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Old November 22, 2019, 12:48 PM   #76
JDBerg
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When Wally’s announced that they were discontinuing ammo sales, I overreacted and bought up more WWB than I probably should have, so I plan on using it up.

Where I live I don’t have a lot of options for buying ammo so I guess I’ll be paying significantly more for what’s available from very limited sources.
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Old November 22, 2019, 04:38 PM   #77
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I've used WWB for years and, though it might not be my first choice for self-defense duties, the stuff works fine in all of my many and different handguns. I don't dispute the experiences of others but I do think that WWB is not nearly as bad (again, not bad at all imo) as some on the internet allege. If it was truly as bad as some folks report, it would never survive in the market place.
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Old November 22, 2019, 07:56 PM   #78
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Thought I'd add to dglud's post: I've used WWB for years in a number of calibers and have had no problems with it. In .45 ACP, it's as accurate as some of my best hand loads in fact. In 9mm, it's as good as Federal American Eagle 115 gr FMJ.

Additionally, in my P365 with a 2/19 build date, I'm over 1200 rounds now, of 115 & 124 gr mixed reloads & commercial loads, about equally divided between JHPs and FMJ's, and with a significant number (approx. > 300 rounds) of cast LSWC's. It's been a great pistol for my CC needs and fills that role daily. YMMv. Rod
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Old November 23, 2019, 09:02 AM   #79
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Happy Thanksgiving Monty and L-2,

When I was in business of catching bad guys, I've carried on-duty at least four handguns manufactured by S&W, Sig, and H&K. My absolute favorite was my Sig P229 .40 S&W. I had and still have complete confidence in it. I have no clue of how many thousands of rounds I've fired through it with 100% reliability. The H&K USP .45 ACP and S&W 5904 were superb and flawless weapons. But my Sig P229 was my favorite. I had complete confidence in it. All three were/are more reliable than any revolver I've carried and owned/own.

At one time, possibly though the early 21st century, Sig was the definitive name in double-action semiautomatic law enforcement handguns. Of late, I've become aware of diminished quality control at Sig.

I have not read every post in this thread. I rarely read all posts in threads before offering an opinion. Who has that much time?

Having a Sig armorer examine Monty's gun is an option. However, were I Monty, I'd go with a POST certified armorer every time.

Every single problem I've had with a handgun (all were revolvers) save one I had repaired by POST certified armorers, all of whom were retired cops who had/have taken retirement gigs with my former agency. The lone exception was a Springfield Armory EMP 3. I knew it would probably have uncorrected problems before I bought it. If Springfield Armory had corrected design flaws common to the original version of the EMP 3l, CA DOJ would have considered it a new handgun. As a new handgun, it would have had to have been equipped with microstamping, a nonexistent technology. Hence, CA DOJ would not have allowed and will not allow a flawless version of the SA EMP 3 to have been sold/to be sold within CA. I was elated that Springfield Armory kept the EMP 3's original design for sale only in CA, flaws and all, because it allowed me to buy a copy. Springfield Armory's customer service is exemplary. I shipped my EMP 3 to Springfield Armory at its expense. Within two weeks, Springfield Armory's Custom Shop returned a flawless EMP 3 to me. It is a Custom Shop EMP 3. It has been 100% flawless thanks to Springfield Armory's Customer Service and artisans at Springfield Armory's Custom Shop. Every other Springfield Armory handgun I own has been flawless. I can't write that about S&W revolvers. I've had two that have suffered catastrophic failures and were repaired by my former agency's armorers.

My advice to cops is always go to their agency's POST certified armorers. Most armorers are retired cops. They know of the extreme importance of firearm reliability. They are ethically committed to officer survival. If a cop were to bring a junk gun to an agency's POST certified armorer, such an armorer would tell the cop to trash a junk gun that might used to save his life. POST armorers are not bound by manufacturer loyalty. They're bound by professional and ethical commitment to officer survival.

I'm honorably retired. I hold retirement credentials from my former agency. Hence, I'm viewed as an employee when it comes to retirement-carry handguns After I received my Springfield Armory custom Shop EMP 3, I asked one of my former agency's armorers to examine it for reliability. He is a retired cop. He disassembled it. examined every part of it, reassembled it, and told me that it was a perfect gun. I took it to my former agency's range and put about 150-200 rounds through it, range and duty ammo, without a single issue.

That's why I recommended a POST certified armorer examine Monty's gun.

I've read about too many defective guns that were returned to their factories and then returned to their owners with problems uncorrected along with manufacturers' claims that their guns met or exceeded manufacturers' standards, which were obviously inferior to PSOT armorer standards.

BTW, my former agency's armorers would not and will not approve for duty and off-duty use any handgun that did not/does not meet or exceed their agency's standards of reliability. POST armorers are only concerned with officer survival, not brand loyalty.

BTW, there were two armorers on duty at the time I brought my Custom Shop EMP 3 in for reliability inspection. Both agreed that the Springfield Armory TRP .45 was among the best (the best) on-duty law enforcement handguns. They said that simplicity of 1911-A1 design combined with Springfield Armory's unrivaled quality control created a perfect handgun. Based up their professional opinion, I bought a Springfield Armory TRP .45 ACP. They were 100% right. That gun is flawless. It has become my primary carry handgun when I'm fishing the Eastern Sierra and Rockies. The Springfield Armory TRP is the factory production version of its famed Custom Shop FBI gun. Springfield Armory's FBI gun bested all entries, including Wilson Combat, in that agency's vigorous firearms test. It was selected as the official handgun for specialized FBI units and many LE SWAT teams. In essence, one could pay twice as much for another brand, but he would not be buying a better gun than Springfield Armory's FBI gun. In fact, he might be paying twice as much for an inferior gun.

Monty, the above is a lengthy explication of diplomatically opining that it might be wise to sell your problem Sig and replace it with an EMP 3. Especially off-duty, without body armorer and no back-up, a completely reliable handgun is absolutely essential. I've long ago retired what was once the quintessential off-duty cop gun, an S&W Model 60, after reluctantly accepting the fact that it was a poor choice for saving my life. I'd sell it, but its sentimental value prevents me from parting with it.

BTW, Monty, besides its complete reliability, my EMP 3 is phenomenally accurate.

Monty, my primary concern is that you always return home to your family.


Stay safe my brother,

SATRP
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Old November 23, 2019, 10:37 AM   #80
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I’ll give you $100 for it.
LOL, I will give him 125 bucks....send it my way!!!
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Old November 23, 2019, 12:49 PM   #81
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I have not read every post in this thread. I rarely read all posts in threads before offering an opinion. Who has that much time?
So, you're admitting you offer opinions without knowing what is being talked about? Ok......

Would you do those of us who aren't former lawmen (which I think includes most of us who do read all these posts) the favor of explaining just what a "POST armorer" is, and what makes their opinions holy writ to you?
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Old November 23, 2019, 12:52 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by 44 AMP View Post
So, you're admitting you offer opinions without knowing what is being talked about? Ok......



Would you do those of us who aren't former lawmen (which I think includes most of us who do read all these posts) the favor of explaining just what a "POST armorer" is, and what makes their opinions holy writ to you?
Yeah...given that the word (acronym?) is used enough times to almost kill a person were he to take a shot each time it was used I can't seem to find it mentioned elsewhere.

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Old November 23, 2019, 02:23 PM   #83
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44 AMP,

I know the topic of discussion, and I also know that you what to control what's discussed.

Scroll down to armorer courses:

https://catalog.post.ca.gov/TitleInd...dex=A&pageId=2

A sharp pistolero like you should have fleshed this out without guidance.
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Old November 23, 2019, 02:26 PM   #84
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TunnelRat,



This might help: enter. "POST armorer" into a search engine and see what returns.
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Old November 23, 2019, 03:11 PM   #85
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Typing Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training would have been just as easy as telling him to look it up himself.
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Old November 23, 2019, 03:39 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by SATRP View Post
TunnelRat,



This might help: enter. "POST armorer" into a search engine and see what returns.
I did. I get a lot of links that have nothing to do with POST and the one link you provided shows up as well about midway down. Heck, even the link you gave doesn't explain the acronym in the header of the page or at the Home screen. If I scroll all the way to the bottom of the course page, go to the POST website (which doesn't show up in the Google results), and then go to the About section I get this. https://post.ca.gov/About-Us. You'll have to forgive me for not knowing an acronym which seems particular to California law enforcement.

Thanks to JN.

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Old November 23, 2019, 05:53 PM   #87
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I don't know about you all but I DO NOT Carry FMJ!
I do-and though I have my own good reasons to do so, I'm not going to argue with you about it. Been down that road way too often...
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Old November 23, 2019, 07:00 PM   #88
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Sorry to hear you're having trouble with yours. Just got back from the range. I had little bits of leftover odds and ends 9mm ammo, including bulk pack, reloads, choke causing flat nose and, gnarly discolored old stuff, in varying weights, to use up. I loaded the mags with a random mix of everything. Not one hiccup.
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Old January 2, 2020, 02:07 PM   #89
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UPDATE 12/30/2019:

Finally got some time to get back to the range since getting it back from Sig. Testing consisted of 250 rds, 50 American Eagle 147g, 50 WWB 115, 50 Rem UMC 115g, 50 Sig 115g P365 ammo, 50 Blazer Brass 115g. No malfunctions. Sig smith reported that gun was ultrasonically cleaned, test-fired with 90 rounds and cleaned again and sent back to my FFL. I didn’t mark any parts (should have) but upon inspection I think the recoil spring was replaced. Smith did not indicate that it was on his report though. Whatever the case I’m happy now with no malfunctions. I will run another 250-500 through it before I make it my carry, but at least it appears as though whatever the issue was, is solved.
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Old January 4, 2020, 06:29 PM   #90
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MontyCop05: I'm totally unfamiliar with your gun. Despite our requirement that a 9x19 gun be able to operate fine with 115 grain bullets, sometimes we must use 124-grain ammo for an evaluation.

Edited after reading your last post----
Glad it has worked out for you.
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Old January 4, 2020, 08:55 PM   #91
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I will run another 250-500 through it before I make it my carry, but at least it appears as though whatever the issue was, is solved.
Excellent, news. Glad SIG stood by their product.

Meanwhile the Internet pontification will continue.
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Old January 4, 2020, 10:37 PM   #92
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"Meanwhile the Internet pontification will continue."

Of course it will......this is the internet!
Oh, while I'm at it......my 43X has passed 3000 rounds without a hiccup.
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Old January 5, 2020, 01:32 AM   #93
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Do you guys keep a piece of almost each handgun ammo box, to have a very close estimate?

My plastic bags with bits of each cardbox box are labeled "CZ PCR", "Sig P6" etc.
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Old January 5, 2020, 07:58 AM   #94
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Of course, the internet being what it is. I'd call it 'pontification' IF Sig gave people having problems with the 365(and 320(M17) and 238 and 365SAS)the 'thousand yard stare', and shrugged, 'never heard of that', type stuff. But kudos to Sig, they recognized these 3(4?) had issues, well documented and frequent, and did something about it...

BUT, yes, issues(continue with M17?) evident ..but addressed.

I won't mention my pistol success rate cuz it tweaks 'some'...
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Old January 5, 2020, 01:52 PM   #95
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"Do you guys keep a piece of almost each handgun ammo box, to have a very close estimate?"

Back when I had less than 5 handguns, I kept detailed records of rounds shot; including mfg, bullet type and weight, etc. Now with 10x as many pistols, I only keep track of approx. rounds fired for 1 or 2 guns, high-volume carry pieces, usually.
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Old January 5, 2020, 01:56 PM   #96
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I have a spreadsheet.

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Old January 5, 2020, 07:46 PM   #97
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Problems with Sig P365

Cancel that. Looks like problem solved. Recoil spring?
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