Shotgun reloading data?

std7mag · March 30, 2019, 04:37 PM

Ok, yes i know it's strange coming from me, but i'm looking for load data for shotguns.
I know a lot has to do with who makes the hull, wad used, and length of hull, shot load in ounces.
Looking at Alliant, i can't find any data for 3 inch 20 gage.
Looking for a good heavy turkey load. Thinking #5 shot.

I'll be using a Lee Loadall. I also note that Alliant doesn't list what bushing to use with their newer powders.

So, where would one find shotshell data that's up to date?

Thanks!

RaySendero · March 30, 2019, 05:08 PM

what hull do you want to load?

std7mag · March 30, 2019, 05:24 PM

Reallisticly, i don't know yet.
Haven't gotten any yet. Or wads, or shot. Heck, still waiting on the CZ720 i ordered, and the loader.

Unless i want Win or Rem 7.5 shot, ammo hard to find around here.
Looking at MidwayUSA, $10-30 for a box of 5-10 shells for turkey. Plus shipping.
Reloading becomes a no-brainer.

big al hunter · March 30, 2019, 06:31 PM

I found several loads on Hodgdon's website. It's under load data. But it only has Hodgdon's powders. Lyman has a heap of shotgun data in their shotgun manual.

std7mag · March 30, 2019, 07:10 PM

Thanks!
I'll check out Lyman and Hogdgdon.

Not worried about using Hodgdon powder. Just looking for data for some safe loads.

FrankenMauser · March 30, 2019, 07:18 PM

The Lyman shot shell manual has no 20 ga 3" data.

I just went through every manual that I own, including several shotgun-only manuals. The only one with 20 ga 3" data is the Hodgdon "Basic Reloading Manual" (for Hodgdon, IMR, and Winchester powders) that you used to be able to have mailed to you. This one's dated Jan 2010. It's a duplicate of what's on their website, minus the newer powders.

Beyond that online data, I have no suggestions ... except, maybe, something from BPI. But, even then, you have to figure out which manual will have the data. ...It's probably worth giving them a call and asking if the data is even there - and where - before considering a purchase.

Edit: I see the Hodgdon 2017 "Basic Reloading Manual" available for free on the BPI website. So, perhaps, it may still be available from Hodgdon.

std7mag · March 30, 2019, 08:42 PM

When i saw the picture of the Hodgdon reloading booklet, i recognized it.
I asked the Mrs if she remembered seeing it.
Found it.
No 3" shells for 20ga. Heaviest load is 1oz.

Trying to track down Lyman info.

Thanks!

Marco Califo · March 30, 2019, 10:38 PM

Alliant 1992 has 20 gauge 3" Loads for Federal Paper Hulls. Probably more.
http://www.castpics.net/LoadData/Fre...M/Alliant.html
But seriously, for birds like ducks and geese I bought a Benelli 12 gauge 3 1/2" pump gun.
I think the learning bit here is that 20 gauge is not the best Turkey gun.

std7mag · March 30, 2019, 11:26 PM

I've luckily done it before with my Hawthorne bolt action 410.

My issue is I'm not the best caller. My neighbor is. But he refuses to go with me if I take the 410.

That and I figured if i had another shotgun of my own that I enjoy shooting, i may do more small game hunting.

Marco Califo · March 30, 2019, 11:37 PM

3" 20 g Store bought Turkey loads.
https://www.midwayusa.com/s?targetLo...ItemsPerPage=0

RaySendero · March 31, 2019, 08:13 AM

I reload a lot of shotgun shells.
But personally, I just buy my the turkey loads.

Doesn't take many rounds to get turkeys for the whole season.
So no reason to keep up with another different powder and wads
just for this small volume.

Another reason is to try different loads in your gun.
Shotguns can be picky as to what load patterns best.
Once you find 1 that's really good
You may not be able to duplicate it.

David R · March 31, 2019, 08:30 AM

I have the LYMAN shot shell handbook. PM me with what you have and I will try to help you out. I loaded some 20 guage 3" loads with #5 for squirrel. It was a little too much. I think they were Federal hulls.
David

Sent from my SM-T900 using Tapatalk

FrankenMauser · March 31, 2019, 12:34 PM

Quote:

I have the LYMAN shot shell handbook. PM me with what you have and I will try to help you out.

Hopefully it's a newer version with 20 ga 3" data.
I have the 3rd Edition. There's no data for this particular application (nor 3" slugs, for that matter).

std7mag · March 31, 2019, 09:32 PM

As i mentioned, i don't HAVE anything as of yet.
Wanted to look at data, to see what components i do want to get.
I have read that different manufacture/model hulls make a difference, same with wads.

I'm gonna call CAC Associates tomorrow. (www.cacassociatesinc.com) They are a local distributor that carries a lot of shotshell reloading components.

RaySendero · April 2, 2019, 01:32 PM

Quote:

std7mag wrote:

I'm gonna call CAC Associates tomorrow. (www.cacassociatesinc.com) They are a local distributor that carries a lot of shotshell reloading components.

std7mag, If I can't talk U into just buying Ur turkey loads, I'll ry to help.

I'm looking at my Lyman 4th Shotshell Reloading book.
Page 220 starts the 3" 20 gauge recipes.
It shows both 1-1/8 and 1-1/4 ounces.

I think for turkeys you'll want the 1-1/4 lead:
Shows 3 cases: Federal, Remington Unibody and Win Compression Formed
& these are mixed w/ Remington and Winchester wads.
Powder choices are slim for the 1-1/4s
w/ Blue Dot being common to all 3 cases.
Other powders shown are: SR4756, 800X, HS7 and 2400

U can cross-check this list with that of Ur local distributor.

RC20 · April 2, 2019, 02:08 PM

Curious, with the price of powder, does it make sense to load shotgun shells?

Never did it just interested in the cost part.

FrankenMauser · April 2, 2019, 03:01 PM

Powder's cheap. Wads are cheap. Hulls are cheap. Primers aren't bad.
Shot is where the expense is.

If you just shoot cheap stuff, you'll rarely be able to reload for less than factory (even if using reclaimed shot).
But... If you want to tune a load to pattern as well as possible, or you shoot a lot of expensive stuff (like buckshot, slugs, .410, etc.), it can be well worth it.

FITASC · April 2, 2019, 05:39 PM

How much are you planning on reloading? The LLA sucks; it is plastic and cheap zinc; but if you're planning on a few boxes a years, then fine (although for a few boxes, just buy it)

Quote:

I loaded some 20 guage 3" loads with #5 for squirrel. It was a little too much

GEEZ, ya think? That is a hardy pheasant load

First, this is NOT metallic; so determine your load and go to the various powder maker sites like Hodgdon and Alliant and look for data - in 20, Remington hulls will be the best
then look for the powder and shot load that gives you the desired fps you want (you will still need to pattern) you will then get the wad, primer, etc., data you need

SHR970 · April 2, 2019, 08:09 PM

If you want to go this route think Federal paper basewad, Cheddite, Fiocchi shells all Reifenhauser type (AKA Eurotrash) hulls. These will combine nicely with Longshot or Blue Dot powders and WAA20 or Rem SP20 (or claybuster equivilent) wads for the best velocities. LS and BD powders both drop close enough to the LLA powder bushings to be "let's see on the pattern board".

Edit to add: Nickel plated shot is best, Copper plated next.....magnum aka hard shot after that. It does and will make a difference going through the choke and feathers assuming head and neck hits don't do the job.

**44 AMP** · April 2, 2019, 09:05 PM

I have some 3" 20ga data (1 1/8oz) in my 1970 Lyman manual. Not going to list it here, because its a bit out of date. (and, I don't think you can get the wads they used anymore....)

One thing I need to mention, is that reloading shotshells is NOT the same as reloading metallic cartridges. The tested loads are VERY specific, and every one I've seen in decades all have the same warning, DO NOT CHANGE ANY COMPONENTS! Only the size of shot can be changed, change ANYTHING else and the load is "invalid", and could generate dangerous pressures.

Unlike metallic cartridges, where you can change components (case brand, primer, bullet brand etc.,) and reduce the load and work back up, with shot shells, changing the case, primer, wad, wad pressure, anything (but the shot size), CAN change pressures, possibly dangerously. Shotguns are low pressure arms, and neither the case nor the guns have a lot of reserve in them to handle overpressure loads.

Shot shell reloading is a matter of reproducing the listed loads EXACTLY, and unlike metallic cartridges, there is much less margin for pressure excursions.

std7mag · April 3, 2019, 02:08 AM

Thanks 44 AMP!

And yes, i'm aware, and will definitly heed said warning!

There is one company that makes "aftermarket" 3" hulls, and wads to go with them. They do provide reloading data ( you have to buy their manual of course).

Would be nice to try out some of the store bought "wonder" ammo, to see how it truly patterns.

SHR970 · April 4, 2019, 07:10 PM

I've loaded 20 G. special loads on my LLA for over a decade and put many of them through my Fabarms O/U. If / When you want some 411 feel free to PM me. Lyman 5 is what I have and it is solid data. You'll find that it is still available; actually still their current version.

FYI: Hercules listed a wonderful 20G 12P 1 Buck 2 3/4" load back in the day and it is still a valid load. Fed. Eurotrash hulls, Rem SP 20 wads, B.D. powder.

March 30, 2019, 04:37 PM	#1
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Shotgun reloading data? Ok, yes i know it's strange coming from me, but i'm looking for load data for shotguns. I know a lot has to do with who makes the hull, wad used, and length of hull, shot load in ounces. Looking at Alliant, i can't find any data for 3 inch 20 gage. Looking for a good heavy turkey load. Thinking #5 shot. I'll be using a Lee Loadall. I also note that Alliant doesn't list what bushing to use with their newer powders. So, where would one find shotshell data that's up to date? Thanks! __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

March 30, 2019, 05:08 PM	#2
RaySendero Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2010 Location: US South Posts: 857	what hull do you want to load? __________________ *Ray*

March 30, 2019, 05:24 PM	#3
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Reallisticly, i don't know yet. Haven't gotten any yet. Or wads, or shot. Heck, still waiting on the CZ720 i ordered, and the loader. Unless i want Win or Rem 7.5 shot, ammo hard to find around here. Looking at MidwayUSA, $10-30 for a box of 5-10 shells for turkey. Plus shipping. Reloading becomes a no-brainer. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

March 30, 2019, 06:31 PM	#4
big al hunter Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2011 Location: Washington state Posts: 1,558	I found several loads on Hodgdon's website. It's under load data. But it only has Hodgdon's powders. Lyman has a heap of shotgun data in their shotgun manual. __________________ You can't fix stupid....however ignorance can be cured through education!

March 30, 2019, 07:18 PM	#6
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,427	The Lyman shot shell manual has no 20 ga 3" data. I just went through every manual that I own, including several shotgun-only manuals. The only one with 20 ga 3" data is the Hodgdon "Basic Reloading Manual" (for Hodgdon, IMR, and Winchester powders) that you used to be able to have mailed to you. This one's dated Jan 2010. It's a duplicate of what's on their website, minus the newer powders. Beyond that online data, I have no suggestions ... except, maybe, something from BPI. But, even then, you have to figure out which manual will have the data. ...It's probably worth giving them a call and asking if the data is even there - and where - before considering a purchase. Edit: I see the Hodgdon 2017 "Basic Reloading Manual" available for free on the BPI website. So, perhaps, it may still be available from Hodgdon. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

March 30, 2019, 07:10 PM	#5
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Thanks! I'll check out Lyman and Hogdgdon. Not worried about using Hodgdon powder. Just looking for data for some safe loads. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

March 30, 2019, 08:42 PM	#7
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	When i saw the picture of the Hodgdon reloading booklet, i recognized it. I asked the Mrs if she remembered seeing it. Found it. No 3" shells for 20ga. Heaviest load is 1oz. Trying to track down Lyman info. Thanks! __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

March 30, 2019, 10:38 PM	#8
Marco Califo Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: LA (Greater Los Angeles Area) Posts: 2,602	Alliant 1992 has 20 gauge 3" Loads for Federal Paper Hulls. Probably more. http://www.castpics.net/LoadData/Fre...M/Alliant.html But seriously, for birds like ducks and geese I bought a Benelli 12 gauge 3 1/2" pump gun. I think the learning bit here is that 20 gauge is not the best Turkey gun. __________________ ............

March 30, 2019, 11:26 PM	#9
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	I've luckily done it before with my Hawthorne bolt action 410. My issue is I'm not the best caller. My neighbor is. But he refuses to go with me if I take the 410. That and I figured if i had another shotgun of my own that I enjoy shooting, i may do more small game hunting. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

March 30, 2019, 11:37 PM	#10
Marco Califo Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: LA (Greater Los Angeles Area) Posts: 2,602	3" 20 g Store bought Turkey loads. https://www.midwayusa.com/s?targetLo...ItemsPerPage=0 __________________ ............

March 31, 2019, 08:13 AM	#11
RaySendero Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2010 Location: US South Posts: 857	I reload a lot of shotgun shells. But personally, I just buy my the turkey loads. Doesn't take many rounds to get turkeys for the whole season. So no reason to keep up with another different powder and wads just for this small volume. Another reason is to try different loads in your gun. Shotguns can be picky as to what load patterns best. Once you find 1 that's really good You may not be able to duplicate it. __________________ *Ray* Last edited by RaySendero; April 1, 2019 at 10:28 AM.

March 31, 2019, 08:30 AM	#12
David R Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2015 Location: The swamps of WNY Posts: 753	I have the LYMAN shot shell handbook. PM me with what you have and I will try to help you out. I loaded some 20 guage 3" loads with #5 for squirrel. It was a little too much. I think they were Federal hulls. David Sent from my SM-T900 using Tapatalk

March 31, 2019, 09:32 PM	#14
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	As i mentioned, i don't HAVE anything as of yet. Wanted to look at data, to see what components i do want to get. I have read that different manufacture/model hulls make a difference, same with wads. I'm gonna call CAC Associates tomorrow. (www.cacassociatesinc.com) They are a local distributor that carries a lot of shotshell reloading components. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

April 2, 2019, 02:08 PM	#16
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	Curious, with the price of powder, does it make sense to load shotgun shells? Never did it just interested in the cost part. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

April 2, 2019, 03:01 PM	#17
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,427	Powder's cheap. Wads are cheap. Hulls are cheap. Primers aren't bad. Shot is where the expense is. If you just shoot cheap stuff, you'll rarely be able to reload for less than factory (even if using reclaimed shot). But... If you want to tune a load to pattern as well as possible, or you shoot a lot of expensive stuff (like buckshot, slugs, .410, etc.), it can be well worth it. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

April 2, 2019, 08:09 PM	#19
SHR970 Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2011 Posts: 1,427	If you want to go this route think Federal paper basewad, Cheddite, Fiocchi shells all Reifenhauser type (AKA Eurotrash) hulls. These will combine nicely with Longshot or Blue Dot powders and WAA20 or Rem SP20 (or claybuster equivilent) wads for the best velocities. LS and BD powders both drop close enough to the LLA powder bushings to be "let's see on the pattern board". Edit to add: Nickel plated shot is best, Copper plated next.....magnum aka hard shot after that. It does and will make a difference going through the choke and feathers assuming head and neck hits don't do the job.

April 2, 2019, 09:05 PM	#20
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,871	I have some 3" 20ga data (1 1/8oz) in my 1970 Lyman manual. Not going to list it here, because its a bit out of date. (and, I don't think you can get the wads they used anymore....) One thing I need to mention, is that reloading shotshells is NOT the same as reloading metallic cartridges. The tested loads are VERY specific, and every one I've seen in decades all have the same warning, DO NOT CHANGE ANY COMPONENTS! Only the size of shot can be changed, change ANYTHING else and the load is "invalid", and could generate dangerous pressures. Unlike metallic cartridges, where you can change components (case brand, primer, bullet brand etc.,) and reduce the load and work back up, with shot shells, changing the case, primer, wad, wad pressure, anything (but the shot size), CAN change pressures, possibly dangerously. Shotguns are low pressure arms, and neither the case nor the guns have a lot of reserve in them to handle overpressure loads. Shot shell reloading is a matter of reproducing the listed loads EXACTLY, and unlike metallic cartridges, there is much less margin for pressure excursions. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

April 3, 2019, 02:08 AM	#21
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Thanks 44 AMP! And yes, i'm aware, and will definitly heed said warning! There is one company that makes "aftermarket" 3" hulls, and wads to go with them. They do provide reloading data ( you have to buy their manual of course). Would be nice to try out some of the store bought "wonder" ammo, to see how it truly patterns. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

April 4, 2019, 07:10 PM	#22
SHR970 Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2011 Posts: 1,427	I've loaded 20 G. special loads on my LLA for over a decade and put many of them through my Fabarms O/U. If / When you want some 411 feel free to PM me. Lyman 5 is what I have and it is solid data. You'll find that it is still available; actually still their current version. FYI: Hercules listed a wonderful 20G 12P 1 Buck 2 3/4" load back in the day and it is still a valid load. Fed. Eurotrash hulls, Rem SP 20 wads, B.D. powder.