870: Bead or Rifle Sights?

Model12Win · August 21, 2016, 03:32 PM

Hello all! For a defensive Remington 870, which would you rather have on your shotgun: a standard bead or the Remington rifle sights? Please no ghost rings or anything like that. This is just between these two options. Thanks!

FITASC · August 21, 2016, 04:10 PM

Standard bead and not even that if there was a third choice - your FOCUS should be on your target, whether clay, bird, deer, or human.especially when using any form of shot.

Pahoo · August 21, 2016, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Standard bead and not even that if there was a third choice

My call as well !! ,,,,,,

Be Safe !!!

Blindstitch · August 21, 2016, 06:41 PM

Standard bead. Maybe rifle sight if shooting slugs but realistically if you have time to use a rifle sight you have time to make other decisions.

dahermit · August 21, 2016, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Standard bead. Maybe rifle sight if shooting slugs but realistically if you have time to use a rifle sight you have time to make other decisions.

Good answer. Too many people confuse defensive shooting (and what is required for that), with combat shooting. They are two entirely different things. The same with defensive and tactical...they are not the same. A homeowner is likely to need a defensive gun whereas a police officer may require a tactical gun, as in shooting a slug instead of shot/buckshot.

Chief Brody · August 22, 2016, 12:14 AM

My $.02: It doesn't really matter all that much what sights you choose for a home defense shotgun - and that is NOT because you don't have to aim (of course you do), but rather, at HD distances, you should be able to deliver an effective shot to your target regardless of bead, ghost ring, or rifle sights. On my 870 Police Mag, I have a set of Ameriglo tritium rifle sights. Doesn't matter all that much to me that they're night sights, but what does matter is the sight picture is great for longer-distance shots at the range. (I wasn't a fan of Remington's rifle sights, this aftermarket set fits atop the factory bases.) I shoot this gun a lot, outdoor and indoor. I like being able to reach out with the rifle sights. I also use the gun in competition, steel plate matches. Admittedly, this setup is not the absolute fastest, and I may change it in the future, but I have enjoyed it for the past 2 1/2 years or so.

In a home defense scenario, you're likely to be aiming your shotgun at a guy who's 0-20' away. Any sights or no sights at all will work. If you know how to use a shotgun at all, the choice of sights on your gun will mean almost nothing. Just my opinion.

turtlehead · August 22, 2016, 12:22 AM

FWIW I have the rifle sights on an 870P. They are NOT fast on target.

turtlehead · August 22, 2016, 12:23 AM

But they are fun on a range gun.

mavracer · August 22, 2016, 12:01 PM

I'm fine with either I have a bead on a couple of mine, but my Ithaca has a receiver rear and a fiber optic front and is plenty fast.

Slopemeno · August 22, 2016, 09:42 PM

Bead on the base.

tlm225 · August 23, 2016, 10:41 PM

I voted bead. My shotgun has Scattergun Tech (now Wilson) ghost ring sights but is serves as my duty gun and is set up for both buck and slug use.

IMO for a home defensive use the simpler the better. Bead sight, surefire forearm mounted light and a 4-6 round mag tube will suffice.

turtlehead · August 23, 2016, 11:52 PM

Love the ghost ring sights.

T. O'Heir · August 24, 2016, 01:48 PM

Depends on the ammo you're using and that depends on the terrain you're on. Also makes a difference how much you practice.
The factory rifle sights are the same crappola sights they put on their low end rifles. Not made for speed. A bead is made for speed, but aiming by pointing. Even with the slug you really shouldn't use for SD anyway.
Oh and a Ghost Ring is a rifle sight. It's just a large aperture peep sight.
"...not even that..." Shot bowling pins, etc with my 870 with no sights for years. As long as you know where it shoots, it works well. Still requires aiming though.

Tinbucket · August 24, 2016, 09:04 PM

Rifled slug and smooth bore barrels with sights and even scope mounts are available, cheap.
Buy one and try it. Not much rang involved, generally in home defense.
I would want a cylinder bore short barrel shotgun. Sights would hurt it but if you are use to the bead, you don't want a moment's hesitation if you have to use it.

Pahoo · August 25, 2016, 11:27 AM

Quote:

For a defensive Remington 870

Okay, you point a bead or better yet, a barrel. ..... Right ?
You aim a sighted barrel. ..... Right ?

In a defensive or home protection shotgun, I don't want to take the time to aim and hopefully, I proficient enough to be effective. ......

Be Safe !!!

mavracer · August 25, 2016, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Okay, you point a bead or better yet, a barrel. ..... Right ?
You aim a sighted barrel. ..... Right ?

Not IMHO (especially with a shotgun) sights of whatever nature are just a reference system to how well you have trained yourself to shoulder the gun (or draw a pistol for that matter) after that it only matters how much time you "want" to spend for precision.

If it takes extra time to find the sight picture you aren't doing it right

g.willikers · August 25, 2016, 01:48 PM

Shotguns, using anything other than slugs, are much like long bows and recurves.
Best done with instinctive methods, relying on good form rather than sights.
Hard to learn at first, but once acquired never to be forgotten.

g.willikers · August 25, 2016, 01:54 PM

P.S.
Anyone else discover this to be true?

bamaranger · August 25, 2016, 03:57 PM

That's an interesting comparison.

Shooting a bow instinctively and well, can be very fast and effective, especially if the ranges are short. My own experience is that level of ability requires a great deal of practice, comes easier to some and not others, and must be maintained with realistic practice. So much so that I gave up bare bows, for one's with sights, and can be proficient enough to hunt with less practice,and at greater distances, than I ever could w/o sights. Less wear and tear on my joints too.

But we are talking shotguns of course. It may only be subconsciously, but we see the bead, perhaps much like an instinctive bow shot sees the tip of the arrow, while focusing on the target. Like archery, I think that skill with a shotgun can indeed deteriorate, I am certainly a much poorer wing (and clay) shot than I was back when I did more of same, than I am now.

My own tendency is to look over a short barreled shotgun and not down the barrel, so resultantly my shots go high. HIgh enough that I occassionaly fail to break stationary clays in a 3 gun match or a static steel target at HD type distances (or a gobbler if I shoot too quickly when it appears suddenly to call) if I am not careful. Some of this maybe shotgun fit.......but I know little specifics about that subject. What I am sure of is that some type of rear sight, pulls my eye and head down on the gun and makes me shoot better, usually. That is even more important when my gun mount is sloppy due to haste, my own movement, or other awkward circumstances.

A rifle sight is not that much slower either, if used in a flash sight picture context. I killed two gobblers this spring, on the wing (due to my own stupidity with first shots) with a 20" Rem 870 and rifle sights, and do not believe a lone bead would have made it any easier.

I want sights on my bow, my stubby shotguns when I can arrange it, but will keep two beads (preferrably front and rear) on my wing guns.

Pahoo · August 25, 2016, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Anyone else discover this to be true?

Sure have and when I shot trap, perhaps I was aware of the bead but frankly, after a time, I could have shot without it. Knew and old-timer what was wicked with just a plain barrel. Yes, I believe there is a ross-over from instinctive archery. Years ago I read about the ZEN archers and they were amazing. .....

Be Safe !!!

j3ffr0 · August 26, 2016, 01:17 AM

I haven't been shooting shotguns all that long. I recall being surprised how fast and accurate I was with the bead when I first using one. Sometimes simpler is better. Bead for me.

View Poll Results: Which would you have on a defensive/tactical 870?
Rifle Sights	11	31.43%
Bead Sight	24	68.57%
Voters: 35. You may not vote on this poll

August 21, 2016, 03:32 PM	#1
Model12Win Junior member Join Date: October 20, 2012 Posts: 5,854	870: Bead or Rifle Sights? Hello all! For a defensive Remington 870, which would you rather have on your shotgun: a standard bead or the Remington rifle sights? Please no ghost rings or anything like that. This is just between these two options. Thanks!

August 21, 2016, 04:10 PM	#2
FITASC Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2014 Posts: 6,654	Standard bead and not even that if there was a third choice - your FOCUS should be on your target, whether clay, bird, deer, or human.especially when using any form of shot. __________________ "I believe that people have a right to decide their own destinies; people own themselves. I also believe that, in a democracy, government exists because (and only so long as) individual citizens give it a 'temporary license to exist'—in exchange for a promise that it will behave itself. In a democracy, you own the government—it doesn't own you."- Frank Zappa

August 23, 2016, 10:41 PM	#11
tlm225 Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 976	I voted bead. My shotgun has Scattergun Tech (now Wilson) ghost ring sights but is serves as my duty gun and is set up for both buck and slug use. IMO for a home defensive use the simpler the better. Bead sight, surefire forearm mounted light and a 4-6 round mag tube will suffice. __________________ All that is neccessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Edmund Burke

August 24, 2016, 09:04 PM	#14
Tinbucket Senior Member Join Date: January 17, 2015 Posts: 355	870 bead or rifle sights Rifled slug and smooth bore barrels with sights and even scope mounts are available, cheap. Buy one and try it. Not much rang involved, generally in home defense. I would want a cylinder bore short barrel shotgun. Sights would hurt it but if you are use to the bead, you don't want a moment's hesitation if you have to use it.

August 21, 2016, 06:41 PM	#4
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,696	Standard bead. Maybe rifle sight if shooting slugs but realistically if you have time to use a rifle sight you have time to make other decisions.

August 22, 2016, 12:14 AM	#6
Chief Brody Member Join Date: October 12, 2012 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 81	My $.02: It doesn't really matter all that much what sights you choose for a home defense shotgun - and that is NOT because you don't have to aim (of course you do), but rather, at HD distances, you should be able to deliver an effective shot to your target regardless of bead, ghost ring, or rifle sights. On my 870 Police Mag, I have a set of Ameriglo tritium rifle sights. Doesn't matter all that much to me that they're night sights, but what does matter is the sight picture is great for longer-distance shots at the range. (I wasn't a fan of Remington's rifle sights, this aftermarket set fits atop the factory bases.) I shoot this gun a lot, outdoor and indoor. I like being able to reach out with the rifle sights. I also use the gun in competition, steel plate matches. Admittedly, this setup is not the absolute fastest, and I may change it in the future, but I have enjoyed it for the past 2 1/2 years or so. In a home defense scenario, you're likely to be aiming your shotgun at a guy who's 0-20' away. Any sights or no sights at all will work. If you know how to use a shotgun at all, the choice of sights on your gun will mean almost nothing. Just my opinion.

August 22, 2016, 12:22 AM	#7
turtlehead Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2015 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,203	FWIW I have the rifle sights on an 870P. They are NOT fast on target.

August 22, 2016, 12:23 AM	#8
turtlehead Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2015 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,203	But they are fun on a range gun.

August 22, 2016, 12:01 PM	#9
mavracer Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2008 Location: midwest Posts: 4,209	I'm fine with either I have a bead on a couple of mine, but my Ithaca has a receiver rear and a fiber optic front and is plenty fast.

August 22, 2016, 09:42 PM	#10
Slopemeno Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2007 Posts: 2,663	Bead on the base.

August 23, 2016, 11:52 PM	#12
turtlehead Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2015 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,203	Love the ghost ring sights.

August 24, 2016, 01:48 PM	#13
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	Depends on the ammo you're using and that depends on the terrain you're on. Also makes a difference how much you practice. The factory rifle sights are the same crappola sights they put on their low end rifles. Not made for speed. A bead is made for speed, but aiming by pointing. Even with the slug you really shouldn't use for SD anyway. Oh and a Ghost Ring is a rifle sight. It's just a large aperture peep sight. "...not even that..." Shot bowling pins, etc with my 870 with no sights for years. As long as you know where it shoots, it works well. Still requires aiming though.

August 25, 2016, 01:48 PM	#17
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Shotguns, using anything other than slugs, are much like long bows and recurves. Best done with instinctive methods, relying on good form rather than sights. Hard to learn at first, but once acquired never to be forgotten.

August 25, 2016, 01:54 PM	#18
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	P.S. Anyone else discover this to be true?

August 25, 2016, 03:57 PM	#19
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,800	bows v. shotguns That's an interesting comparison. Shooting a bow instinctively and well, can be very fast and effective, especially if the ranges are short. My own experience is that level of ability requires a great deal of practice, comes easier to some and not others, and must be maintained with realistic practice. So much so that I gave up bare bows, for one's with sights, and can be proficient enough to hunt with less practice,and at greater distances, than I ever could w/o sights. Less wear and tear on my joints too. But we are talking shotguns of course. It may only be subconsciously, but we see the bead, perhaps much like an instinctive bow shot sees the tip of the arrow, while focusing on the target. Like archery, I think that skill with a shotgun can indeed deteriorate, I am certainly a much poorer wing (and clay) shot than I was back when I did more of same, than I am now. My own tendency is to look over a short barreled shotgun and not down the barrel, so resultantly my shots go high. HIgh enough that I occassionaly fail to break stationary clays in a 3 gun match or a static steel target at HD type distances (or a gobbler if I shoot too quickly when it appears suddenly to call) if I am not careful. Some of this maybe shotgun fit.......but I know little specifics about that subject. What I am sure of is that some type of rear sight, pulls my eye and head down on the gun and makes me shoot better, usually. That is even more important when my gun mount is sloppy due to haste, my own movement, or other awkward circumstances. A rifle sight is not that much slower either, if used in a flash sight picture context. I killed two gobblers this spring, on the wing (due to my own stupidity with first shots) with a 20" Rem 870 and rifle sights, and do not believe a lone bead would have made it any easier. I want sights on my bow, my stubby shotguns when I can arrange it, but will keep two beads (preferrably front and rear) on my wing guns.

August 26, 2016, 01:17 AM	#21
j3ffr0 Senior Member Join Date: June 21, 2012 Location: VA Posts: 199	I haven't been shooting shotguns all that long. I recall being surprised how fast and accurate I was with the bead when I first using one. Sometimes simpler is better. Bead for me.