Help in setting up a Dillon Progressive

[44 AMP]

Never tried it myself, never had the problem (and I don't use that particular powder -which may have nothing to do with it, ) but I've been told that powder flakes, sticking to the hopper is usually due to static electricity, and the old timer's cure (before dryer sheets) was to wash it in soapy water and do not rinse it, just let it air dry,

The soap film prevents static, or so I was told. YMMV.

[ghbucky]

Dillon got back to me and pointed out the issue with my case feeder was a simple adjustment.

I got another session on the press and it is (mostly) smooth sailing it seems. The powder check is puzzling to me at times. If it alarms once, I just reject that case and move on, but when it starts going off on every round I adjust it to the current charge, then weigh that.

The charge was right on the nose, so I'm starting to think the volume checker thing is moving. I had to do that once today and after that it was all good.

I have an open station that I'm pondering what to do with.

Station 1 is full length sizer
Station 2 is powder charge and expander
station 3 is powder charge check
station 4 is bullet seating and crimping
station 5 ------ any suggestions?

[jetinteriorguy]

I seat and crimp in two separate steps.

[akinswi]

Originally Posted by jetinteriorguy

I have an aerosol can of graphite that I spray inside all of my powder hoppers. Not sure where you can find it though, I snagged mine from work when it had timed out and was being tossed.

we used to buy cases of graphite lube at john deere tractor store. Make sure to really really shake the can before you use. I have used the powdered graphite to season components.

[akinswi]

Originally Posted by ghbucky

Dillon got back to me and pointed out the issue with my case feeder was a simple adjustment.

I got another session on the press and it is (mostly) smooth sailing it seems. The powder check is puzzling to me at times. If it alarms once, I just reject that case and move on, but when it starts going off on every round I adjust it to the current charge, then weigh that.

The charge was right on the nose, so I'm starting to think the volume checker thing is moving. I had to do that once today and after that it was all good.

I have an open station that I'm pondering what to do with.

Station 1 is full length sizer
Station 2 is powder charge and expander
station 3 is powder charge check
station 4 is bullet seating and crimping
station 5 ------ any suggestions?

Jet is on point I would crimp on the last stage, especially if your doing .223… 9mm isnt as picky with crimping

[ghbucky]

I've got pretty much every thing ironed out now and it is working quite well.

I have been seeing a recent issue with the auto-case feeder micro-swith starting to stay in the closed position even when there is no case holding the switch closed. I think I figured it out, the bowl seems to be creeping down with use to where the flipper is getting caught on the feed tube when a case passes by. I raised the bowl up a bit to where it can't get caught on the tube, but I suspect it will creep down over time. Any advice on this?

I've worked through my supply of clean and hand-prime 9mm cases. I know a lot of people have talked about de-priming and priming on press, and I have a question for you:

What do you do with cases that the powder check die alarms on? Right now I can just dump the charge back in the hopper and toss the case back into the feeder. But if you are decapping and priming, what do you do with your primed cases if the charge gets rejected?

[jetinteriorguy]

I’d just toss those cases in a separate bin and deal with them later. I carefully decap them and then just run them through again and reuse the primers.

[44 AMP]

What do you do with cases that the powder check die alarms on? Right now I can just dump the charge back in the hopper and toss the case back into the feeder. But if you are decapping and priming, what do you do with your primed cases if the charge gets rejected?

First thing I'd want to know is what was the powder charge that set off the alarm??

Forgive me for not being familiar with the details of the system, I don't use a powder checker mechanism, but isn't it supposed to be checking the powder volume, not the case?

Why would you toss the case, or dump the powder, back into the hopper without stopping and investigating the cause of the alarm??

Are you doing that simply because it has the least impact on your production "flow"???

Alarms go off for a reason. It is vital to understand the reason, and if it is a valid alarm, or a spurious one. Is there an actual out of spec condition? OR is the alarm malfunctioning, out of calibration, misadjusted setpoint, or some other reason???

What I would do, on a "low powder" alarm is stop the press, remove the chaged case, and weigh the powder from it, to help me determine what happened, and why I got the alarm. After finding that out (and fixing any problems) I would then charge the "alarmed" case with the correct amount of powder (outside of the progressive press), then put it back into the shellplate where it came from and continue with the loading process.

Yes, you're not cranking out rounds while your press is stopped and you are investigating why you got a bad (reading) charge, but isn't that the whole point of having an alarm in the first place? So you don't just keep going, possibly producing a number of "bad" rounds...

[ghbucky]

That is the powder check die. You weight out your desired charge, then thread the notch on the top of the die until the tip on the right side of the plastic box sits in the middle of the notch when the box is moved against the notch.

During operation, the charge case is moved up into the die, and the box is pushed up against the notch. If the charge is too much or too little, then contact is made and the alarm sounds.

Yes, I always weigh out the charge to see what caused the alarm. I've never seen one vary by more then a few hundredths of a grain. I'm set up for 5.2gr of Power Pistol, and the biggest variant I saw alarm was 5.28.

So it keeps the charge in a narrow window.

I dump the charge and toss the case back into the auto-case feeder and just run it through again. It is 9mm, I'm not striving for rifle accuracy and case life.

[edit] If it alarms on 2 cases in a row, or starts getting frequent, then of course I stop and look at what is happening.

[akinswi]

Originally Posted by ghbucky

I've got pretty much every thing ironed out now and it is working quite well.

I have been seeing a recent issue with the auto-case feeder micro-swith starting to stay in the closed position even when there is no case holding the switch closed. I think I figured it out, the bowl seems to be creeping down with use to where the flipper is getting caught on the feed tube when a case passes by. I raised the bowl up a bit to where it can't get caught on the tube, but I suspect it will creep down over time. Any advice on this?

I've worked through my supply of clean and hand-prime 9mm cases. I know a lot of people have talked about de-priming and priming on press, and I have a question for you:

What do you do with cases that the powder check die alarms on? Right now I can just dump the charge back in the hopper and toss the case back into the feeder. But if you are decapping and priming, what do you do with your primed cases if the charge gets rejected?

bucky,

Have you actually called Dillion? If it was me I would call them. I cannot comment in your alarm issue because I visually inspect all my charges in my cases, but im not running full blown progessive press either.

One suggestion, you may be running the press too fast , If your loading a rifle caliber it takes time for the powder to completely run from hopper into the case. It doesn’t get there instantly. The same could be said with pistol powder but its less prevalent.

Try going 50% slower and if you get zero alarms in 50 or so then increase speed .

But I remember you not sizing and priming in station 1 so that operation slows the press down a bit which usually helps with powder dispensing

[ghbucky]

No, I'm sizing in station 1. What I'm skipping in station 1 is decapping/priming. My cases are already primed.

From what I'm seeing on weighing the charge on cases that alarm is that it has a very narrow range on acceptable charge before it will alarm. That is fine.

I'm trying to keep the dwell time on the up stroke a few seconds intentionally to let the charge clear the powder bar.

When a charge of only 8 100ths over can alarm, I'm not sure how I can expect it not to happen on occassion. I doubt the powder bar is that consistently accurate.

I was initially expecting to find charge differences in the tenths, but nope, it is in hundredths.

[44 AMP]

Since our standard for ever has been tenths of a grain, I'd say something that is alarming at less than a tenth grain is over sensitive for the application.

Congratulations on having a scale that reads out to the second decimal point. I don't have anything that will do better than to the nearest tenth, which has always been good enough for me.

[jetinteriorguy]

To me the most likely scenario is the differences in case capacity could easily trigger an alarm that sensitive, that is if using different brands of brass. Some are thicker in the bottom and if you set up the alarm using a thinner one then when a thicker case comes along the powder column will read like an over charged case or vice versa an under charged case.

[ghbucky]

Originally Posted by jetinteriorguy

To me the most likely scenario is the differences in case capacity could easily trigger an alarm that sensitive, that is if using different brands of brass. Some are thicker in the bottom and if you set up the alarm using a thinner one then when a thicker case comes along the powder column will read like an over charged case or vice versa an under charged case.

That makes sense. The last case in my batch alarmed 3 times in a row, but the charges weren't out of line and I am using mixed headstamps. They all measured at my 5.2gr target.

(on a side note, I'm very impressed with the Dillon powder measure system consistency)

It also occurs to me that since the alarm is calibrated by my Mk1 eyeball, it could well be user error as well. I'll take a closer look at the alignments.

OTOH, I'm not really sweating it very much. I'm not even close to max charge, so a small overcharge is not going to put me anywhere close to overpressure, and every one I've shot goes bang and does a nice ejection.

[ghbucky]

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

Congratulations on having a scale that reads out to the second decimal point. I don't have anything that will do better than to the nearest tenth, which has always been good enough for me.

I didn't miss the sarcasm It reads out to the 2nd decimal, that doesn't mean I use that as anything more that somewhere in between the 10ths.

[44 AMP]

There's your likely cause, mixed brass.

Your system is very precise and very sensitive, and mixed brass will give mixed results. Uniform brass will probably do away with most if not all of the "false alarms".

[draggon]

G'day ghbucky,

Just asking why you aren't resizing at the same time as you are depriming the cases.
If you are doing sizing/depriming before you wet tumble and prime, means you can liberally lubricate straightwall pistol cases which reduces the effort dramatically.
It also means that you can eliminate the FLS die on the Dillon progressive which not only reduces the effort of running the press but more importantly improves the "feel".
Seat projectiles and "crimp" in separate operations for the same reason.
Also do your self a favour and get a bullet feeding kit.
Personally I think that speeds the operation up more than a casefeeder.
And yep, I have never achieved quite 100% reliability with my casefeeder on a Super1050.
A bulletfeed kit can be as simple as a Hornady/RCBS die with aluminium tubes. A 1 m/yard tube holds about 90 9mm projectiles.
The tubes are cheap and just fill them in front of the TV after you've finished priming.
Hope that helps.

[jetinteriorguy]

Originally Posted by draggon

G'day ghbucky,

Just asking why you aren't resizing at the same time as you are depriming the cases.
If you are doing sizing/depriming before you wet tumble and prime, means you can liberally lubricate straightwall pistol cases which reduces the effort dramatically.
It also means that you can eliminate the FLS die on the Dillon progressive which not only reduces the effort of running the press but more importantly improves the "feel".
Seat projectiles and "crimp" in separate operations for the same reason.
Also do your self a favour and get a bullet feeding kit.
Personally I think that speeds the operation up more than a casefeeder.
And yep, I have never achieved quite 100% reliability with my casefeeder on a Super1050.
A bulletfeed kit can be as simple as a Hornady/RCBS die with aluminium tubes. A 1 m/yard tube holds about 90 9mm projectiles.
The tubes are cheap and just fill them in front of the TV after you've finished priming.
Hope that helps.

A lot of people just deprime without sizing and then clean the brass to avoid running potentially dirty brass through the sizing die and damaging it.

[ghbucky]

Thanks,for the tips, draggon.

My reasons for not sizing when I deprime are just at jetinteriorguy stated. I use a universal decapper, then tumble the cases. Since it is 9mm and I'm using Hornady titanium coated dies, I'm not having issues with case sticking.

Thanks for the tip on the bullet feeder.

[draggon]

Carbide sizing rings are harder than just about anything other than diamond. So unless you are sprinkling your fired cases with diamond dust you are unlikely to damage them if the cases have a bit of firing residue on them.
I just quickly run the cases through a rotary media separator to get rid of any paper/stones or 22 cases I have picked up and them give them (9mm) a really good spray of any lanolin based lubricant. That gets rid of most of the left over dust.
They run through my sizing/depriming setup like butter and then get wet tumbled.
Try running your progressive without the FLS die in place. You will really notice the difference.
I've loaded several 100Ks of 9mm over the years and haven't damaged a carbide die yet.

[akinswi]

I was always told good idea to clean cases because of the carbon residue is pretty hard and can scratch things. Carbide is pretty hard.

I dont risk it on my nicer dies. But my cheaper lee carbide dies I could care less. But dirty cases can and will scratch just about any dies ever made

[rodfac]

Dillon's customer service is first rate, and will help you get set up. They spent nearly an hour with me when I bought my first 550B. I think you'll be pleased. Rod

[jetinteriorguy]

Originally Posted by draggon

Carbide sizing rings are harder than just about anything other than diamond. So unless you are sprinkling your fired cases with diamond dust you are unlikely to damage them if the cases have a bit of firing residue on them.
I just quickly run the cases through a rotary media separator to get rid of any paper/stones or 22 cases I have picked up and them give them (9mm) a really good spray of any lanolin based lubricant. That gets rid of most of the left over dust.
They run through my sizing/depriming setup like butter and then get wet tumbled.
Try running your progressive without the FLS die in place. You will really notice the difference.
I've loaded several 100Ks of 9mm over the years and haven't damaged a carbide die yet.

That’s just it, the carbide is just a ring at the mouth of the die, the rest of the die is steel and liable to damage from carbon left on the case. Everyone does what they think best and a lot of people think it’s best to run clean brass through their dies, I happen to be one of them.

[akinswi]

Originally Posted by jetinteriorguy

That’s just it, the carbide is just a ring at the mouth of the die, the rest of the die is steel and liable to damage from carbon left on the case. Everyone does what they think best and a lot of people think it’s best to run clean brass through their dies, I happen to be one of them.

Jet,

I may check my lee 9mm Carbide Die in my pro 1000 and see if the 5,000 dirty cases I ran thru it scratched the actual carbide ring. It has me wondering now, some of them were pretty grungy

[ghbucky]

My Hornady FL sizing die has a titanium nitride ring, per Hornady's description:

Most of our pistol dies feature a titanium nitride “gold ring” finish that’s harder than carbide and doesn’t require lubrication. The super hard coating is perfect for resizing soft pistol brass and won’t scratch cases.

At any rate, as jet said, I like to only process clean brass on my main press. I was the same way with my Lee turret press, but it has now taken up new duty to decap fired cases with a universal decapper and a swager die for crimped primer pockets on my old turret that was set up for 9mm

[edit] One thing I've learned about the Dillon progressive, I'm no faster with the ram than I was on my old turret press. At first I had this idea it would be much faster, but it isn't, not unless I want to have problems.

After at first trying to go fast with it, I've slowed way down and it is operating much more reliably. I'm still doing all the things I learned to do on the turret, putting eyeballs on the charge, making sure the bullet is aligned as the seating occurs, etc.

The thing is that even though I'm not working the handle very fast, it still drops a loaded round with every cycle, so it if 4x more productive than my old turret press. And that makes me very happy.

I used to load enough rounds to go shot. Now I've got plenty of ammo to shoot for a couple of weeks and I'm processing around 2k brass to load to let me increase my shooting frequency.

I'm very, very happy with this press.