Chronograph need and cost

[BoogieMan]

I have never chronograph any of my loads. I have always stayed well within published load data and so far I have been happy. But I want to push the abilities of my current 6.5x55 rifle build.
Question is do I need a chronic to do this?
Question 2 is at what price point is a chronograph a reliable piece of equipment? I know they start on the cheap end below $100 and I have seen them over $300. In order to get accurate data do I need to spend on the high end? What would be a good accurate starter chrono.?

[ligonierbill]

Personally, I always use one. It's one more piece of data. An inexpensive Chrony works fine.

[math teacher]

The main difference is in the bells and whistles. Some have a remote screen, keep track of a string of shots, figure average and standard deviation, and such. If you just want to know velocity, the cheapest Crony will do fine.

[springer99]

^^+1. A hundred dollars or so will buy a decent chrono these days. The extrs $ just buy you more bells and whistles. If you're trying to develop the most out of a cartridge/gun combination then I believe using a chrono is a worthwhile tool to have. Typically, you'll find that the ratio of increases in powder charges vs. velocity increases, tend to start to decline as you approach the optimum point. Once you reach that point, adding more powder just tends to increase the standard deviation in velocity and can open group sizes.

[mrdaputer]

I will keep a eye on this thread been thinking about one also. Found this one on sale

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/628...aph-_-20160319

[BoogieMan]

So checking out the Beta Chrono #10. It looks like a easy setup and will give me high, low, average velocity. Does anyone have an opinion on that particular unit?

[1stmar]

If you're not chronographing how do you know how hard you are pushing? Assume you have some velocity goal otherwise what's the point of pushing so hard? Without the chronograph you won't accurately know your drop at distances.

[scatterbrain]

I loaded for over 40 years without one and never had a problem with loads or accuracy. I was happy. Not knowing was bliss.
Then, I purchased one, and became very unhappy. My procedures have greatly changed since I saw the SD of what I was shooting. I have cut my group size in half, lowered my SD's to below 15, and now I am again happy.

[ms6852]

I've been thinking about get the magneto chrono. Most of my friends wish they had this model since at one time or another they have shot one of the pieces off, or it is not easily affected by clouds or sun or something. I plan to do more research as I know verrrrry little about chrono graphs.

[us920669]

Anyone who handloads needs one, period. Just don't get fixated on it to the exclusion of all else. I bought the cheapest one in the catalog probably 25 or 30 years ago and it's still working fine. Don't let muzzle blast knock it cockeyed and try to keep the shots the same elevation front and back for consistency.

[jmr40]

http://www.walmart.com/ip/F1-Chronograph/4382668

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Competitio...graph/37836936

Either of these would be fine. I have the top unit, but if I were doing it over again I'd choose the 2nd one. The accuracy of the $100 units is usually within 1% or less of the most expensive units. The main difference is that the cheaper ones will at times give readings that just don't make sense. If you are getting errors it will be obvious. In the 5-6 years I've been using one there have been 2 incidents that I can remember where it just didn't cooperate and I couldn't get readings that made sense for a while.

For under $100 I wouldn't want to load without one. I've had loads in rare cases that were shooting way too fast while I was still at a middle of the road weight charge. No way I'd have known that without one. Knowing your exact speeds allows you to plug info into ballistics programs to calculate accurate bullet drops at longer ranges too.

[math teacher]

The magneto speed crony attaches to the end of your barrel, and like any weight attached there, it can affect the point of impact. If all you want is the velocity, it has advantages.

[FrankenMauser]

Some things to keep in mind about the Magnetospeed are that you have to have enough exposed (unobstructed) barrel to mount it (or duct tape), most barrels will require fiddly shimming to keep the bullet from hitting the detector, some muzzle brakes/compensators/flash hiders don't play nicely, and the detector may completely obscure your sights while it is installed (so you may be blindly shooting into the berm, rather than putting those bullets to work in some way).

The Magnetospeed's mounting methods and attachment to the barrel were the reasons why I recently decided to go with conventional optical chronograph (Shooting Chrony Beta Master).

On the up side... the Magnetospeed does give you muzzle velocity, rather than a ~15-foot velocity. For what that's worth.

[Dufus]

I know guys that have Magnetospeed and they like them.

I know guys that have the F1 and they like them, although some complain of errors.

I have a CED M2 and get very few errors and I like it.

I know a couple of guys that bought the Caldwell unit and they are not real happy with it due to excessive errors.

Just do a little research on the ones that fit your budget, read the reviews, and then make the purchase for which one will do what you want it to do.

[rclark]

The $99 F1 and a notebook works for me. 32 shots between resets. My strings are 15 shots so I get two tests before resetting chronograph. and you can eye-ball the ES and velocity at the range in the notebook. Once home I enter the data into a spreadsheet (LibreOffice is what I use) and get the Max, Min, ES, SD, avg Veloctiy. That's how I work it. the o' F1 has worked great for me. As long as I keep it at least 9ft out from the muzzle of gun and within the 2 inch window over the chronograph the instructions suggest, I've had very little errors with it whether a cloudy day or sunny.

Need... Well probably not... I loaded a lot of years without one. But once you have one, you kick yourself for not having one in the first place! Nice to know the velocity out of your gun and the consistency of the loads. Ultimately though it is the group on target that matters most. Consistent loads (low ES) may not be always accurate... but accurate loads will be consistent.

[Shimpy]

I was given a chronograph (Ohler) in the middle 70's by a buddy of mine that got a new one. They were ancient then. I had to mount paper screens that the bullet would break front and back to start and stop the timer. Then I had to use a table in a book to look up the readout to get the velocity. These screens needed to be exactly 10 ft. apart I believe. The screens had lines back and forth that the bullet broke going thru that would break the circuit. One shot and the screens needed replaced. It was the best we had and I wouldn't want to reload rifle rounds, especially, without it.

[Brutus]

If your getting readings that don't make sense it's probably an issue with the bullets your shooting. I bought some Extreme .45 caliber plated's and they were so shiny I got 4,000 fps. readings, really great bragging rights but not to realistic. Applied some majic marker and I was back in the 850fps. range.

[Tsquared]

mrdaputer said: I will keep a eye on this thread been thinking about one also. Found this one on sale

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/628...aph-_-20160319

I have the Caldwell. It comes with everything you need except batteries. There is software available for your smart-phone that can record your sets and export the data.

I have an older cellphone and the software is a bit quirky and has crapped out on me about 60% of the time (my phone is running Android version 2). I have a new phone on order and hopefully that will straiten this up. As a stand alone without the software it works fine - there is no recording of groups or analysis as that is what your smart-phone app does. It does need to be at least 10 feet in front of you or you can get errors. The tripod is a bit frail but it will work. I paid about the same amount for mine through Amazon about 6 months ago.

[RC20]

I have the Crony with the remote readout and I would not one that did not have that (long cored, display sits on the bench with you)


That said, my wife picked up 1959 gun publication that had a guy showing you how to build your own pendulum type with a recorder.

Pretty funny, you only needed a small shed to store it in (another guy tried to shoot a bald Eagle on a lamb, fortunately he missed !)

time do change and sometimes things get better.

[sawdustdad]

I reloaded for many years without a chronograph and finally bought one on an impulse last year. I've been using it a lot over the past months to test various loads and find it very helpful. It doesn't really help in working up an accurate load, as that must be done from a bench rest at the range. I use it mostly to verify velocities for power factor calculations for my competition ammo.

I'm using the RCBS ammo master--it looks like a large bullet or, rather, a cartridge. Has remote readouts. Only complaint is 10 string/10 shots/string limit.

[AzShooter]

I shoot competition and the bullet has to meet a certain power factor. Just going by the reloading manual I didn't make the chrono a few times.

Using my Digital Pro I am assured that my ammo is doing what it's suppose to do. I keep track of my velocity, average,standard deviation and extreme spread.

All of this adds up to very accurate and consistent loads.

[ka9fax]

I have the CED M2 and really like it. I think i paid 200.00 for it. It will store 1000 shots or 500 strings. I can download everything when i get home. I really like the big read out and the fact that the CPU part (display) sits on my bench. It has a 2 year warranty and mine was over that. My speaker went out and i wanted the new firmware upgrade. I sent it in and in a few days i got a call and was told my speaker was fixed and firmware updated, no charge and they shipped it back free. Good service like this means a lot to me.

[Clark]

I shot holes through (3) ~$100 chronographs;
shooting chrony
shooting chrony
Pro chrono

Those (3) each lasted about 5 minutes.

I bought a 4th, another ~ $100 Pro Chrono and only shot rifles over it and it has lasted 10 years. 10 years later I find I can shoot handguns over it, but only after shooting the handgun and making sure it is on the paper.

I got a magnetospeed ~$400. I clamped it on a 10/22 and it is still there collecting dust. I think I forgot how to operate it.

A big problem for me is shooting at 2,500 feet altitude in the sage brush where I hunt, the sky is too black to trigger the chrono.

So I have to turn the chrono on it's side to get a shadow with a box.

[g.willikers]

If all you need is safe to shoot ammo, the load data from the component manufacturers' web sites and manual publishers will do nicely.
After all, that's all we had to go by up until twenty years or so ago.

But if more precise loading info is needed, a chronograph is a must.
My old Chrony has served me well without complications, even after being wounded a few times.
It can give some mighty funny readings at times, but that's caused by lighting anomalies.
A clear, but evenly overcast grey day works best.

[Unclenick]

I'm less sanguine about the cheap ones after my dad had a light 168 grain SMK 308 load read 2700 over his Chrony one day, and I had my Oehler set up on the next firing point and it said 2500 fps for the same load. The Oehler was much closer to the book velocity for that load. I blame the lighting conditions, but concluded that IPSC had it right to put a pair of CED units in a black box in tandem and use electrically-powered infra-red sky screens with them to ensure consistent light and to reshoot any significant disagreement the two units had. Oehler's middle check screen handles that chore. But even it only gives an error when the disagreement is over 50 fps. So I figure that's about what you can count on for precision at rifle velocities when everything is working properly.

Since then, though, I've had both the Oehler and CED set up together in series and gotten very tight agreement. My guess is most units, even the cheap ones, work fairly well with the right light. The trick is knowing the right light is what you have. There's no good way to calibrate one other than by comparison or with a Magnetospeed or other light condition immune unit. CED has a good list on their page about their M2 chronograph of other things that can cause errors, like ground reflections. I notice Bryan Litz sells the large saber version of the Magneetospeed device. He's tried about every chronograph made, so he must be comfortable that it works well. It might not be a bad way to calibrate an optical unit. The LabRadar unit might also work for this, but they claim it's not good for finding BC's, so it sounds like they don't trust their own unit's accuracy.

Any ballistic table will tell you how much velocity to expect to lose at whatever distance you have from your muzzle to the center point between your sky screens. For typical pointed rifle bullets and pistol bullets near Mach 1 it is often about 3/4 foot per second for each foot of travel on the way to the midpoint between chronograph screens. In that case, you may lose 10-12 ft/s on the way to a chronograph whose screen center is at SAAMI's 15 ft standard distance. For something slow, like a round nose 45 Auto, despite a low BC, the low velocity also means drag is low enough that it only loses about 1/4 of a foot per second per foot of travel on its way to the chronograph screen midpoint, so only 3 or 4 ft/s second with 15 ft. chronograph distance.