 grains.

What gun were you using? 6.2gr of 231 would not lock the slide back on my Dan Wesson commander size 1911. Well, I say that, but it would lock back about half the time. Definitely not enough to make the gun run right.

**Unclenick** · November 6, 2017, 10:14 PM

If you want to shoot light practice loads in a 1911, pop a lighter recoil spring in the gun. You can get 1911 springs at just about any weight. I've had good luck with Sprinco's offerings. 12-14 lbs are most common for match ammunition. 16 lb is the standard .45 Auto spring for hardball. You'll put a lot less wear on the gun where the link lugs meet the assembly pin with that lighter spring not slamming the slide home as hard.

Tex S · November 6, 2017, 10:42 PM

Quote:

12-14 lbs are most common for match ammunition. 16 lb is the standard .45 Auto spring for hardball.

Knowing this, what do you recommend for a commander size 1911 in 10mm? Im pretty sure the factory weight is 22lbs and that sucker is stiff.

CowTowner · November 7, 2017, 08:16 AM

Quote:

If you want to shoot light practice loads in a 1911, pop a lighter recoil spring in the gun. You can get 1911 springs at just about any weight.

Unclenick nailed it. I shoot plated bullets from my 10mm's but I drop them down to plinker power with 231 and use lighter springs.

Change the recoil spring to 14 pounds and test. Depending on the load, that should do it for you.

**Unclenick** · November 7, 2017, 11:57 AM

Tex S,

You may want to get a 20 lb, 18 lb, and a 16 lb spring to try with the reduced 10 mm loads. If I had to pick just one, I'd get a 16 lb spring and run the loads up from about 5 grains of 231 until it functioned. That would give me a target load, to be sure.

Tex S · November 7, 2017, 09:13 PM

Thanks for the replies. Anybody tried N105?

November 5, 2017, 11:03 PM	#1
Tex S Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2008 Location: Fort Worth, TEXAS Posts: 909	10mm Power Pistol vs. W231 Anybody have any experience using these powders in the 10mm? I have a box of Berry's plated 180gr flat point plated bullets I want to load. I have a ton of 231 but I feel like it may not be as accurate in 10mm when compared to PP. I'm shooting a commander size Dan Wesson 1911. The recoil spring is stiff and I want the slide to lock back on an empty mag, but I'm not looking for a full powerhouse load... just something that will be accurate and make the gun run. Any advice? Which one would be the cleaner of the two? Last edited by Tex S; November 6, 2017 at 08:51 PM. Reason: sp

November 6, 2017, 05:21 PM	#4
Nick_C_S Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2013 Location: Idaho Posts: 5,541	I lean toward fast powders as much as any loader I know. But W231 is awfully spunky for 10mm Auto. I have loaded 180gn (X-treme plated) 10mm with AA#2, and it's in the same speed range as W231. But I kept them to very tame rounds - just strong enough to cycle the action, and for me to get used to shooting my compact G29 (890 f/s, G29; 904 f/s, G20). My basic range ammo for 10mm 180g is with AA#5 - which is considerably slower than W231. And my AA#5 rounds aren't very strong (1019 f/s, G29; 1039 f/s G20). Overall, I don't recommend using W231 for 10mm. It can be done, but your charge weight margin of error is going to be small. And performance (velocity) won't be much without sending pressures skyward. If you really want to use W231 for 10mm Auto, at least consider moving to a lighter bullet - that'll buy you some forgiveness. Power Pistol is a much better choice. It'll make great ammo for your 10mm. But it'll still come up short of max velocity. You'll need to go with something even slower for that. __________________ Gun control laws benefit only criminals and politicians - but then, I repeat myself. Life Member, National Rifle Association

November 6, 2017, 10:14 PM	#8
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,131	If you want to shoot light practice loads in a 1911, pop a lighter recoil spring in the gun. You can get 1911 springs at just about any weight. I've had good luck with Sprinco's offerings. 12-14 lbs are most common for match ammunition. 16 lb is the standard .45 Auto spring for hardball. You'll put a lot less wear on the gun where the link lugs meet the assembly pin with that lighter spring not slamming the slide home as hard. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

November 7, 2017, 11:57 AM	#11
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,131	Tex S, You may want to get a 20 lb, 18 lb, and a 16 lb spring to try with the reduced 10 mm loads. If I had to pick just one, I'd get a 16 lb spring and run the loads up from about 5 grains of 231 until it functioned. That would give me a target load, to be sure. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

November 5, 2017, 11:12 PM	#2
Tex S Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2008 Location: Fort Worth, TEXAS Posts: 909	I just found 1lb of VV N105 too...

November 5, 2017, 11:35 PM	#3
Astocks2622 Member Join Date: February 1, 2014 Posts: 97	I use 5 gr W231 in my accuracy loads, but they are bunny fart loads, doing right around 700 with a plated 180gr. I haven't tried to ramp that powder up to normal 10mm power levels, but I have found it to be VERY accurate for me. I am able to just about keep up with the other guys shooting 5-6" barreled 22 autos in informal plinking matches. I'm shooting a Tanfoglio Stock 1, and run a 9 lbs spring for all but my hot loads where I bump up to an 18 lb. I found Power Pistol to be flashy and snappy when compared to my other mid range loads using AA #7. I didn't notice an accuracy advantage to PP over anything else, but I'm shooting an entirely different platform Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

November 6, 2017, 06:01 PM	#5
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,719	I use both win 231 and power pistol in 10mm under berry's 180 grain plated bullets. 231 seems to work well for light plinking loads around 5.6 grains. I run 7.9 grains of power pistol under 180 gr berrys, and that is a healthy load, but not max. AA5 or AA7 work better on the top end for 10mm and 180 grain bullets, IMO __________________ You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.

November 6, 2017, 07:49 PM	#6
brasscollector Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2015 Posts: 526	W231 will work but as stated above it is not ideal for pretty much any 10mm load. I experimented with PP and 180s in my 10mms. I found that once I tried to go any hotter than a warmed up 40 load my SD went through the roof and it showed on paper too.

November 7, 2017, 09:13 PM	#12
Tex S Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2008 Location: Fort Worth, TEXAS Posts: 909	Thanks for the replies. Anybody tried N105?