Ammonia -vs - brass cases

Nitescout · January 5, 2016, 03:31 PM

A couple years ago I read somewhere that ammonia in BRASSO would damage brass cases...in reference to case polish...It was like if you used ammonia on brass, you`d shoot your eye out!!! or the gun would blow up... or the world would come to an end...any thoughts???

ZwCoffindaffer · January 5, 2016, 03:40 PM

Im not sure if its true or not, but they say ammonia will make brass brittle. Thats fine if you're cleaning an antique tea pot, not so good if your weakening the case of a round thats supposed to withstand tons of pressure.

What were you wanting to use the brasso for anyways? Theres plenty other things that make brass extremely shiny without taking the chance on an ammonia based product!(again I do not know if it true or not)

Nitescout · January 5, 2016, 04:56 PM

The reason for this question was the different " economy " recipies for case tumbling calling for car polish instead of the more expensive polishes available through reloading retailers...I` was just wondering If anyone thought about ammonia in the jug of Nu Finish, or the lack thereof.

243winxb · January 5, 2016, 07:49 PM

ammonia or vinegar, bad for brass. Google - stress corrosion cracking and Dezincification of brass. To much Dawn (Ethanol) should be avoided also. Damage does not happen over night.

Average Joe · January 5, 2016, 08:00 PM

You don't need to make it shinny, just clean. Its going to get dirty when you shoot it anyway...

g.willikers · January 6, 2016, 10:21 AM

I've used vinegar and lemon based products without harm.
If the cases aren't left to soak for a long time and rinsed well, there doesn't seem to be any damage.
But ammonia is so nasty, there's really no reason to use it anyway.

**Unclenick** · January 6, 2016, 10:40 AM

Read the Wikipedia entry on "season cracking" to understand where the warnings came from.

We had one fellow post who had used Brasso to polish a bunch of linked surplus ammo he'd used as a wall decoration in his room in high school. It got put away in a trunk with other stuff of his when he left home. 20 years later, he retrieved the trunk from his parent's place and opened it to find powder all over because the brass had corroded through.

20 years is a long time. What I found interesting was the ammo wasn't repolished in the time it sat in the trunk, and though I don't know how many times it may have been polished prior to that, the point is that the corrosion damage continued to progress into the brass on its own over time. This suggests that if you did use Brasso or another ammoniated polish, you could be putting the brass on a countdown clock that will eventually run its time out, and would therefore want to use the ammo to the end of its reloading life as quickly as possible and not keep it for years.

What's absent from the above, is whether the use of non-ammoniated polishes or liquid cleaning in safe chemicals will stop the corrosion process or not. I just don't know.

To make safe cleaner, just mix up a slurry of water and diatomaceous earth, which is sold for killing insects and is a toothpaste polish, among other things. If you want something coarser and faster, buy white automotive polishing compound, or buy the powdered kaolin clay that is its abrasive. Take a tablespoon and add enough water to thin either one out to liquid polish consistency and add it to your media.

Nitescout · January 6, 2016, 06:16 PM

thanks for all the input, the reason I raised the question, was that some auto polishes, just like Brasso, have ammonia in their formula.

I didn`t want any of the newer reloaders to use any media remedy that call for nu finish or "any other" auto polish if it would ruin their brass by using the posted formulas.

Just as I learned many years ago, I thought there might be someone out there
who was unaware that while Brasso was formulated to polish brass...It`s not good for rifle brass.

Mike38 · January 6, 2016, 06:32 PM

I can understand the reason behind nice clean and polished reloads, the pride in your work thing, but I have been reloading for 20 years now, and have never owned a brass tumbler. Occasionally, I soak the empties in soapy water, but usually my cleaning amounts to wiping off the big chunks of dirt, and going about my reloading. A hole in the X-ring doesn't care if it came from a nice and bright piece of brass, or one of the dull brown things I call reloads. Dinghy brass doesn't harm reloading dies either. Or at least not mine. I have two sets of dies, .223 and 9mm that are just as old as my press, 20 years. Three other sets of dies that are probably 10+ years old. It would probably scare me if I knew how many rounds I have reloaded with those dies.

MarkCO · January 6, 2016, 07:37 PM

Quote:

ammonia or vinegar, bad for brass. Google - stress corrosion cracking and Dezincification of brass. To much Dawn (Ethanol) should be avoided also. Damage does not happen over night.

add heat and some free ions and it gets worse.

I have raised the concern several times. Some people thank me, some people ignore me and some get downright angry at me.

As a materials and forensic engineer, I have worked on several cases where this has occurred. I am currently working on one where this is likely the cause of the failure. Chlorine is also an issue with brass. You should see (and hear) the responses to some of my colleagues who are metallurgists but do not shoot when I bring up wet tumbling of brass.

January 5, 2016, 03:31 PM	#1
Nitescout Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2015 Location: central kansas Posts: 119	Ammonia -vs - brass cases A couple years ago I read somewhere that ammonia in BRASSO would damage brass cases...in reference to case polish...It was like if you used ammonia on brass, you`d shoot your eye out!!! or the gun would blow up... or the world would come to an end...any thoughts???

January 6, 2016, 10:21 AM	#6
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	I've used vinegar and lemon based products without harm. If the cases aren't left to soak for a long time and rinsed well, there doesn't seem to be any damage. But ammonia is so nasty, there's really no reason to use it anyway. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

January 6, 2016, 10:40 AM	#7
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	Read the Wikipedia entry on "season cracking" to understand where the warnings came from. We had one fellow post who had used Brasso to polish a bunch of linked surplus ammo he'd used as a wall decoration in his room in high school. It got put away in a trunk with other stuff of his when he left home. 20 years later, he retrieved the trunk from his parent's place and opened it to find powder all over because the brass had corroded through. 20 years is a long time. What I found interesting was the ammo wasn't repolished in the time it sat in the trunk, and though I don't know how many times it may have been polished prior to that, the point is that the corrosion damage continued to progress into the brass on its own over time. This suggests that if you did use Brasso or another ammoniated polish, you could be putting the brass on a countdown clock that will eventually run its time out, and would therefore want to use the ammo to the end of its reloading life as quickly as possible and not keep it for years. What's absent from the above, is whether the use of non-ammoniated polishes or liquid cleaning in safe chemicals will stop the corrosion process or not. I just don't know. To make safe cleaner, just mix up a slurry of water and diatomaceous earth, which is sold for killing insects and is a toothpaste polish, among other things. If you want something coarser and faster, buy white automotive polishing compound, or buy the powdered kaolin clay that is its abrasive. Take a tablespoon and add enough water to thin either one out to liquid polish consistency and add it to your media. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

January 5, 2016, 03:40 PM	#2
ZwCoffindaffer Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2016 Posts: 7	Im not sure if its true or not, but they say ammonia will make brass brittle. Thats fine if you're cleaning an antique tea pot, not so good if your weakening the case of a round thats supposed to withstand tons of pressure. What were you wanting to use the brasso for anyways? Theres plenty other things that make brass extremely shiny without taking the chance on an ammonia based product!(again I do not know if it true or not)

January 5, 2016, 04:56 PM	#3
Nitescout Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2015 Location: central kansas Posts: 119	The reason for this question was the different " economy " recipies for case tumbling calling for car polish instead of the more expensive polishes available through reloading retailers...I` was just wondering If anyone thought about ammonia in the jug of Nu Finish, or the lack thereof.

January 5, 2016, 07:49 PM	#4
243winxb Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: USA Posts: 1,730	ammonia or vinegar, bad for brass. Google - stress corrosion cracking and Dezincification of brass. To much Dawn (Ethanol) should be avoided also. Damage does not happen over night.

January 5, 2016, 08:00 PM	#5
Average Joe Senior Member Join Date: August 29, 2005 Location: Central Florida Posts: 1,325	You don't need to make it shinny, just clean. Its going to get dirty when you shoot it anyway...

January 6, 2016, 06:16 PM	#8
Nitescout Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2015 Location: central kansas Posts: 119	thanks for all the input, the reason I raised the question, was that some auto polishes, just like Brasso, have ammonia in their formula. I didn`t want any of the newer reloaders to use any media remedy that call for nu finish or "any other" auto polish if it would ruin their brass by using the posted formulas. Just as I learned many years ago, I thought there might be someone out there who was unaware that while Brasso was formulated to polish brass...It`s not good for rifle brass.

January 6, 2016, 06:32 PM	#9
Mike38 Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 2009 Location: North Central Illinois Posts: 2,710	I can understand the reason behind nice clean and polished reloads, the pride in your work thing, but I have been reloading for 20 years now, and have never owned a brass tumbler. Occasionally, I soak the empties in soapy water, but usually my cleaning amounts to wiping off the big chunks of dirt, and going about my reloading. A hole in the X-ring doesn't care if it came from a nice and bright piece of brass, or one of the dull brown things I call reloads. Dinghy brass doesn't harm reloading dies either. Or at least not mine. I have two sets of dies, .223 and 9mm that are just as old as my press, 20 years. Three other sets of dies that are probably 10+ years old. It would probably scare me if I knew how many rounds I have reloaded with those dies.