J.P. Shuer & Sohn Suhl 7.65 Nazi Marked

Biggmatt · January 22, 2020, 06:35 PM

Good Evening,

I obtained a J.P. Shuer & Sohn Suhl 7.65 (.32acp) Nazi Marked with two matching magazines and one original leather holster that has the guns serial number printed under the flap. It has two Nazi Eagle stamps with “N” below each symbol.
Serial: 299726

The gun appears to be in good shape, no rust and functions perfectly. Appears to be original bluing finish.

What kinda value does something like this have. I’ve done some research and seems to be anywhere between $500-$1000 depending on condition and finish. The holster is not in that great of condition

FrankenMauser · January 22, 2020, 07:05 PM

Waffen-stamped, not Nazi.

Better photos would help. (They're quite low resolution.)

jar · January 22, 2020, 07:12 PM

You have a JP Sauer & Sohns 38h in 32acp.

The Eagle N was common to all German proofed guns of the period, both civilian and military. Look on the trigger guard to see if it has a Waffenamt.

You might also see an Eagle F or an Eagle C which would be police issued. Your serial number puts it likely in 1941 or very early 1942. Many were later used by the East German police (VoPo) and if so will have a Starburst with a number in the center as the stamping.

Check to make sure the decocker/cocker is working.

It's a delightful gun to shoot. If the magazine numbered to the gun was electro-stenciled then it's likely it did get accepted into police or military service.

**44 AMP** · January 22, 2020, 07:25 PM

Not sure if its auto-correct or not but the name should be J.P. Sauer & Sohn, and Suhl is the city they were in.

The Nazis had uniforms for virtually every "civil service" job as well as their military and political components and most of them included a pistol as part of the daily wear uniform (and many also a dress dagger for formal occasions)

One can find almost anything as a Nazi marked pistol, including some .25 autos though those are rare. Any and every .32cal and up can be found with WaA Pruf stamps and the mark below the eagle (usually a number not a letter) denotes which inspection office marked it.

Sometimes the marks are very faint or only partial.

And, there is a difference between the German eagle proof mark and the Waffen Amt stamp which (when fully stamped) is the Nazi Eagle with swastika and a number.

The correct holster adds considerably to the value to the collector. The better the condition the more $ its worth.

Sorry I don't know current collector values.

Biggmatt · January 22, 2020, 07:26 PM

Jar, there’s nothing stamped or engraved on the trigger guard.
All I’m able to find is the Eagle “N” on top of slide right side and same stamp right under the serial number.

Sry for the terrible pictures I uploaded from my phone so their not the best.

jar · January 22, 2020, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggmatt

Jar, there’s nothing stamped or engraved on the trigger guard.
All I’m able to find is the Eagle “N” on top of slide right side and same stamp right under the serial number.

Sry for the terrible pictures I uploaded from my phone so their not the best.

It still looks like a nice gun but without a waffenamt or police stamp it should not be called Nazi marked. The Eagle N was used before and after the Nazis and is simply the government proofing stamp.

Here is where the generic Proof marks are on the frames.

Acceptance marks would be on the other side, usually on the trigger guard or the left rear slide. After the war though many Nazi acceptance marks were simply scrubbed off and so often you will see machining marks where the waffenamt would have been. The correct acceptance mark for Sauer would be Eagle 37.

Biggmatt · January 22, 2020, 08:34 PM

Yep, all I’m able too locate is the generic proof marks on the frame
& slide.

jar · January 22, 2020, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggmatt

Yep, all I’m able too locate is the generic proof marks on the frame
& slide.

It's still a very nice JP Sauer 38h from 1941 or 1942 and a pure joy to shoot. Enjoy it.

I did a thread over at Badger & Blade recently on the three German made 32acp pistols from WWII. You might enjoy it.

Biggmatt · January 22, 2020, 09:00 PM

Thanks everyone for your replies and expertise. I’ve learned quite
A bit from this forum.

Carl the Floor Walker · January 24, 2020, 04:12 AM

Does anyone know what model is in display at the Army War museum in Houston. The one surrendered by the German General in Berlin?

January 22, 2020, 07:05 PM	#2
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,426	Waffen-stamped, not Nazi. Better photos would help. (They're quite low resolution.) __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

January 22, 2020, 07:12 PM	#3
jar Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2001 Location: Deep South Texas Posts: 1,670	You have a JP Sauer & Sohns 38h in 32acp. The Eagle N was common to all German proofed guns of the period, both civilian and military. Look on the trigger guard to see if it has a Waffenamt. You might also see an Eagle F or an Eagle C which would be police issued. Your serial number puts it likely in 1941 or very early 1942. Many were later used by the East German police (VoPo) and if so will have a Starburst with a number in the center as the stamping. Check to make sure the decocker/cocker is working. It's a delightful gun to shoot. If the magazine numbered to the gun was electro-stenciled then it's likely it did get accepted into police or military service. __________________ To be vintage it's gotta be older than me!

January 22, 2020, 07:25 PM	#4
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,850	Not sure if its auto-correct or not but the name should be J.P. Sauer & Sohn, and Suhl is the city they were in. The Nazis had uniforms for virtually every "civil service" job as well as their military and political components and most of them included a pistol as part of the daily wear uniform (and many also a dress dagger for formal occasions) One can find almost anything as a Nazi marked pistol, including some .25 autos though those are rare. Any and every .32cal and up can be found with WaA Pruf stamps and the mark below the eagle (usually a number not a letter) denotes which inspection office marked it. Sometimes the marks are very faint or only partial. And, there is a difference between the German eagle proof mark and the Waffen Amt stamp which (when fully stamped) is the Nazi Eagle with swastika and a number. The correct holster adds considerably to the value to the collector. The better the condition the more $ its worth. Sorry I don't know current collector values. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

January 22, 2020, 09:00 PM	#9
Biggmatt Member Join Date: May 3, 2014 Location: West Palm Beach, FL Posts: 22	Thanks everyone for your replies and expertise. I’ve learned quite A bit from this forum. Last edited by Biggmatt; January 22, 2020 at 09:07 PM.

January 22, 2020, 07:26 PM	#5
Biggmatt Member Join Date: May 3, 2014 Location: West Palm Beach, FL Posts: 22	Jar, there’s nothing stamped or engraved on the trigger guard. All I’m able to find is the Eagle “N” on top of slide right side and same stamp right under the serial number. Sry for the terrible pictures I uploaded from my phone so their not the best.

January 22, 2020, 08:34 PM	#7
Biggmatt Member Join Date: May 3, 2014 Location: West Palm Beach, FL Posts: 22	Yep, all I’m able too locate is the generic proof marks on the frame & slide.

January 24, 2020, 04:12 AM	#10
Carl the Floor Walker member Join Date: June 3, 2017 Location: South Posts: 1,422	Does anyone know what model is in display at the Army War museum in Houston. The one surrendered by the German General in Berlin?