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Old December 28, 2019, 10:22 PM   #1
veprdude
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What use is a manual safety on a single action pistol in Condition 2? (Hammer forward)

I bought a Star PD in 45ACP. For those who don't know it's like a Commander style 1911 that has some Hi-Power features. It's a single action hammer fired semi-auto.

You can engage the manual safety at all times. (Hammer forward or back)

My 1911s and Hi-Powers won't do this. What's the advantage?
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Old December 28, 2019, 10:29 PM   #2
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If there is a round in the chamber, it prevents firing if you place your finger on the trigger while thumbing the hammer back
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Old December 29, 2019, 02:23 PM   #3
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It's been over 40 years since I had a Star PD, and I can no longer remember all the details. I don't know that there is an "advantage" to it, or not.

Can you cock the hammer with the safety on?

It looks like a 1911 but the internals are slightly different, and it may just be the way things are made inside that allows the safety to go on with the hammer down, and not a specifically intended feature.
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Old December 29, 2019, 03:16 PM   #4
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My Star Model B allows the safety to engaged in the half cock position.
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Old December 29, 2019, 04:55 PM   #5
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If someone gets the gun away from you, having hammer down and safety on should give you plenty of time to run or take other action before you're shot.

One reason I'll always want a safety on a carry gun; slows me down not at all, but could be handy if someone else, anyone else, has the gun and doesn't know how it works.
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Old December 29, 2019, 06:39 PM   #6
Bill DeShivs
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You can't cock a PD with the safety on.
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Old December 29, 2019, 08:09 PM   #7
veprdude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 44 AMP View Post

Can you cock the hammer with the safety on?
No. The safety will not allow the slide back while engaged either. The safety externally prevents the slide from coming back. The safety will not engage half-cocked either.

Just a weird setup and seeing if there was a particular reason and if these features were purposely selected.
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Old December 30, 2019, 12:05 AM   #8
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as described

If all features are as described, I see no advantage. You can't cycle the gun to chamber a round, as from condition zero, and one can't manually cock the gun from condition two, without disengaging the safety first, which adds an extra step prior to making the gun ready for action.
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Old December 30, 2019, 01:02 AM   #9
Jim Watson
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I think it is a side effect of the mechanical design, not an intentional operating mode. Neither bug nor feature. The Star safety does not function at all like a Colt or Browning.
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Old December 30, 2019, 02:20 AM   #10
Bill DeShivs
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The Star safety is actually much better than most safeties. It blocks the hammer fall by using a piece of steel to prevent hammer fall.
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Old December 30, 2019, 11:12 AM   #11
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The Colt .380s - Gov't, Mustang - and their derivatives allow the safety to be engaged with the hammer down, but the slide can't be racked with the hammer down and safety engaged.

If the hammer is cocked, and the safety engaged, the slide can be racked.
I think they have that backwards; I can see a (very) small benefit to being able to engage the safety of a gun in unknown condition, or to load the gun on-safe, but if you have to cock the hammer, then engage the safety, then rack?
I also dislike losing the "slide lock" feature in exchange for rack-on-safe.

I've owned two PDs, and was unaware that it offered conditions of readiness different from a 1911.
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Old December 30, 2019, 01:52 PM   #12
lee n. field
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veprdude View Post
I bought a Star PD in 45ACP. For those who don't know it's like a Commander style 1911 that has some Hi-Power features. It's a single action hammer fired semi-auto.

You can engage the manual safety at all times. (Hammer forward or back)

My 1911s and Hi-Powers won't do this. What's the advantage?
can cycle slide with safety on. (IIRC,YMMV)
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Old December 30, 2019, 02:52 PM   #13
Jim Watson
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Quote:
The Colt .380s - Gov't, Mustang - and their derivatives allow the safety to be engaged with the hammer down,
Those and similar guns from Sig, SA, and Kimber are really more like a Star than a 1911.
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Old December 31, 2019, 01:29 AM   #14
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Almost any "safety" added points for calculating whether it could be imported under GCA 68 implementation rules. As did "target" features like "target grips". So odd things on any imported sidearm may have that points system as part of the design for the US market.

Don't know if this is the case for this pistol but lots of odd "features" at one time came from this stuff.
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Old January 1, 2020, 11:40 AM   #15
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Didn't the points system really only affect compact pistols?
Large guns like the Hi-Power were unscathed, but the "Browning" 1922 sprouted large adjustable sights, thumb-rest grips, etc., to offset the dreaded small size.
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Old January 1, 2020, 01:33 PM   #16
Jim Watson
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Well, length, height, and weight garner import points, so the BHP was importable as was while the .380 had to be messed with.
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