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September 8, 2016, 10:55 AM | #76 |
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September 8, 2016, 10:55 AM | #77 | |
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Otherwise, both are reliable semi-autos that serve the need (slinging 9mm pills). |
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September 8, 2016, 12:42 PM | #78 |
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I don't fault anyone for what they carry. Everyone has a different mindset, financial situation, body composition, etc. The list of things that play into a person's EDC choice can be a mile long. My rule of thumb to new CCers is this: Find the biggest gun that you won't mind carrying every single day and will never leave at home no matter what you are wearing. For me, that was a CZ75 SP01, it's a tank but I dress around it. The only time I am unable to carry is when I go to the gym and there I couldn't even carry my fiancee's G42, so my CZ stays in the car usually.
And if we're talking about CCW Pistol vs SHTF Sidearm then yes, mine are one in the same.
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September 8, 2016, 09:31 PM | #79 |
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If I was going to war, it would be an issued M4 and M9.
If they gave me a choice, it would be a vehicle mounted PGM. Barring that, mounted Mk-19 or M2HB. Barring mounted weapons, it would be an SBR configured AR-15 variant or 16in AR-10 (depending on the expected terrain.) The pistol would be a double-stack 9mm with a light, good sights, and a decent trigger. My carry gun is a single stack 9mm with good sights and a decent trigger. I trade size and capacity for concealment and comfort, as the risk of conflict goes down. |
September 8, 2016, 09:53 PM | #80 | |
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September 9, 2016, 12:59 AM | #81 | |
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The M&P is lighter, smaller and has an adjustable back strap, all making it more ergonomic than the brick like M9. It makes it easier for females with smaller hands to shoot more accurately. Also makes it easier to carry reducing solider load out weight. The M&P also has a rail for mounting a light or other accessory, is easier to work on and is more weather resistant. But it is cheaper anyway. I don't know what a mi-spec bid edition would look like but as is, I routinely see them for under $400 with three magazines. The M9 is about $600. The M9 was a fine pistol in it's day. That day was the 80s. When reliable polymers came out they immediately starting showing age for police and military work. |
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September 9, 2016, 03:46 AM | #82 |
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I have a lot of nurf guns to go to war with!!! Some are full auto too. Have a mean bubble pistols that shoots full auto too. Bring it on.
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September 9, 2016, 05:44 AM | #83 | |
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Tunnel Rat.
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September 9, 2016, 06:47 AM | #84 |
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My daily (almost) carry is a Springfield Pro. I don't see any reason to change. My oldest son favors an M&P 9mm (due to his experience in the Rangers and of course he's waiting to inherit my Springfield Pro lol). My youngest son likes his G36. Then of course there are our rifles, too many to list
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September 9, 2016, 10:43 AM | #85 | |
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It is not. It carries and fires a similar number of 9mm rounds with practically identical performance and reliability when used in the same role of last-ditch defensive weapon. Everything you mention are incremental improvements at best (and some are potentially detrimental or of no consequence, such as adjustable backstraps, which would only add more parts and complexity to the supply pipeline, or a light rail for pistols that are issued without weaponlights), and don't justify replacement of a system that is practically inconsequential to modern warfare unless there are significant cost savings to be realized. Also, the civilian consumer market prices you mention have no bearing whatsoever on government contract pricing, nor do they take into consideration the replacement of existing holsters, accessories, parts, training, armory support, and other logistical concerns already established with the M9 program. . Last edited by Fishbed77; September 9, 2016 at 10:52 AM. |
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September 9, 2016, 07:25 PM | #86 |
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Okay, I'll play. My usual EDC is a S&W Shield in 9mm. I carry it as opposed to something else because it's 100% reliable (at least through 700 rds), reasonably 'combat' accurate, fits my hand pretty well, and is easily concealed. I especially like its slim profile, which seems to really reduce printing. If it has any drawback at all, it's capacity. At only 8 rds, I usually opt to carry a spare mag.
I don't live or work in risky areas, so I've felt that the Shield was enough gun for my daily needs. On the other hand, if I knew I was going to be in a gunfight tomorrow with an unknown number of assailants, while going about my daily business, I'd probably walk out the door with my Sig P229. Besides it's larger capacity, better sights, better trigger and larger bullets, I can shoot the thing faster and more accurately than my Shield. Or any of my other semis, for that matter, with the exception of my 1911. And again there's that issue of capacity. So if I understand the OP's question correctly, why wouldn't I just carry a little larger gun with better sights, trigger, and more capacity? Well, I guess for me size matters. I'm a medium-sized person living in a desert. For over half the year it's over a hundred degrees, and for a couple months of that it's over a hundred AFTER midnight. Consequently, you wear the lightest and least amount of clothes you can get away with, depending on circumstances. So concealing a full-size gun for my frame is just very difficult. Which is why I carry a Shield. |
September 10, 2016, 03:43 AM | #87 | |
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That price seems like an easy mark to beat for Glock or S&W since their LEO pricing including support services and parts are already well below that price point. Not sure about Ruger. Having run an arms room I understand your comments about the interchangeable backstraps. I have a feeling the Glock will have an edge there since the smallest backstrap is is simply no backstrap at all, while on the M&P it is an actual piece added o the frame of the pistol. At least if Joe loses the backstraps for his Glock the pistol would still be functional. Either way it sounds like a pain in the rear and I foresee arms rooms with ammo cans full of backstraps that have to be accounted for at least once a month.
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September 10, 2016, 07:48 AM | #88 | |
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Strive to carry the handgun you would want anywhere, everywhere; forget that good area bullcrap. "Wouldn't want to / Nobody volunteer to" get shot by _____ is not indicative of quickly incapacitating. |
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September 10, 2016, 08:28 AM | #89 |
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To the OP's question.
I view the EDC concealed pistol like a fire extinguisher. Convenient to have at hand for emergencies, but not what you want if you know the house is going to burst into flames. For that you need a fire TRUCK. So, your EDC is a compromise between concealability/comfort and fight stopping ability. If you KNOW there is going to be trouble (and cant avoid it)...dont rely on ANY handgun. Take the firetruck (rifle) |
September 10, 2016, 08:30 AM | #90 | |||
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Backstraps are nice because people have different sized hands. Females especially with small hands tend to take an unfair beating due to their difficulty in qualifying with a gun that is too large for their hands. I don't see how it would add anything significant to the complexity of the supply line. It is simply another part that won't need to be ordered much. Make it class IX and it won't even have to be counted monthly. Quote:
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September 10, 2016, 08:46 AM | #91 |
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My carry pistol is chosen based on how I will be dressed. If I want to wear clothes that fit correctly rather than baggy, super-casual stuff, I'll wear something small like my new PPS M2. If I want to wear loose fitting stuff, I'll carry my P226. War has nothing to do with it. I would sooner retreat that's fight a large group of large assailants on my own.
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September 10, 2016, 09:07 AM | #92 |
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Most people seemed to answer the question based upon a literal reading of the OP's "go to war," which is, of course, reasonable. However, since he started talking about EDC, I'm going to answer along the lines of those who are assuming that by "go to war" he means 'if you knew that today is the day you'll actually need it'.
I live in MD so I don't have an EDC (I'm a teacher so I can't even EDC a knife and pepper spray without risking becoming a felon if caught). However, when out of state (in most states) I can carry based on my UT non-resident permit. When I carry I have several guns I might carry, but 90% of the time it is either my SIG P290RS or my .45ACP SIG P250 Compact. In a typical self defense situation (one or two attackers) I'd feel pretty comfortable with both. The P290 is much more accurate than such a small gun has a right to be, and the P250 Compact is almost a full-sized gun. The 6+1 or 8+1 rounds of 9mm (depending if I go flush or extended mag) in the P290 should be adequate for a typical 1-2 attacker situation (even with "combat" and not range accuracy) and the 9+1 rounds of .45ACP in my P250 is enough for me to be fully confident in my gun in most typical self-defense situations. That said, if I knew for sure today was the day, I would probably not carry my typical. I'd carry something small and easily concealable if I was home in MD (it would need to be very concealable since it would be illegal and I wouldn't want to be arrested before the situation even happened, but if I knew an attack was coming today and I couldn't avoid it by staying home, I'd rather have something than nothing). If I was carrying out of state and knew in advance today is the day, I'd probably be comfortable with the P250, but I'd rather have a little more capacity in case it wasn't a typical 1-2 attacker situation (which is why I'm in the market for a 10-15 round .40S&W, with the ability to reload with full size/capacity mags, in a similar sized gun). Disclaimer: Now, there have been a few 'don't you think you need more capacity' threads lately (maybe more than usual, maybe I'm just noticing them more since I have lately changed my own thinking to be along those lines), and my reading, and thus answer, for this one is along those lines. While I have decided for myself too that I'd rather have more rounds, I don't think that is necessarily the right answer for everyone and we all need to make our own decisions. It is better to have a gun than no gun. If a bigger and heavier gun means you won't always carry (or worse, often won't), then by all means smaller is better for you. In most cases, we will never need our gun, and if we do, in most cases 5-6 shot capacity will be more than enough (this is why I sometimes feel comfortable carrying a 6 shot revolver in .45LC or .357mag). While some of us have decided (at least most of the time in my case) that more capacity is better, we all need to decide our own limits. A bigger gun is larger and heavier. It may be more capable, but it may not be the best choice for everyone at all times. So, please don't read into anything that I say that I in any way think anyone else should change their choices and make the same decision that I do. |
September 10, 2016, 08:46 PM | #93 |
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I took your meaning as needing the weapon that day. Would I change guns? Maybe. Especially if it was my J-frame which I usually carry when I walk the dog. My edc carry would not leave me in a lurch. {sig239 or s&w3904}
4 or 5 armed morons, I'm probably dead no matter what.
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September 11, 2016, 12:58 AM | #94 |
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The Glock 17/22 platform without a back strap sleeve is amazingly concealable under a polo shirt. I am shocked at how well my Generation 4 Glock 22 conceals.
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September 11, 2016, 02:04 PM | #95 | ||
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And here all this time I thought the multiple levels of security just to get to the front door at work or into my neighborhood had something to do with it. Good catch. |
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September 12, 2016, 11:46 AM | #96 | ||||
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And you're right - they probably won't be ordered much, because when soldiers inevitably lose or break them, they won't be replaced, and you'll end up with a confusing mishmash of differently configured pistols. Quote:
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Besides, many of the aircraft the F-35 will be replacing have been in service much longer than the M9 pistol. You can argue until you are blue in the face that the "the M&P would be worlds ahead of the M9," but it simply is not true unless purchasing them could be proven to save a considerable amount of money over the M9 and its established infrastructure. . Last edited by Fishbed77; September 12, 2016 at 11:54 AM. |
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September 13, 2016, 12:19 AM | #97 |
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I prefer carry vs. home defense gun comparisons, as I don't plan on attending a war. For carry it is usually a CZ-75D PCR which can also double as an HD and range gun. However, I typically use a full size CZ-75 pre B, or 75B for home defense backed up by an M1 Carbine and Colt LE6920/M4.
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September 13, 2016, 10:07 AM | #98 |
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To the OP- yes, there are different circumstances.
I live in south Louisiana. During regular times, if I were to CCW, it would be something small; for example something like a surplus Polish P64. Small, compact pistol holding 6 rds of an acceptable (for me) caliber, 9x18 makarov. It's operated reliably, it is small enough to slip inside a pocket if need be, in fact it's my smallest centerfire pistol. I'm just into collecting and shooting for fun, and during such times, I've never felt I HAD to CCW. The closest I do is carry inside my vehicle, and that would tend to be a CZ-82; again a 9x18 Mak pistol, a bit larger but still fairly small, 12 rd magazine. It's there in the event I have to stop in parts of town I normally would avoid; car problems, etc. Because of the layout of the city, I do have to cross some rough areas to travel from my house to most destinations, so it is an unavoidable possibility. One I've never had to defend myself in, thankfully. We currently are still a disaster area after the floods, and I also remember how things were whenever hurricanes hit. In the Post-Katrina time period, people were angry and not particularly law-abiding across all segments of society (to say it in a polite way). People would flip you off and curse you, just because you drove past them in the street. Generators that were running on houses would walk off, if they weren't chained to the house securely. Many folks had lost everything, and/or had their treasures lying out in the open to try to salvage. During such times as this, I do sometimes feel the need to carry, and it is open. Fullsize CZ 75, Beretta 92 or similar, in a good retention belt holster, and sometimes 12 gauge pump with an 18 inch barrel close at hand. An AR wouldn't be out of place, instead of the shotgun. Not for going to the store, but for reminding the wandering 2 legged stray dogs that my property isn't easy pickings. The firearm I choose in this case is larger (as I said, fullsized), will carry a full 18+ rds of 9mm JHP that I've confirmed it feeds well, is clearly visible and recognizable (and hopefully a deterrent to random stragglers who are looking for easy targets), and I have already determined I can shoot accurately, quickly, and with no problems. Regarding the weight, it's no heavier than any number of other tool I may have on a belt at this time. This still isn't "going to war", but it's a big step above normalcy... and it unfortunately does happen at times. |
September 13, 2016, 05:21 PM | #99 | |
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You young ones go to war . Us real senior citizens will stay home and guard the ladies
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September 13, 2016, 11:21 PM | #100 | ||
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From "We the people" ;
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But when the op got to his choices he was pretty good, he said... Quote:
Risk assessment, it's an important skill. Takes some time to acquire it. The internet is not a good instructor of it. tipoc |
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concealed carry , semiautomatic |
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