Dent in Shoulder

sbrville · February 4, 2011, 07:31 PM

Hey, i had a box of old 243 casings given to me to reload. Writing on the box looked like they had been reloaded before so i thought it would be a good batch to practice annealing on. I did a light, short anneal on them and thought it went perfect, but when i resized them, 4 got a dent in the shoulder. Are these junk or will they be safe and fire form? i am guessing i got them to soft but i never had them glowing when i heated them. thanks sb

**JohnKSa** · February 4, 2011, 07:38 PM

Pictures would be helpful. Are you sure you didn't just use too much lubricant? That can cause dents sometimes.

sbrville · February 4, 2011, 09:21 PM

this is my second batch of rifle reloads ever so may very well have been to much lube. they seemed tighter in the die.dent1.jpg

dent2.jpg

Brian Pfleuger · February 4, 2011, 09:28 PM

That looks like a dent from excess lube.

The problem with annealing is that there's no such thing as "light and short".

Brass is either not annealed, safely annealed or annealed to the point of being dangerous.

The problem is, the average reloader has no reliable way to now which is which unless you have some specialized equipment. You may have done NOTHING to those cases or they may now be dangerous.

At the very least, you want to have some temperature indicating compound on the neck and preferably the head of the case in a "heatsink", Hornady sells one such system.

tkofoid · February 5, 2011, 08:42 AM

can cause the dents. Annealed brass has soft shoulders, so will dent more easily. Firing the dented brass is usually not a problem, they will fireform very well. As to annealing: I use a 650 degree temp stick purchased at a welding supply store. Apply the crayon just below the shoulder, spin the case over heat, concentrated on the neck, and as soon as the crayon melts, or turns color, it good to go. The crayon sorta stains the brass, but it's Ok.

res45 · February 5, 2011, 09:10 AM

To much case lube generally give you that,also there should be a small air bleed hole on the side of your resizing die between the threads make sure it open.

The cases will be fine after you shoot them and those dents will be gone. It's possible to over anneal the brass and make it to soft and crush the whole shoulder during resizing.

wncchester · February 5, 2011, 09:35 AM

Getting the lube layer right is a learned process but the dents are harmless.

Annealing is easy but it's even easier to do it improperly. Under done means you just got it hot but didn't change anything. Over heating the brass, any visible red glow, just burns the zinc and leaves dead soft copper but it's not unsafe, the body of the case is what does the chamber sealing.

PawPaw · February 5, 2011, 09:50 AM

That looks like a lube dent. I have dies with the air hole on the side, but when I get carried away with the lube, I still get the dents.

They're harmless. Just back off on the lube and don't worry about it. The next time you fire it, the pressure inside the case will take care of the dent.

PA-Joe · February 5, 2011, 10:03 AM

Next time you resize try wiping the neck and shoulders with you fingers to remove the lube.

dahermit · February 5, 2011, 10:09 AM

Confirm, lube dents. They are safe to fire, if your loads are otherwise safe.
Suggestion: If your gun is a bolt action, get a Lee Collet Neck Size die, which requires no lube. In most instances, neck sizing is preferable to full length sizing and using the Lee die, troublesome lubing is no longer involved.

sbrville · February 5, 2011, 02:05 PM

Thanks for all the info. Ill remember for next time. I have a collet neck die but these were fired from another rifle than mine. I will also have to look into a temp stick before i anneal again. thanks again

swmike · February 5, 2011, 03:02 PM

My vote is for "lube dent". On that note, I recently bought a LEE Rifle die kit in .308. The sizing die has a hole drilled in it that relieves the hydraulic pressure caused by too much lube in the shoulder area. None of my .308 cases now get these dents, no matter how careless I am with applying lube.

brickeyee · February 5, 2011, 04:35 PM

If you want to anneal reliably get some TempIlSticks.

A mark on the brass just below the shoulder will change when you hit the sticks temperature.

700cdl · February 5, 2011, 05:36 PM

That dented shoulder is the result of case lube getting on the shoulder or over lubing the case. If the shoulder has lube on it, or if the neck has too much it will push the lube down to the shoulder where it gets trapped during your resize.

February 4, 2011, 07:31 PM	#1
sbrville Junior Member Join Date: February 3, 2011 Posts: 3	Dent in Shoulder Hey, i had a box of old 243 casings given to me to reload. Writing on the box looked like they had been reloaded before so i thought it would be a good batch to practice annealing on. I did a light, short anneal on them and thought it went perfect, but when i resized them, 4 got a dent in the shoulder. Are these junk or will they be safe and fire form? i am guessing i got them to soft but i never had them glowing when i heated them. thanks sb Last edited by sbrville; February 4, 2011 at 07:32 PM. Reason: sp

February 4, 2011, 07:38 PM	#2
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 25,570	Pictures would be helpful. Are you sure you didn't just use too much lubricant? That can cause dents sometimes. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

February 4, 2011, 09:21 PM	#3
sbrville Junior Member Join Date: February 3, 2011 Posts: 3	this is my second batch of rifle reloads ever so may very well have been to much lube. they seemed tighter in the die.dent1.jpg dent2.jpg Last edited by sbrville; February 4, 2011 at 09:27 PM.

February 4, 2011, 09:28 PM	#4
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,694	That looks like a dent from excess lube. The problem with annealing is that there's no such thing as "light and short". Brass is either not annealed, safely annealed or annealed to the point of being dangerous. The problem is, the average reloader has no reliable way to now which is which unless you have some specialized equipment. You may have done NOTHING to those cases or they may now be dangerous. At the very least, you want to have some temperature indicating compound on the neck and preferably the head of the case in a "heatsink", Hornady sells one such system. __________________ https://ecommercearms.com I am the owner/operator! Ask me for custom prices! No sales tax outside CO!

February 5, 2011, 08:42 AM	#5
tkofoid Senior Member Join Date: October 10, 2008 Location: N. D. Posts: 149	Too much lube on the shoulder can cause the dents. Annealed brass has soft shoulders, so will dent more easily. Firing the dented brass is usually not a problem, they will fireform very well. As to annealing: I use a 650 degree temp stick purchased at a welding supply store. Apply the crayon just below the shoulder, spin the case over heat, concentrated on the neck, and as soon as the crayon melts, or turns color, it good to go. The crayon sorta stains the brass, but it's Ok.

February 5, 2011, 09:10 AM	#6
res45 Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2007 Location: NC Posts: 753	To much case lube generally give you that,also there should be a small air bleed hole on the side of your resizing die between the threads make sure it open. The cases will be fine after you shoot them and those dents will be gone. It's possible to over anneal the brass and make it to soft and crush the whole shoulder during resizing. __________________ The Reloaders Network discord Channel https://discord.gg/Nafuzht

February 5, 2011, 09:35 AM	#7
wncchester Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2002 Posts: 2,832	Getting the lube layer right is a learned process but the dents are harmless. Annealing is easy but it's even easier to do it improperly. Under done means you just got it hot but didn't change anything. Over heating the brass, any visible red glow, just burns the zinc and leaves dead soft copper but it's not unsafe, the body of the case is what does the chamber sealing.

February 5, 2011, 09:50 AM	#8
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	That looks like a lube dent. I have dies with the air hole on the side, but when I get carried away with the lube, I still get the dents. They're harmless. Just back off on the lube and don't worry about it. The next time you fire it, the pressure inside the case will take care of the dent.

February 5, 2011, 10:03 AM	#9
PA-Joe Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2010 Location: NEPA Posts: 909	Next time you resize try wiping the neck and shoulders with you fingers to remove the lube.

February 5, 2011, 10:09 AM	#10
dahermit Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2006 Location: South Central Michigan...near Posts: 6,501	Confirm, lube dents. They are safe to fire, if your loads are otherwise safe. Suggestion: If your gun is a bolt action, get a Lee Collet Neck Size die, which requires no lube. In most instances, neck sizing is preferable to full length sizing and using the Lee die, troublesome lubing is no longer involved.

February 5, 2011, 02:05 PM	#11
sbrville Junior Member Join Date: February 3, 2011 Posts: 3	Thanks for all the info. Ill remember for next time. I have a collet neck die but these were fired from another rifle than mine. I will also have to look into a temp stick before i anneal again. thanks again

February 5, 2011, 03:02 PM	#12
swmike Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2005 Location: Marysville, WA Posts: 670	My vote is for "lube dent". On that note, I recently bought a LEE Rifle die kit in .308. The sizing die has a hole drilled in it that relieves the hydraulic pressure caused by too much lube in the shoulder area. None of my .308 cases now get these dents, no matter how careless I am with applying lube.

February 5, 2011, 04:35 PM	#13
brickeyee Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2004 Posts: 3,351	If you want to anneal reliably get some TempIlSticks. A mark on the brass just below the shoulder will change when you hit the sticks temperature.

February 5, 2011, 05:36 PM	#14
700cdl Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2010 Posts: 216	That dented shoulder is the result of case lube getting on the shoulder or over lubing the case. If the shoulder has lube on it, or if the neck has too much it will push the lube down to the shoulder where it gets trapped during your resize.