45 (long) Colt load for both revolver and rifle

[twobit]

I currently have a Cimarron Uberti Artilery model (5.5" barrel). I am currently reloading with 200gr. RNFP lead using Trailboss powder about halfway between their starting and their maximum load. This "Cowboy" load is soft to shoot. I am considering buying a 45LC model 1892 clone lever gun (Rossi or similar). The rifle would, on occasion, be used to hunt at close range, but I generally use a .270 for whitetail and 30-06 for feral hogs. Most likely game would be jack rabbits, but what would it do to a 100-200 pound hog at 50 feet if shot placement was correct?

Given that the rifle will handle a hotter load than the revolver, I see two paths to follow;

(A.) TWO LOADS - A less powerful load for the revolver (maybe continue with my current load), and a more powerful load for the rifle, possibly even using a hunting bullet. If I go this route I would need to definately not shoot the rifle load in the pistol by mistake.

(B.) ONE LOAD for both that would not tear up the revolver, yet be a decent round for the rifle and a big improvement in energy over my soft Trailboss load. I like the idea of one load for both. What would be a good load that will yield the maximum performance without abusing the revolver?

I am thinking that the maximum loads listed for 45LC will eventually cause premature wear to my revolver. Is this true? Would it be prudent to stay one notch below maximum power loads for the sake of the revolver?

One powder that I hear people mentioning for hunting with the 45LC is Unique, which appears to have it's maximum load higher than "cowboy maximum loads".

Would like comments from those that have been down this path. Thanks.

[temmi]

This fron the "Alliant Powder Reload Recipes" site... Link below




Pistols and Revolvers
45 Colt
260 gr Speer JHP
Blue Dot
CCI 300


http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloade...id=71&bdid=224

[AlaskaMike]

The 92 lever action will handle Ruger level .45 Colt loads, and if you go that route and one of those loads wound up being fired in your Uberti, it could easily destroy it, not just wear it out.

If you're willing to accept the risk, you'll probably be very surprised at the power of a Ruger level .45 Colt load out of the carbine. With a 300+ grain WFN type cast bullet, it should work beautifully on feral hogs.

I have a .44 mag Rossi 92 and I have only one bullet style that I use for it, so it's easy for me to segregate my .44 mag ammo. Not that I load hotter for the carbine (I don't), it's just that mine has a slightly overlarge bore (.434"). I just mention it because the same method i use for load segregation might work for you as well.

[shafter]

I've been shooting a 250gr RNFP with 8gr of Unique. My pistol is a 5.5 New Vaquero. It's a pleasant shooting load but I wouldn't mind stepping it up a bit. Is 9grs too much? I'd like to approach the original load without BP

[GeauxTide]

9grs of Unique stays within the original pressure profile of the LC with 255s. It will give you about 950-1000 in the revolver and about 200 more in the rifle. Pleasant, effective and your brass will last forever.

[ipscchef]

Two Bits,
I have handled a couple of recent Cimarron replicas lately and they look to be very well made to me, nice finish, good lockup etc.. If you take reasonable care and stay under the 14,000psi limit that gun should give you many, many years of good shooting.
For what you are looking to do I think you can find a lot of loads that will work quite well.
As a suggestion you might try a 250gr. cast bullet (I prefer Keith style) over about 8.5gr. of Unique for about 850fps. You should see some more velocity out of a rifle barrel, but I do not have a long gun chambered for .45 Colt YET,so I cannot tell you what gains you should expect. At reasonable handgun ranges I would not hesitate to take a reponsible shot at a Whitetail.
I am sure that their are many regulars on here that could give you even better loads. but this is the load that I tell anyone who asks me what would be a good everyday working load.
My personal load for my farm is a .270gr. Hardcast Keith from Leadhead Bullets over 9.0gr. of the same powder for about 950fps., BUT THIS MAY EXCEED YOUR PRESSURE LIMIT. I use it in my Blackhawks and older Vaqueros where it is well within the safe limits. As always, start loading on the lower end of what your manual recommends and work your way up, and do not exceed the Max.

Shafter,
According to MY manuals you should be safe at 9.0gr. of Unique. that seems to give me a good balance of power and shooting comfort out of MY 4 5/8 Blackhawk with a heavier bullet (270gr). I am getting about 950fps. and have shot a 120lb. doe at about 40 yards that went through the near shoulder and exited the ribcage on the off side. Plenty enough gun for Deer at that range anyway.
I would just add, the way you asked the question, it sounds like you do not own a manual or three or four. If not I would strongly suggest you invest in a few. In addition you can get an endless supply of real info. from the websites of Hornady, Hodgdon's, Speer, Nosler, etc.,etc..
I hope I do not sound rude or anything it is just that you really need published info. from the powder or bullet companies to make safe descisions.
Just guessing in this game is suicide!!
P.S. The Keith Bullets I have been getting from Leadhead Bullet co. are nothing short of SUPERB!!! (www.proshootpro.com). You can call and talk to Tom 6 days out of the week until midnight. You could not ask for a more courteious, friendly, knowlegable man.. I find the pricing to be very reasonable. They make ALL of the cast Bullets for Cor-Bon! That should say it all!!

[ipscchef]

+1 For GeauxTide.
You said in a couple of simple sentances what I could not get across in my long-winded Blithering Rant!!

[billtheshrink]

I have 45LC henry and 2nd generation colt, I have been told that despite rifle/pistol that ne shlould not exceed max load as its a function of the cartridge not the weapon. I asked Hodgen and was told same max load for each weapon. Maybe too conservative, I too would like to know if and how much hotter a rifle load coul;d be with 45 Colt
thanks

[twobit]

Thanks everyone for all the good replies. It is good to know that the 92 lever guns will handle the Ruger loads. I was thinking they might. If I do load one load for the pistol and a stronger load for a lever gun I will be SURE to load very different looking bullets so I can visually verify that I never put a hot load in the Uberti.

Now I just have to save up for a 92 lever gun. Unfortunately I just had to, in short order; replace the water heater in the house, buy two batteries for the diesel pickup, and spend several hundred dollars at the vet on our Weimaraner. Come to find out she has diabetis, but she will be OK, just have to give her insulin twice a day.

[Scorch]

I recommend one load for both. This avoids the "OOOOooops factor" of accidentally mixing up loads. Over the past 30+ years I have been fixing guns, I have seen many fine handguns sent to early retirement by overly enthusiastic handloads. Not that the 1892 couldn't handle them, it's just best to avoid confusion.

8.0 gr of Unique under a cast 250 gr bullet will be an entirely satisfactory load for your Uberti and the 1892. That should give you about 900 fps out of the Uberti and about 1,200 fps out of the 1892. Those loads should be more than adequate for jackrabbits out to the limits of your marksmanship, and 150-200 lbs hogs out to 50-60 yds. Remember that many of the westward movement settlers (as well as stay-at-home easterners) shot rifles chambered for 44-40, and with pretty much the same ballistics they pretty near wiped out deer, antelope, and small game populations. Realize your limitations and the limitations of your chosen platform, and you should be fine with that load.

[twobit]

Scorch,
You mentioned the 44-40. I have my great, great grandfather's Winchester 1892 octagon, long barreled 44-40 rifle. Research has dated it to 1895. It was carried as a saddle gun for many years in the Del Rio TX area and is in worn but wonderful condition. I last shot it in the 1970's when my father (who was an amateur gunsmith) cleaned it up to working condition and we shot about 15 rounds through it. Prior to that it had been partially disassembled in a shoebox for about 20 years. That rifle is what made me buy the Cimarron pistol and to want another 1892 rifle, even if it is a clone. I much prefer the model 92 over the model 94. I'm sure my great, great grandad also had a Peacemaker or two but I never saw them. I am very glad that I was the one that got his Winchester 92.

[Ozzieman]

I recommend one load for both
+1
I load for 45 LC handguns but I don’t have any rifles for that caliber. But for the guns you’re talking about you want to stay safe.
I own a number of different 44 mags in both rifles and revolvers and I do load different loads. There are plinking loads and hunting loads.
For hunting loads I only use specialty bullets like the Hornady flex tip or heavy lead bullets that the shape is easily checked before it goes into the gun. I am still taking a chance but these hunting loads are kept separate in plastic boxes and marked.
The following is the same bullet I use but for the 45. The nice thing about the FTX is that it's made for lever actions and safe. My 44 Marlin and Ruger 77/44 like them. You can also buy them already loaded.


http://www.hornady.com/store/45-Cal-.452-225-gr-FTX/

[crowbeaner]

RP brass, CCI 300, 10.5 of AA #5, 255 lfn at .452" diameter, and crimp in a seperate step. 875 fps, will shoot in either, and your brass will outlast YOU.

[zxcvbob]

You could load some rounds to CIP standard pressure (I think that's 16700 psi, but don't quote me) instead of SAAMI (14000 psi), with the intention that they are only for the rifle. If a few accidentally end up in the revolver, they shouldn't hurt anything. (if all of them accidentally end up in the revolver, they *might* shake it loose prematurely but that's it)

Use kind-of-slow powder (like Herco or Blue Dot) and wide-nosed lead bullets to maximize the effectiveness of the rifle.

[Sensai]

1 load for both, or, if you insist on two, nickel plated brass for one and plain brass for the other.

[44 AMP]

Beat me to it!

I have Rugers, Blackhawks and Vaqueros, and a New Vaquero. No rifle in .45Colt, yet. But if you are going to have two different power level loads, and one of them is too hot for a particular gun, definately use different brass!

Using Nickel brass for one load only, and brass for the other, only! I would say nickel for rifle only, just because regular brass is more common, and if you're like me, you'll shoot the pistol more than max rifle loads.

In my case, I'm going to use the nickel cases for the New Vaquero, because I have lots of ammo in brass cases loaded up "Ruger only" (which, btw, we are going to have to start calling something else, maybe "Blackhawk only", because the new Rugers won't take it).

"Cowboy loads" are powder puff loads. Created for playing games, and good for little else, except getting brass to reload. "Max Cowboy Loads" are still not much, maybe matching original factory loads, but I kind of doubt it.

Loading manuals from the 1970s and earlier list 10gr of Unique and a 250gr bullet as MAX in a COLT SAA! Probably not prudent to shoot that level today in a Colt or clone, but I do it in my Blackhawks! Does about 1,000fps btw.

[zxcvbob]

Instead of using different brass, paint the primers and case heads red on the hot loads. That will get the attention of even an idiot when he picks up the ammo. (what he does after he notices the red is anybody's guess, but at least you got his attention)