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Old February 1, 2013, 02:55 PM   #76
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re: Cloward Piven

George Soros on the Coming Class War" January 23, 2012:

As anger rises, riots on the streets of American cities are inevitable. “Yes, yes, yes,” he [Soros] says, almost gleefully. The response to the unrest could be more damaging than the violence itself. “It will be an excuse for cracking down and using strong-arm tactics to maintain law and order, which, carried to an extreme, could bring about a repressive political system, a society where individual liberty is much more constrained, which would be a break with the tradition of the United States.”
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Old February 1, 2013, 05:10 PM   #77
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Are you drawing the connection yourself or can you cite the source of the connection?
I thought that up by myself. I was thinking about potential impediments to a national, central government restructuring the country into a command-and-control situation like marxist or fascist states we have seen.

I think the impediments to making this work run the gamut from disarming citizens to immobilizing them physically and mentally, controlling where and what healthcare they get and what they can do at a bank.

Physical immobility? "Coerce" (Ray La Hood's announced mission) them out of their cars and onto government controlled transit. Do it long and deep enough and people stop thinking about having much physical mobility, which changes their world view.

Disarmament makes repression that much safer and easier for the government.

A regulatory state in which everyone is some kind of criminal, even when the laws are haphazardly enforced, has to breed common distrust, which makes a citizen militia less likely to form and/or be effective. If you live in NY, don't turn your guns in, it's unlikely to be something you are going to confide in people you don't know well, even from a couple of blocks away.

A centralized state finds its rule easier if citizens feel "guilty" and isolated from each other.

Glenn Reynolds' essay Due Process When Everything is a Crime ( got me thinking about all the little ways people get cowed into "compliance".

I doubt this is any great central plot, more likely a lot of fellow travelers pushing toward complimentary goals. I see the current disarmament push as another facet which compliments other agenda items. The facets may not be connected in a central plan but they tend to support the same end scenario.

Of course, George Soros' glee at the vision of riots in our streets, gives me a little pause. It is a cinch a number of people like that same vision and figure they can profit from it.

What won't they do to see it happen, is the question I think needs to be asked. That is another subject, another part of "common distrust".

That some people think others are too stupid to select the size of soda they "should"...and can proscribe a remedy for such a measure of how far we are toward citizen passivity.

Excuse my digression, but I don't know how to explain what I meant simply.
Loyalty to petrified opinions never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul in this world — and never will.
— Mark Twain

Last edited by HarrySchell; February 1, 2013 at 05:25 PM.
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Old February 1, 2013, 06:05 PM   #78
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Your points are well taken. I agree that both could/would be mutually beneficial to those who seek more control.

Thanks for clarifying your reasonable connection.

Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
Guys, welfare and wealth distribution isn't the topic here, and it's not really germane to any part of the forum. Let's stick to the matter at hand.
Point forward I will stick to the topic.
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Old February 1, 2013, 10:20 PM   #79
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We're back off the topic of gun control (and venturing into conspiracy theories), and prior warnings have been ignored. Lights out for this one.
Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change.
--Randall Munroe
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