Disassembly Reassembly Question

bassfishindoc · March 3, 2011, 10:22 PM

Hello all, I recently went on a C&R shopping spree and purchased 2 Mosins, a K98, Czech Mauser VZ24, K11, K31, and an Italian Caracano. Some of them are heavily coated in cosmoline , are dirty from storage, or in the case of the Caracano, have a horrible rough trigger. I have schematics for all the rifles and I want to fully disassemble them (i.e., remove them from their stocks) so I can give them a thorough cleaning. I know proper torque on the action screws is very important when it comes time to reassemble the rifles, I just can't find a source that has the proper torques for all the rifles listed. Do any of you know the proper torque for the action screws of these rifles, or a reliable source that has them listed? I don't want to break the rifles down until I have all the information to put them back together properly.

Don P · March 3, 2011, 10:45 PM

Never saw or read what you are asking for. Try here,
www.surplusrifle.com
www.7.62X54r.net
As for the Mosin it only has 2 screws and 2 bands and the gun is disassembled

carguychris · March 3, 2011, 11:04 PM

I do not have one and have not tried it, but several things I've read about Carcanos say that you should NOT remove the spring in the magazine follower unless you really have to- i.e. when it's broken. Clean the follower without disassembling it. It's supposedly an absolute PITA to put back together unless you have special tools that you probably don't have unless it's WWII, you're an armorer, and your name is Guido.

Mosin-Nagants are very basic and easy to disassemble, with 2 caveats. (1) You need the teardrop-shaped bolt tool to set the firing pin protrusion when reassembling. The 4 notches in the side of the tool are a rudimentary but clever protrusion gauge- the firing pin should touch the shallower middle notch but clear the deeper middle notch. (2) It is not normally necessary to remove the stock reinforcement bolt or the metal escutcheons around the sling slots (if it has them- not all rifles do, some have simple elongated holes in the stock). The stock reinforcement bolt can to be removed with a special tool; you can fabricate one by bending a piece of coat hanger wire into a "U" shape, grabbing it with needlenose Vise-Grips, and inserting the points into the holes in the nut, but there's really no reason to do this unless you're refinishing the stock. The metal escutcheons can be yanked out, but it tends to tear up the wood and they really never go back in right.

James K · March 4, 2011, 11:46 PM

Proper torque on action screws is important in target rifles, but in run-of-mine military rifles, just snug them up tight or, in the case of Mausers with lock screws, tighten, then back off to the nearest lock screw notch. Soldiers took those rifles apart and put them back together and they didn't have torque drivers.

Do not remove stock cross bolts or recoil shoulders.

Jim

**JohnKSa** · March 5, 2011, 12:37 AM

Here's a reasonable approach to installing a typical centerfire bolt rifle with 2 or 3 action screws into a stock.

The basic approach is taken from Jim Carmichel's Book Of The Rifle, which, by the way, I recommend even though some of the material in it is somewhat dated.

Tighten the front screw first while making sure the action is held to the rear.
Next tighten the rearmost screw and if there is a middle screw, snug it up last but do not force it tight.

When I get all the screws in their places and snugged up, I will then tap the buttstock on a carpeted floor to make sure the action is seated as far to the rear as it will go. The screws need to be pretty tight to make sure that the action doesn't bounce forward during this process, but not super tight.

Then tighten the front and rear screws tight. Carmichel says that you should "really put some muscle into it, especially with the front screw" and makes the point that this is why you need a screwdriver that REALLY fits the screw slots properly.

The middle screw (if there is one) can be checked to make sure it's still snug after the front and rear screws are tightened but Carmichel says not to "force it tight".

James K · March 5, 2011, 10:03 PM

A good book to have around is A Collector's Guide to Military Rifle Disassembly and Reassembly by Mowbray and Pulco. It goes into a number of milsurp rifles both common (98 Mauser) and rare (Chaffee-Reese).

Check www.manatarmsbooks.com for more info.

Jim

bassfishindoc · March 7, 2011, 01:07 AM

Thanks for all the help. Jim I think I am going to have to get that book!

jtb1967 · March 7, 2011, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Proper torque on action screws is important in target rifles, but in run-of-mine military rifles, just snug them up tight or, in the case of Mausers with lock screws, tighten, then back off to the nearest lock screw notch. Soldiers took those rifles apart and put them back together and they didn't have torque drivers.

Do not remove stock cross bolts or recoil shoulders.

I have a torque screwdriver, but have found it's sometimes even over rated on target rifles. Just tighten the screws "snug".

I used to be so anal I'd remove stock cross bolts when cleaning old rifles for the first time. It's far more trouble than it's worth though.

March 3, 2011, 10:22 PM	#1
bassfishindoc Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2010 Posts: 166	Disassembly Reassembly Question Hello all, I recently went on a C&R shopping spree and purchased 2 Mosins, a K98, Czech Mauser VZ24, K11, K31, and an Italian Caracano. Some of them are heavily coated in cosmoline , are dirty from storage, or in the case of the Caracano, have a horrible rough trigger. I have schematics for all the rifles and I want to fully disassemble them (i.e., remove them from their stocks) so I can give them a thorough cleaning. I know proper torque on the action screws is very important when it comes time to reassemble the rifles, I just can't find a source that has the proper torques for all the rifles listed. Do any of you know the proper torque for the action screws of these rifles, or a reliable source that has them listed? I don't want to break the rifles down until I have all the information to put them back together properly.

March 3, 2011, 10:45 PM	#2
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: Swamp dweller Posts: 6,213	Never saw or read what you are asking for. Try here, www.surplusrifle.com www.7.62X54r.net As for the Mosin it only has 2 screws and 2 bands and the gun is disassembled __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.*

March 5, 2011, 12:37 AM	#5
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 25,570	Here's a reasonable approach to installing a typical centerfire bolt rifle with 2 or 3 action screws into a stock. The basic approach is taken from Jim Carmichel's Book Of The Rifle, which, by the way, I recommend even though some of the material in it is somewhat dated. Tighten the front screw first while making sure the action is held to the rear. Next tighten the rearmost screw and if there is a middle screw, snug it up last but do not force it tight. When I get all the screws in their places and snugged up, I will then tap the buttstock on a carpeted floor to make sure the action is seated as far to the rear as it will go. The screws need to be pretty tight to make sure that the action doesn't bounce forward during this process, but not super tight. Then tighten the front and rear screws tight. Carmichel says that you should "really put some muscle into it, especially with the front screw" and makes the point that this is why you need a screwdriver that REALLY fits the screw slots properly. The middle screw (if there is one) can be checked to make sure it's still snug after the front and rear screws are tightened but Carmichel says not to "force it tight". __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

March 3, 2011, 11:04 PM	#3
carguychris Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2007 Location: Richardson, TX Posts: 7,523	I do not have one and have not tried it, but several things I've read about Carcanos say that you should NOT remove the spring in the magazine follower unless you really have to- i.e. when it's broken. Clean the follower without disassembling it. It's supposedly an absolute PITA to put back together unless you have special tools that you probably don't have unless it's WWII, you're an armorer, and your name is Guido. Mosin-Nagants are very basic and easy to disassemble, with 2 caveats. (1) You need the teardrop-shaped bolt tool to set the firing pin protrusion when reassembling. The 4 notches in the side of the tool are a rudimentary but clever protrusion gauge- the firing pin should touch the shallower middle notch but clear the deeper middle notch. (2) It is not normally necessary to remove the stock reinforcement bolt or the metal escutcheons around the sling slots (if it has them- not all rifles do, some have simple elongated holes in the stock). The stock reinforcement bolt can to be removed with a special tool; you can fabricate one by bending a piece of coat hanger wire into a "U" shape, grabbing it with needlenose Vise-Grips, and inserting the points into the holes in the nut, but there's really no reason to do this unless you're refinishing the stock. The metal escutcheons can be yanked out, but it tends to tear up the wood and they really never go back in right.

March 4, 2011, 11:46 PM	#4
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Proper torque on action screws is important in target rifles, but in run-of-mine military rifles, just snug them up tight or, in the case of Mausers with lock screws, tighten, then back off to the nearest lock screw notch. Soldiers took those rifles apart and put them back together and they didn't have torque drivers. Do not remove stock cross bolts or recoil shoulders. Jim

March 5, 2011, 10:03 PM	#6
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	A good book to have around is A Collector's Guide to Military Rifle Disassembly and Reassembly by Mowbray and Pulco. It goes into a number of milsurp rifles both common (98 Mauser) and rare (Chaffee-Reese). Check www.manatarmsbooks.com for more info. Jim

March 7, 2011, 01:07 AM	#7
bassfishindoc Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2010 Posts: 166	Thanks for all the help. Jim I think I am going to have to get that book!