Bin Laden is dead!

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Let's keep it together. Dumping him in the ocean makes sense.

As far as 10 years and so what, from a poster - I supposed the Israelis executing Eichmann in 1962 also made no sense?

Sometimes folks just like to be contrarian on the Internet as they like that game but make fools of themselves when doing it.

This was a good thing. It didn't solve all our problems and more problems may come - but it was a good thing and we should be proud of those involved.

[flight954]

Ironic right before PBO goes on the campaign trail

[mrgoodwrench76]

As far as 10 years and so what, from a poster - I supposed the Israelis executing Eichmann in 1962 also made no sense?

Sometimes folks just like to be contrarian on the Internet as they like that game but make fools of themselves when doing it.

And this is exactly what I meant by my first post on this thread. Dont bother to share your opinion unless its mainstream or you like being attacked. What a joke. Sometimes folks just like to poke fun at those that dont share the same opinion.

[22-rimfire]

I was pleased with the news. The thing that troubles me is that it apparently took the US many months (August 2010 > April 2011) to act on a lead. I realize a lead is a lead and it has to be checked out and verified. That is a long time. What if they weren't successful? We wouldn't have heard anything one way or the other.

[kinggabby]

If chest pounding is wrong then label me wrong. There are several people in history that are dead that lived way too long. Hitler, Saddam Hussein and Bin Laden and people like them who want to kill innocent people. My prayers go out to any hurt from any evil man/woman. But my hand pounds on my chest at the same time. And I like what I saw reported... " American bullet to his head".Hats off to our military boys and their guns and their AMERICAN BULLET.

[oldkim]

The service members that performed their duty... did their duty.

No medals will be awarded (not in public anyways). No recognition except themselves knowing what truly happened over there.

This was and is a classified mission.

I fear that with modern technology and those that are very loosed lipped will let that information out.

Please don't go there... do not release or re-send that information. So if you find it on the net. Let it alone.

The folks did their job... our job is to respect that... and let them continue (not in the lime light).

As we discuss the ramifications of what may or may not happen... we know certainly that these men and women involved in this action will become targets, if we announce it to the world...

Stay safe... Enjoy the Freedom of being American! But be mindful and respectful to those that served and put their lives in harms way. In knowing that they have (put themselves in harms way)... we don't need to throw them under a bus...

Freedom is not free. Choices of Freedom do comes with consequences.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

I'm not poking fun at anyone, this is too serious. If you post your opinion and it is not in accord with many - that's the way it goes.

However, putting my psych hat on - there are folks who just like to argue, even an incorrect viewpoint. If you do that, be honest and evaluate your motives.

If you truly believe what you say - stand up for it and take the heat. Don't complain that you get it.

Why did it take 10 years? Multiple causality - incompetence from some, collusion by supposed allies. Clever action by our enemies - interesting to parse but that doesn't take away from the result now - which is a damn good one.

In the abstract it is sad and not good that people have to kill people. However, until the laws of human behavior are changed, killing will occur.

Given we are a gun forum, we accept that some actions have to be met with potentially lethal force. This is a case of that.

[doofus47]

Good riddance.
"Good job" to our people that did the dangerous work yesterday.

I guess the pundits who thought obama was a secret muslim plotting the downfall of the US are feeling a little frustrated right now trying to stuff their square opinion into a round hole.

[Mike Irwin]

"And this is exactly what I meant by my first post on this thread. Dont bother to share your opinion unless its mainstream or you like being attacked. What a joke. Sometimes folks just like to poke fun at those that dont share the same opinion."

Please show us exactly where you are being attacked.

What I'm seeing is that you have posted your thoughts on the subject, and other members have called on you to provide an explanation of what YOU would have done differently that would have resulted in Bin Laden's capture/death before the 10 year span had passed.

How would you have prosecuted the search any more effectively in some of the harshest terrain on earth?

How would you have prosecuted the search in an area where most residents are, if not outright hostile, pretty unfriendly?

How would you have developed intelligence resources that would have resulted in a faster capture?

I think those are valid questions to be asked of you since you're obviously not happy with the steps that led up to the end result.

[MarineCorpsAT]

There was celebration in my house last night. This POS did not deserve to be on this planet.

I for one am glad that he was taken out and not captured. As long as he was alive he had a voice now once and for all that voice is silent.

Is this over.. No, far from it. But it does demonstrate that if you attack America we wil;l not rest until you are dealt with.

Great job to those that participated in this operation and those serving worldwide.

[THEZACHARIAS]

Bin Laden hasn't been missing for 10 years. In December 2001, Chuck Norris round-house kicked Osama 10 years into the future and gave Special Forces Command the time date and location he would re-appear.

[lawnboy]

I find it interesting that some have complained about it taking 10 years, and that we shouldn't believe everything the media feeds us while others have lamented that if this particular operation had not been successful we'd have never heard anything about it. Others have worried about security leaks giving out classified info about the operation.

All are valid points, but I personally believe that the entire US War on Terror has been borderline brilliant. There have been bobbles for sure, but the overall strategy has worked beautifully, right in the open under everyones nose.

After 9/11 all were thinking about continuing attacks. We were seeing evacuations of office buildings, shopping malls, etc. We expected the enemy to make attempts on the crowd at sporting events. We expected hostage takers at schools, theatres and other soft targets. We expected additional attacks on mass transit. Our dams and public utilities were considered vulnerable.

None of that happened. There were no more attacks in the US. Some of this was due to increased vigilance.

But most of it was due to the fact that the flower of Islamo-fascist youth and strength was spending itself in Afghanistan and Iraq. They were spending themselves attacking the hardest of hard targets: well armed, trained and equipped US troops in a combat zone.

Osama bin Laden had the intelligence to focus on the weakness of the United States. Our Freedom and resulting complacency. But he underestimated the resiliency and sheer power of his enemy. His attack worked. Unfortunately for him.

The response to his attack on 9/11 shifted the "war" from ground of Osama's choosing to ground of OUR choosing. Sure we could have built walls, locked the border down and put MP5 carrying troops in critical areas. But instead the United States did what only the United States could do. We put those troops in the enemy's backyard and took the fight to him, forcing the enemy to come out and respond, and be killed. I'm surprised Sun Tzu didn't rise from his grave and salute. Only the US could drop hundreds of thousands of troops in the enemy's country like that. We exploited our strength and fought the enemy where he didn't want to fight.

And the media and public largely have missed the brilliance of the strategy.

I, for one, do not expect the US military and it's commanders to be honest with "the public". I'd think they were idiots if they were. I rely on the officers and men to reveal any gross departure from American values eventually. In the meantime I expect the commanders to use subterfuge, camouflage, lies, cheats and disinformation at all times. Anything less would be unacceptable. This is war.

Go USA.

[Brian48]

Hat's off to our military and intelligence service. They took their time and did it right. Scratch one less scum bucket from the world. Alas though, the war will continue, but at least the families of 9/11 can have a little closure today.

[22-rimfire]

The President (I thought) indicated that the bin Laden operation occurred in the last week and we weren't informed until his identity was verified (DNA). I read that this operation happened yesterday, not in the last week. I don't think I mis-understood the President, but having the operation conducted only yesterday (Presidential approval on Thursday) puts things into a different light in terms of how quickly and decisively the President and US military acted on intellegence information.

Article: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._lnk3%7C211800

[old bear]

great day to be an American!

Yes it is but everyday is a great day to be an American.

we'll kill anyone we decide needs killing, no matter where they are - sort of a surprise coming from Obama...

The man may not be everyone's cup of tea, but I think he may well be tougher than many have given him credit for.

As for me I feel a great sense of relief.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by Double Naught Spy

Well, have you forgotten how much Al Queda operates on the concept of retalliation? This has the potential to spur new terrorist attacks against the US and because the US is so short memoried, we will likely be out snoozing by the pool in 4 or 5 or 10 years, completely taken by surprise (again), when the attack comes in the name of Bin Laden's martyered death.

All too true.

But the flip side is that Bin Laden had taken on an aura of invincibility. Because the U.S. had vowed to "get" him and wasn't able to even find him, his supporters and followers viewed him as charmed, as a symbol that their cause was "righteous" and that OBL was protected by Allah.

What's going to be interesting is two things:

1) The hard-core zealots will, of course and as you say, use this as justification for more attacks on the west and, in particular, the U.S. and Americans everywhere. It will be interesting to see how their language justifies this.

2) Other elements within Islam recognize that (according to Islam) everything that occurs is because of the will of Allah. Bin Laden claimed that the World Trade Center attack succeeded because it was the will of Allah. Since EVERYTHING is the will of Allah, and since OBL is now dead by an American bullet, that is also the will of Allah. So it'll be interesting to see if the Islamic world accepts it as the will of Allah.

Originally Posted by Ecclesiastes 3:1-8

To everything there is a season,
a time for every purpose under the sun.
A time to be born and a time to die;
a time to plant and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
a time to kill and a time to heal ...
a time to weep and a time to laugh;
a time to mourn and a time to dance ...
a time to embrace and a time to refrain from embracing;
a time to lose and a time to seek;
a time to rend and a time to sew;
a time to keep silent and a time to speak;
a time to love and a time to hate;
a time for war and a time for peace.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by DNS

Fighting back is good. Not all fighting is ideal, however. A capture would have been much better than a kill. Having him put on trial and then dying by execution and not in a perceived glorious manner would have been much better.

No.

Having him simply disappear, such that nobody officially knew what happened to him but the whole world knew that he isn't making any more videos and that nobody had seen him for oh-so-long, would have been better.

[Buzzcook]

provide an explanation of what YOU would have done differently that would have resulted in Bin Laden's capture/death before the 10 year span had passed.

Hind sight would indicate that there were several courses we could have followed.

My personal favorite would have been if the Bush administration had allowed General Shinseki to do his job instead of fighting Rumsfeld's going in light war.

Following some of the suggestions of the Kidd letter would have been a good idea as well.
http://www.newtotalitarians.com/inde...fghanistan.htm

Removing troops from Afghanistan just before Tora Bora was probably a mistake.

Finally trusting Pakistans intelligence community was probably a mistake.
http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/20...or-complicity/

Unfortunately we don't have a way-back machine.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by mrgoodwrench76

All I see here is 5 pages of people who will beleive anything the media tells them.

We DIDN'T kill him, then?

[globemaster3]

Wow! I didn't discover the news until I got up this morning for unit PT.

In my 16.5 years on active duty, I've gone from 1 deployment to another during my operational tours supporting SOUTHERN WATCH, NORTHERN WATCH, OEF, and OIF. Now I've seen both of the instigators responsible for my constant departure from my family put to death.

I feel very satisfied about that. But I also see the still-long road ahead.

Although our country is united again for a brief period to celebrate, the job is far from over, and UBL will be replaced by someone else who will promote the same ideology and carry the fight forward. It's not like there is a finite number of these radicals and once we scratch all of them off the list, we can call it complete.

As for killing him on the spot vs bringing back to trial; he was too dangerous to let live. To keep him alive would have tempted terrorist ops to recover him or afforded him opportunities for publicity. To kill him outright ends his influence, once and for all. And dumping his body in the ocean, although dissapointing on a certain level, ensures there won't be a shrine erected to him that all radical militants can point to and draw inspiration from.

Finally, thanks to the mods for allowing this discussion.

[oneoldsap]

A MEN !!!! I heard on the news this morning that there were no Friendly Casualities , as a result of this operation ! Now that can't happen unless GOD goes with you ! This is the brightest Monday that I've seen in 10 Years !! E PLURIBUS UNUM , Together we are one ! Oh one more thing , I'll wager that every member of that team was a Volunteer !

[SPUSCG]

when is the "video proof" being released? Youd expect that to be done, the "yeah we dumped him in the ocean" thing with not even a photo is weird. BTW wwhere was pakistan in this, the military right down the road and all....

[oneoldsap]

Let them get all bent out of shape and attack us from all directions ! At least when they attack we know where they are ! They have to come into the open to attack , and to quote my nephew " if we can see em we can kill em " we can see in the dark , they can't ! Bring It !!!!!

[Tom Servo]

BTW wwhere was pakistan in this, the military right down the road and all.

Abbottabad, about 150km north of Islamabad. It's hardly a cave in the mountains: they have college campuses, football stadiums, and an active tourist culture. Bin Laden was living well, and under protection. We can bet that plenty of locals knew he was there and chose to keep quiet.

Pervez Musharraf this morning complained that we violated his country's sovereignty by this action, but we should keep those facts in mind when considering his words. I'm not saying that the Pakistani government was protecting bin Laden in an official capacity, but I also find it hard to believe they didn't have some idea of where he was. Some secrets are too big to be kept.

So it'll be interesting to see if the Islamic world accepts it as the will of Allah.

Will of Allah or not, many Muslims are just as glad as we are that the guy is out of the picture. Most I've met are despondent at the way Wahhabism has distorted the religion and its tenets.

[5RWill]

Lawnboy i completely agree, great post.

I also want to see the video... more precisely the entire raid, which more than likely wont happen but.. i would still like to see it.