Sig P210... To shoot or not to shoot? - Page 2

stephen426 · November 9, 2007, 02:47 AM

Take a look at this auction and tell me you would shoot this H&K P7 if you won it. I could see buying a used copy in decent condition, but brand new, never fired, limited edition is a little different. I think the Sig P210 is even more special due to the engraving and gold. Now I'm going to have to keep my eyes peeled for another one. My wife is really going to kill me. Maybe I can buy a used one to shoot, keep it for a while, and ssell it for what I bought it for or more. I just can't see doing it to a limited edition though.

**44 AMP** · November 9, 2007, 03:56 AM

But not something that appeals to me. Instead of a fancy 9mm, for that kind of money I could get 2 or maybe 3 (or possibley 4 if I could find the right deals) other guns that appeal to me more.

But that is what makes it such a good hobby. Each of us can enjoy what we like best, and let others do the same. Enjoy ownership of your gun, and if you do decide to shoot it, enjoy that too.

Just a thought, but if you don't shoot it enough to cause any wear on the finish or parts, who's gonna know? How many rounds to they test fire at the factory anyway?

Hint, hint!

kristop64089 · November 9, 2007, 06:54 AM

It would kill me, but I would never shoot that gun.

I would buy another, ans sit on that one. It is a collectors item. It may be a gun, but nontheless a collectors item.

Would you play baseball with a Babe Ruth signed ball? I mean it is JUST a baseball.

I say nope. ya bought that thing because it's an unfired collectors piece. I'd leave it that way.

Jart · November 9, 2007, 09:19 AM

Tough question to answer for somebody else.

I'm cheerfully blasting away with my John Wayne New Vaq (not really "limited" and a "distributor run" anyway). Should a USFA version thereof land in my mitts, I'll shoot it as well.

But that SIG looks rather spiffy. I don't personally buy guns I won't shoot. In the case of that SIG, I wouldn't have bought it.

I lack the self-control needed to be a collector. Sooner or later (probably sooner) I'd get to wondering if it really worked. This would grind away at me until I shot it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen426

Take a look at this auction and tell me you would shoot this H&K P7 if you won it.

Couldn't get it to display, but those of us that don't have the makings of collectorhood don't consider that to be a reasonable question: we wouldn't bid on it in the first place if we wouldn't shoot it. If it was given to us, we'd sell it in a heartbeat and buy something else.

Edited to add: Hey WildAlaska: that 57-NoDash you sold me has magnificent turn line on it now.

stephen426 · November 9, 2007, 09:48 AM

Quote:

I lack the self-control needed to be a collector. Sooner or later (probably sooner) I'd get to wondering if it really worked. This would grind away at me until I shot it.

Quote:

But not something that appeals to me. Instead of a fancy 9mm, for that kind of money I could get 2 or maybe 3 (or possibley 4 if I could find the right deals) other guns that appeal to me more.

You guys pretty much hit the nail on the head. I am a shooter and thus far, all of my guns have been for shooting rather than collecting. I could not pass up this opportunity on such a rare gun. I've been fascinated with the P210 mistique for a while but this limited edition is what popped up.

I'm almost certain that I need to find a used one and buy that as a shooter. I don't know if I could bring myself to shoot a rare and limited production gun. I'll let you guys know when I find another one.

stephen426 · November 9, 2007, 09:54 AM

Here are the pics from the 25th Anniversary H&K P7M8 Jubilee. This is also a limited edition gun (1 of 500) and bears the signature of the P7's designer.

I don't own this one. I was just using it as an example of another limited edition gun. This one is for sale on Gun Broker for $3300. Frankly I think I got a much better deal on my gun. I think Sig P210 are much harder to come by than P7M8s.

cryption · November 9, 2007, 09:56 AM

I'm of the midset that if you buy it, use it. If I had an exotic car I would rake up the miles FAST. If I can find an old original colt single action army, you can bet that thing will be on every range trip. What's the point of having something if you aren't going to enjoy using it

Eghad · November 9, 2007, 10:02 AM

Looks like a safe queen to me.....

I don't think I would fire that one.

buy a shooter....

anasfox · November 9, 2007, 10:58 AM

Stephen:

PLEASE DO NOT SHOOT IT. I WLL BUY IT FOR $3000 FROM YOU.

Then I will shoot the livings dickens out of it, and put in on the block for some poor soul to bid it up $5000. Then change my mind and keep it to myself. Feel good now, feel good later..Just what I would do

saspic · November 10, 2007, 04:17 AM

Unless you bought it specifically for the express purpose of resale-then what are you waiting for?
Guns are meant to be shot! The only gun I ever would consider buying and not shooting is a Bren Ten, and only because of the spotty quality control.
Even then, I'm more likely to get it checked out and shoot it (sparingly).

In the end you'll have to weigh the money you'll lose in resale value versus the enjoyment you will derive from shooting one of the most accurate pistols ever made. So remember...I hear they like 147 grain loads!

Wildalaska · November 10, 2007, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Guns are meant to be shot!

All of them?

How about a MARS? Or an unifired 1st or 2nd gen SAA? Or a Borchardt?

Nope.

Not all guns are meant to be shot. Some are art.

WildandhesgotartAlaska TM

Litlman · November 10, 2007, 08:10 AM

Get a shooter grade. You see it all the time with nice S&W's, be it a fully engraved model 27 etc. or a nice RM or HD, alot of people have safe queens & shooter grade guns. My guns are all shooter grade, some may look better than others but, If I could afford a 210 like that and I wanted it, it would not be shot. There are lots of levels of collecting. Most of all , Enjoy it.

Creature · November 10, 2007, 10:15 AM

If it hasn't been shot, than I argue that it is not a gun. A ship isn't a ship until it floats. Until then, it is a funny shaped piece of construction.

Functional art SHOULD work. And nothing is proven to work until it does what it is expected to do.

A Mandarino or Bivins rifle is art. Those should be shot as well. A Ferrari 250 and a Bugatti 57 are works of art suitable for display in a modern art museum, but I argue that Mr Enzo Ferrari did not intend for that...he built his cars to be driven. Sure, a P-51 Mustang can be kept locked away in a museum, but to truly appreciate one, you need to see and hear (and FEEL) it fly past you at tree top level at 300 knots. A Stradivarius is ONLY appreciated if it is played.

This gun is NOT a first generation SAA. And it will never be in that league. So what if only eighty or so Mars pistols were ever made? Doesn't mean anything other than it is rare. Does that make it desirable? Doesnt mean a thing to shoot it...it is still going to be rare tomorrow. I bet there isnt an unfired Borchardt in the bunch. Still no less desirable, right?

So, shoot the damn thing and be done with it! If it such a piece of "art", which in my opinion it is not, not to worry! Apparently there will always be someone in Alaska who will want it.

orionengnr · November 11, 2007, 08:30 PM

Quote:

A Ferrari 250 and a Bugatti 57 are works of art suitable for display in a modern art museum, but I argue that Mr Enzo Ferrari did not intend for that...he built his cars to be driven. Sure, a P-51 Mustang can be kept locked away in a museum, but to truly appreciate one, you need to see and hear (and FEEL) it fly past you at tree top level at 300 knots. A Stradivarius is ONLY appreciated if it is played.

Well said.

stephen426 · November 20, 2007, 01:19 AM

Well guys... its finally home!

Sorry to disappoint you Wild, its not a Bersa. I don't have time to do a good setup, but here are a few shots so far...

Sorry I can't tell you how it shoots, but maybe eventually.

Baba Louie · November 20, 2007, 07:41 AM

Beautiful. A work of Swiss Art.

Quote:

Sorry I can't tell you how it shoots, but maybe eventually.

Know that the first round you put thru it will cost ya... sometime down the road should you ever plan on resale. If it's a gun you plan on having till the day you die and you care not about your heirs making some moola off the old man's toys, then by all means, shoot away.
While I've never been one for lots of gold squiggles, stephen426, That sir, is truly a fine looking pistol.
Whether you simply look and appreciate or do decide to shoot it, savor each moment. (and insure it for $3500+)

stephen426 · November 20, 2007, 09:59 AM

Thanks for the compliments Baba Louie. This is my first gun that is worth collecting. The P210 is one of the legendary 9mms just like the H&K P7M8 will be. I still can't believe that I found this gun for this price. I almost bought a regular P210 for just $200 less. I've been looking for a used P210 in decent condition that I can use as a shooter. I just hope my marksmanship lives up to its accuracy. Thanks for the reminder on insurance.

stephen426 · November 20, 2007, 10:26 AM

I just saw a few more Sig P210s on Gun Broker. There is another 50th anniversary edition (216/500) but the reserve price is $3999. The buy it now price is $4999. Considering I bought mine for only $2800, mine was a steal. The only thing is mine didn't come with the pretty box and all.

There is also a shooter grade P210 going for $1999 reserve price with a $2499 buy it now price. There are already 4 bids on that one and someone will probably snap it up at $2499.

I'm sure my wife will shoot me if I buy another gun.

Baba Louie · November 20, 2007, 12:50 PM

Quote:

I'm sure my wife will shoot me if I buy another gun.

Tell her NOT to use the P210! It'll end up in an evidence locker useful to no one.

Creature · November 20, 2007, 03:26 PM

It is like a beautiful pocket watch that doesn't tell time because it was never wound up.

Now go shoot a clip's worth through it...and enjoy one of the finer things in life.

stephen426 · November 20, 2007, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creature

It is like a beautiful pocket watch that doesn't tell time because it was never wound up.

I've got a couple of those too... not pocket watches, but wrist watches. I don't wear them because I don't want to scratch them up.
Omega Deville 150 Anniversary Edition #53 out of 499

Omega SeaMaster Aqua Terra

I also have a couple of collectors Montblancs including:
Writer's Edition Ernest Hemingway

Writer's Edition Marcel Proust

Writer's Edition Miguel Cervantes

Just because they aren't used, doesn't take away from what they are. Some things are meant to be admired and not necessarily used. Don't let me get started with some of my knives.

Harrigan · November 20, 2007, 10:04 PM

Can I change my vote? After seeing the picture I can't say I would fire a shot through such a work of art.

Wildalaska · November 20, 2007, 10:35 PM

Dude that is NOT a SIGARMS pistol and that probably wasnt done for the US market....Wow!!! That makes it even scarcer IMHO...

WildniceAlaska TM

oldbillthundercheif · November 20, 2007, 11:00 PM

I shoot pretty much all of my guns. The ones that I don't shoot are chambered in oddball loadings that are near-impossible to find (for less than $10-50 a round anyway). I have also worn my oyster perpetual Air-King almost every day for a very long time...

But I don't know that I would shoot that 210.

larvatus · November 21, 2007, 04:14 PM

What you have is a 50th Anniversary model of the P49, second series with the half cock notch and later style safety and slide stop. The frame seems to be old style forged rather than new style milled as seen below. It most likely originates from an old military production batch. As far as I am concerned, this is a plus. I would be curious to learn whether the hammer housing is cast. The finish is hot salt bluing over a high polish. This particular gun was most likely sold by Dan's Ammo last year for around $2,200. Similar models were made available with highly figured Amboina Burl stocks and titanium finish. Their original price was CHF 5,900. Both commemoratives are currently remaindered by Lagardere.ch for CHF 3,290 and CHF 3,790, respectively. Lagardere also offers a fully engraved P210-L with carved walnut grips for CHF 5,995, down from CHF 11,500. A similar P210-L has been repeatedly offered on Egun.de for EUR 3,000, with no takers. My own milled frame P210-L cost me $2,500 last year. I've yet to fire it.

Neither the commemoratives nor the "Luxus" engraved models are especially scarce. Most of the late Nineties commemoratives are regarded by the P210 community as a blatant attempt by the factory to move leftover spare parts, in the manner of similar decorated Colts of Eighties and Nineties vintage. Conspicuous import marks tend to detract from collector value without impairing function. Likewise the lack of the display case. My advice is to shoot and enjoy.

More information can be found here.

View Poll Results: Should I shoot my New Sig P210?
Heck No... It will depreciate the value	12	14.63%
Heck Yeah... Gotta try it out... Just baby it though.	65	79.27%
Not Sure...	5	6.10%
Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

November 9, 2007, 02:47 AM	#26
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	Take a look at this auction and tell me you would shoot this H&K P7 if you won it. I could see buying a used copy in decent condition, but brand new, never fired, limited edition is a little different. I think the Sig P210 is even more special due to the engraving and gold. Now I'm going to have to keep my eyes peeled for another one. My wife is really going to kill me. Maybe I can buy a used one to shoot, keep it for a while, and ssell it for what I bought it for or more. I just can't see doing it to a limited edition though. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

November 9, 2007, 03:56 AM	#27
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,932	Nice gun But not something that appeals to me. Instead of a fancy 9mm, for that kind of money I could get 2 or maybe 3 (or possibley 4 if I could find the right deals) other guns that appeal to me more. But that is what makes it such a good hobby. Each of us can enjoy what we like best, and let others do the same. Enjoy ownership of your gun, and if you do decide to shoot it, enjoy that too. Just a thought, but if you don't shoot it enough to cause any wear on the finish or parts, who's gonna know? How many rounds to they test fire at the factory anyway? Hint, hint! __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

November 9, 2007, 09:54 AM	#31
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	Here are the pics from the 25th Anniversary H&K P7M8 Jubilee. This is also a limited edition gun (1 of 500) and bears the signature of the P7's designer. I don't own this one. I was just using it as an example of another limited edition gun. This one is for sale on Gun Broker for $3300. Frankly I think I got a much better deal on my gun. I think Sig P210 are much harder to come by than P7M8s. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

November 9, 2007, 10:02 AM	#33
Eghad Senior Member Join Date: May 28, 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 6,231	Looks like a safe queen to me..... I don't think I would fire that one. buy a shooter.... __________________ Have a nice day at the range NRA Life Member

November 9, 2007, 09:56 AM	#32
cryption Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2007 Location: Huntsville, TX Posts: 247	I'm of the midset that if you buy it, use it. If I had an exotic car I would rake up the miles FAST. If I can find an old original colt single action army, you can bet that thing will be on every range trip. What's the point of having something if you aren't going to enjoy using it

November 9, 2007, 10:58 AM	#34
anasfox Junior Member Join Date: November 19, 2004 Location: San Francisco, surrounded by gun hating liberals, but holed up behind my NRA shield Posts: 12	Stephen: PLEASE DO NOT SHOOT IT. I WLL BUY IT FOR $3000 FROM YOU. Then I will shoot the livings dickens out of it, and put in on the block for some poor soul to bid it up $5000. Then change my mind and keep it to myself. Feel good now, feel good later..Just what I would do

November 10, 2007, 04:17 AM	#35
saspic Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2004 Location: San Antonio Posts: 138	Unless you bought it specifically for the express purpose of resale-then what are you waiting for? Guns are meant to be shot! The only gun I ever would consider buying and not shooting is a Bren Ten, and only because of the spotty quality control. Even then, I'm more likely to get it checked out and shoot it (sparingly). In the end you'll have to weigh the money you'll lose in resale value versus the enjoyment you will derive from shooting one of the most accurate pistols ever made. So remember...I hear they like 147 grain loads! __________________ "No, I will not* reread your post."*

November 10, 2007, 08:10 AM	#37
Litlman Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2002 Location: Pa. Posts: 144	Get a shooter grade. You see it all the time with nice S&W's, be it a fully engraved model 27 etc. or a nice RM or HD, alot of people have safe queens & shooter grade guns. My guns are all shooter grade, some may look better than others but, If I could afford a 210 like that and I wanted it, it would not be shot. There are lots of levels of collecting. Most of all , Enjoy it.

November 10, 2007, 10:15 AM	#38
Creature Junior member Join Date: April 8, 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,769	If it hasn't been shot, than I argue that it is not a gun. A ship isn't a ship until it floats. Until then, it is a funny shaped piece of construction. Functional art SHOULD work. And nothing is proven to work until it does what it is expected to do. A Mandarino or Bivins rifle is art. Those should be shot as well. A Ferrari 250 and a Bugatti 57 are works of art suitable for display in a modern art museum, but I argue that Mr Enzo Ferrari did not intend for that...he built his cars to be driven. Sure, a P-51 Mustang can be kept locked away in a museum, but to truly appreciate one, you need to see and hear (and FEEL) it fly past you at tree top level at 300 knots. A Stradivarius is ONLY appreciated if it is played. This gun is NOT a first generation SAA. And it will never be in that league. So what if only eighty or so Mars pistols were ever made? Doesn't mean anything other than it is rare. Does that make it desirable? Doesnt mean a thing to shoot it...it is still going to be rare tomorrow. I bet there isnt an unfired Borchardt in the bunch. Still no less desirable, right? So, shoot the damn thing and be done with it! If it such a piece of "art", which in my opinion it is not, not to worry! Apparently there will always be someone in Alaska who will want it. Last edited by Creature; November 10, 2007 at 04:33 PM.

November 20, 2007, 01:19 AM	#40
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	I FINALLY PICKED UP My P210!!! Well guys... its finally home! Sorry to disappoint you Wild, its not a Bersa. I don't have time to do a good setup, but here are a few shots so far... Sorry I can't tell you how it shoots, but maybe eventually. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

November 20, 2007, 09:59 AM	#42
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	Thanks for the compliments Baba Louie. This is my first gun that is worth collecting. The P210 is one of the legendary 9mms just like the H&K P7M8 will be. I still can't believe that I found this gun for this price. I almost bought a regular P210 for just $200 less. I've been looking for a used P210 in decent condition that I can use as a shooter. I just hope my marksmanship lives up to its accuracy. Thanks for the reminder on insurance. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

November 20, 2007, 10:26 AM	#43
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	I just saw a few more Sig P210s on Gun Broker. There is another 50th anniversary edition (216/500) but the reserve price is $3999. The buy it now price is $4999. Considering I bought mine for only $2800, mine was a steal. The only thing is mine didn't come with the pretty box and all. There is also a shooter grade P210 going for $1999 reserve price with a $2499 buy it now price. There are already 4 bids on that one and someone will probably snap it up at $2499. I'm sure my wife will shoot me if I buy another gun. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

November 20, 2007, 03:26 PM	#45
Creature Junior member Join Date: April 8, 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,769	It is like a beautiful pocket watch that doesn't tell time because it was never wound up. Now go shoot a clip's worth through it...and enjoy one of the finer things in life.

November 20, 2007, 10:04 PM	#47
Harrigan Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2007 Posts: 115	Can I change my vote? After seeing the picture I can't say I would fire a shot through such a work of art.

November 20, 2007, 10:35 PM	#48
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	Dude that is NOT a SIGARMS pistol and that probably wasnt done for the US market....Wow!!! That makes it even scarcer IMHO... WildniceAlaska TM

November 20, 2007, 11:00 PM	#49
oldbillthundercheif Junior member Join Date: April 21, 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 2,450	I shoot pretty much all of my guns. The ones that I don't shoot are chambered in oddball loadings that are near-impossible to find (for less than $10-50 a round anyway). I have also worn my oyster perpetual Air-King almost every day for a very long time... But I don't know that I would shoot that 210.

November 21, 2007, 04:14 PM	#50
larvatus Junior member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Posts: 925	What you have is a 50th Anniversary model of the P49, second series with the half cock notch and later style safety and slide stop. The frame seems to be old style forged rather than new style milled as seen below. It most likely originates from an old military production batch. As far as I am concerned, this is a plus. I would be curious to learn whether the hammer housing is cast. The finish is hot salt bluing over a high polish. This particular gun was most likely sold by Dan's Ammo last year for around $2,200. Similar models were made available with highly figured Amboina Burl stocks and titanium finish. Their original price was CHF 5,900. Both commemoratives are currently remaindered by Lagardere.ch for CHF 3,290 and CHF 3,790, respectively. Lagardere also offers a fully engraved P210-L with carved walnut grips for CHF 5,995, down from CHF 11,500. A similar P210-L has been repeatedly offered on Egun.de for EUR 3,000, with no takers. My own milled frame P210-L cost me $2,500 last year. I've yet to fire it. Neither the commemoratives nor the "Luxus" engraved models are especially scarce. Most of the late Nineties commemoratives are regarded by the P210 community as a blatant attempt by the factory to move leftover spare parts, in the manner of similar decorated Colts of Eighties and Nineties vintage. Conspicuous import marks tend to detract from collector value without impairing function. Likewise the lack of the display case. My advice is to shoot and enjoy. More information can be found here.