Help identify Ithaca 1911 before I buy

[jclayto]

I've been looking for a ww2 era 1911 for a while. Today I stumbled across an Ithaca 1911 in the local gun store and I think i can pick it up for a pretty reasonable price. I have a few questions that I hope some of you may be able to help me with. Looking online I can only find info for 6 digit serial numbers so this one has me slightly confused with the 5 digit number with a letter.

1) Serial number right side frame1377x with a letter B stamped after the s/n
2) Letters TAB11 stamped above serial number
3) Inspector initials FJA stamped on left side frame along with proof mark
4) Slide engraved Ithaca Gun Company (I believe) Ithaca, NY
5) No US Property markings or government markings that I could find
6) small lanyard loop on bottom rear of magazine well
7) Finish appears blued with some wear. Were the Ithaca's blued or
parkerized?


Does it sound as is the frame and slide are a match? Any info you can provide on the markings would be helpful. I would call the finish 85% or better with the major issue being 2 decent scratches on the side of the frame in the serial number area. The scratches do not affect the S/N

Ball park fair price?

Thanks in advance

[Jim Watson]

FJA is the correct inspector's mark for an Ithaca 1911A1.
BUT
The serial number you give is totally bogus and TAB11 is not a USGI marking.
That and the absence of a US Property stamp show that the gun has been messed with.
Are the feds going to collate all the records and track you down for an altered serial number that goes back to the FFL? Probably not, but it is at best a plinker and not a representative WWII pistol.
I'd keep looking.

[jclayto]

Thanks Jim, that is what I needed to know. I can't find any information regarding a 5 digit s/n Ithaca pistol. I am going to let this one pass.

[drcook]

Here is the link over to the Ithaca Owner's forum. It has sub-forums, even for the 1911's, not just the Ithaca 37 pump shotgun. There are lots of folks over that very familiar with Ithacas, just like there are here. It is another resource to keep track of.

http://www.ithacaowners.com/index.ph...0d9022a3554f80

[72guns92]

sound like a parts guns, Ser# range in 1943 856405-916404
1208674-1279673
1441431-1471430
1944 1816642-1890503
1945 2075104-2134403
2619014-2693613
the finish were Du-lite over sandblast early on then Parkerized
Should have both US property marking and 1911A1 Model marking on frame
Hope this helps you, Semper Fi

[dsk]

The bogus serial number alone is reason enough to stay away from it. While the chances of ATF finding out about it are slim, the fact is that any altering, defacing, or removal of an original factory serial number makes the frame illegal.

[jclayto]

Thanks all. I will not take chances with an altered serial number. I wanted this as part of my ww2 arms collection, and it does not sound like a good candidate.

[Bill DeShivs]

There have been dozens of manufacturers of 1911 A-1 frames over the years. There is no reason to think the number has been altered.

[Jim Watson]

But ol Frank J. Atwood's initials only went on Ithaca and Remington Rand frames. Unless you want us to assume another FJA putting his mark on some off brand, it sure looks like reason to think of a "scrubbed" Ithaca frame under that Ithaca slide.

[jclayto]

A scrubbed serial could also explain the scratches over the S/N area. Although the scratches appeared to be 2 light-medium straight lines rather than what I would associate with a attempt to deface a number. I also have no idea why it would have a letter B after the number unless it was supposed to be a 2 but it really did not appear that way.

Thanks to everyone for the input. I may try to go back and snap a photo tomorrow but I think I will let it pass.

[James K]

Of late, a lot of 1911 frames have been showing up with lightly stamped serial numbers. These are used (and possibly made) for turning out fake M1911/A1 pistols using GI or other legitimate slides.

Many have had the serial numbers removed and seemingly legitimate numbers put on. It is quite important not only to know the serial number ranges of any GI pistols, but also to recognize the appearance and font of the serial numbers and other markings, as well as the absence of markings (like the "USP" that should be there.

As to the quality of those frames, I have heard it is not high, which would be expected of frames intended to be used to make fraudulent collectors items.

Jim

[SpareMag]

FWIW, my father's WWII 1911 Ithica is parkerized, not blue.

[James K]

All Ithaca M1911A1's were Parkerized.

As a general note, beware of ANY U.S. rifle or pistol with a very light gray and rather rough-looking Parkerizing. The WWII Parkerizing was a smooth dark gray, often with a greenish tint, especially on M1 and M1903A3 rifles.

Jim