I'm selling guns on Gunbroker: questions

AlongCameJones · November 23, 2021, 12:23 AM

I'm not an FFL holder but a private individual. Let's say I ship a gun to a buyer's FFL for transfer and the buyer gets denied by his FFL.

I plan to ship via FedEx.

How do I get my gun back?

Can I just deduct the return shipping costs from the money he sends me?
Will FedEx hand me the gun back or will I have to go through my own FFL to get my gun back?

I don't want any money out of my pocket in case the buyer gets denied.

Also, why is it prudent to auction a gun penny-no-reserve? Could that mean I could actually get stuck selling the gun for a penny?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLx9pM8p1Sk&t=2203s

ligonierbill · November 23, 2021, 08:52 AM

First, you have the buyer's money, right? If you ship a gun for repair, it can be returned directly to you. Not so sure about a sale, legally. But I'm pretty sure the FFL that receives the gun and records it in his bound book will only ship it to another FFL. And someone, probably you, will have to pay the shipping. And you will probably have to pay the transfer fee at your FFL to get it back. The good news is, you have the buyer's money. Take your costs out and return the balance to him.

In any case, it's on the buyer. Maybe they can make a deal with the receiving FFL, if it is a gun shop, to buy the gun or sell it on consignment. And, of course, report the miscreant to Gunbroker. Personally, I have never had this happen in at least a dozen GB sales.

AlongCameJones · November 23, 2021, 09:05 AM

I have the buyer's money BEFORE it's even shipped out. Whatever it costs me out of pocket to get my gun back will be subtracted from the denied buyer's refund. The gun should also be insured to protect the gun from damage. I have made a note in the selling terms that the buyer will have to pay for shipping INSURANCE to cover the gun's value.

Rockrivr1 · November 23, 2021, 01:13 PM

Yep, as others have said. You have the buyers money and the gun now with an FFL. Not your problem unless you decide to take the gun back and refund the money. NEVER send the gun without payment first.

AlongCameJones · November 23, 2021, 04:11 PM

I would never want to see the gun again once UPS takes it out of my hands and my money has been collected.

The guns are nothing special and not high value anyway. They are lisited on online auction.

<snip>

GunBlue490 in his video suggested using the penny-no-reserve method for something high value, rare and/or exclusive like a 1950's Browning Superposed over/under or an early minty Colt Python.

I used to have good luck moving guns on Armslist but not lately. It's gets pricey having to pay $7 to renew Armslist each month. They used to be free.

ligonierbill · November 23, 2021, 05:18 PM

Everyone has their own strategy. And lots of bidders wait until late to bid. Good luck.

natman · November 24, 2021, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlongCameJones

I'm not an FFL holder but a private individual. Let's say I ship a gun to a buyer's FFL for transfer and the buyer gets denied by his FFL.

I plan to ship via FedEx.

How do I get my gun back?

Can I just deduct the return shipping costs from the money he sends me?
Will FedEx hand me the gun back or will I have to go through my own FFL to get my gun back?

I don't want any money out of my pocket in case the buyer gets denied.

Federal law allows a gun to be returned directly to you if it was sent to the FFL for gunsmithing. Most FFLs will not return a gun directly to you if it was sent to them for a transfer. I sell my guns on a no return basis for just this reason. This is especially true because I live in California, where transfer fees, background check fees and shipping can be near $200.

If you are going to take it back because the buyer was denied, every penny of costs to return it should be on the buyer. Personally I'd let the buyer leave the gun on consignment at the FFL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlongCameJones

Also, why is it prudent to auction a gun penny-no-reserve? Could that mean I could actually get stuck selling the gun for a penny?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLx9pM8p1Sk&t=2203s

Penny auctions will build a lot of interest, but should only be used on something that you are SURE will attract a lot of bidders, like a NIB original Python or mint Model 12 or the like, because you will have to sell the gun for the final price. The idea is to get people emotionally invested in getting the amazing deal it is in the beginning and having them bid it up to a good price to you.

For more ordinary transactions, I'd recommend having an honest soul searching talk with yourself and deciding what's the absolute lowest price you'd accept for the gun. Then start it there.

AlongCameJones · November 24, 2021, 03:37 PM

I've already gotten one bid on my <snip> My starting bid price has been met. Yes, the buyer who is denied at his FFL will have to eat every penny for it's return to me or keep it there on consignment.

I think penny starting bids might still be risky, especially for something not so special. If I did that on my <snip>, the best I might get for it might be $50 or maybe less.

What if $50 was the best bid at the close of the auction and I were to refuse to sell the gun anyway and keep it? Could I get in legal trouble for backing out of the deal? I don't think I can raise the "starting bid" once somebody posts a bid.

Most auction sellers on gunbroker have guns listed no reserve. GB charges 2% for reserve. When is it ever advantageous to have a reserve?

Moderator note: Do not include detail regarding the item on offer. They can be interpreted as inviting an offer to buy -- which are permitted only in the Gun Show Forum.

NRA-LIFE-MEMBER · November 28, 2021, 09:52 AM

If you state everything in your Auction listing (returns, costs, etc) there should be little you need to worry about. Check with your local FFL whom you normally do business with.

I find using a local FFL eliminates most problems and avoids shipping issues. Using your FFL will cost a little money, but they can ship through the USPS where you will not be able to through modern pistols.

FITASC · November 28, 2021, 11:53 AM

Quote:

I've already gotten one bid on my <snip> My starting bid price has been met. Yes, the buyer who is denied at his FFL will have to eat every penny for it's return to me or keep it there on consignment.

I think penny starting bids might still be risky, especially for something not so special. If I did that on my <snip>, the best I might get for it might be $50 or maybe less.

What if $50 was the best bid at the close of the auction and I were to refuse to sell the gun anyway and keep it? Could I get in legal trouble for backing out of the deal? I don't think I can raise the "starting bid" once somebody posts a bid.

Most auction sellers on gunbroker have guns listed no reserve. GB charges 2% for reserve. When is it ever advantageous to have a reserve?

You do not back out if your price doesn't get where you want it to be. If you really need to get a certain minimum, then start it at the minimum and you will see if the market agrees with you.

dogtown tom · November 29, 2021, 10:26 AM

Quote:

AlongCameJones....What if $50 was the best bid at the close of the auction and I were to refuse to sell the gun anyway and keep it?

On GunBroker you would get an "F" feedback from the buyer at best and rightfully kicked out by GunBroker for reneging on the contract you agreed to when you listed your firearm for sale.

Quote:

Could I get in legal trouble for backing out of the deal?

Well sure. You agreed to sell according to GunBroker policies. Just as the buyer is obligated to pay you for his winning bid.

Quote:

I don't think I can raise the "starting bid" once somebody posts a bid.

You don't "think"? Buddy......you better KNOW what you can do before listing a gun for sale.

Quote:

Most auction sellers on gunbroker have guns listed no reserve.

Not true.

Quote:

GB charges 2% for reserve. When is it ever advantageous to have a reserve?

Some sellers believe a hidden reserve encourages bidders to bid. I think it has the opposite effect. If you start your auction at the lowest price you'll take.....no need for a reserve.

Many like myself routinely ignore auctions with a reserve. I'm not playing a guessing game with the seller or other bidders only to find the reserve price is more than I wish to pay.....its a waste of my time.

Tawaliga · November 29, 2021, 10:48 AM

You are worrying about things you don't need to worry about. Everything is seamless on gunbroker, just follow the process, and don't ship until you have the FFL info. A buyer is not going to choose an FFL that won't process the transfer. Be sure to state "Your FFL must accept shipment from a private party" in your ad, and also be sure to update the shipping info once you send it out, and keep everything buttoned up on your end. I have bought and sold many things on gunbroker and never had any issue at all. It is just ebay, but for guns and ammo.

Skans · November 30, 2021, 10:44 AM

I am always a bit skeptical of penny auctions with no reserve. I have caught shill bidders before on Ebay. I'm sure the same thing happens on Gunbroker.

doofus47 · December 1, 2021, 10:18 PM

I would insist on money orders or USPS money orders for the purchase/shipping costs.
If the money cashes, then ship. If the user fails their background check, you might pay for the return trip, but you have the $ and the goods.
Personally, I never shipped to California.

November 23, 2021, 12:23 AM	#1
AlongCameJones member Join Date: May 25, 2021 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 203	I'm selling guns on Gunbroker: questions I'm not an FFL holder but a private individual. Let's say I ship a gun to a buyer's FFL for transfer and the buyer gets denied by his FFL. I plan to ship via FedEx. How do I get my gun back? Can I just deduct the return shipping costs from the money he sends me? Will FedEx hand me the gun back or will I have to go through my own FFL to get my gun back? I don't want any money out of my pocket in case the buyer gets denied. Also, why is it prudent to auction a gun penny-no-reserve? Could that mean I could actually get stuck selling the gun for a penny? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLx9pM8p1Sk&t=2203s Last edited by AlongCameJones; November 23, 2021 at 01:25 PM.

November 23, 2021, 09:05 AM	#3
AlongCameJones member Join Date: May 25, 2021 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 203	That makes sense. I have the buyer's money BEFORE it's even shipped out. Whatever it costs me out of pocket to get my gun back will be subtracted from the denied buyer's refund. The gun should also be insured to protect the gun from damage. I have made a note in the selling terms that the buyer will have to pay for shipping INSURANCE to cover the gun's value.

November 23, 2021, 04:11 PM	#5
AlongCameJones member Join Date: May 25, 2021 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 203	I would never want to see the gun again once UPS takes it out of my hands and my money has been collected. The guns are nothing special and not high value anyway. They are lisited on online auction. <snip> GunBlue490 in his video suggested using the penny-no-reserve method for something high value, rare and/or exclusive like a 1950's Browning Superposed over/under or an early minty Colt Python. I used to have good luck moving guns on Armslist but not lately. It's gets pricey having to pay $7 to renew Armslist each month. They used to be free. Last edited by Frank Ettin; November 24, 2021 at 02:24 PM. Reason: Deleted list of guns offered for sale

November 24, 2021, 03:37 PM	#8
AlongCameJones member Join Date: May 25, 2021 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 203	I've already gotten one bid on my <snip> My starting bid price has been met. Yes, the buyer who is denied at his FFL will have to eat every penny for it's return to me or keep it there on consignment. I think penny starting bids might still be risky, especially for something not so special. If I did that on my <snip>, the best I might get for it might be $50 or maybe less. What if $50 was the best bid at the close of the auction and I were to refuse to sell the gun anyway and keep it? Could I get in legal trouble for backing out of the deal? I don't think I can raise the "starting bid" once somebody posts a bid. Most auction sellers on gunbroker have guns listed no reserve. GB charges 2% for reserve. When is it ever advantageous to have a reserve? Moderator note: Do not include detail regarding the item on offer. They can be interpreted as inviting an offer to buy -- which are permitted only in the Gun Show Forum. Last edited by AlongCameJones; November 24, 2021 at 04:12 PM.

December 1, 2021, 10:18 PM	#14
doofus47 Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2010 Location: live in a in a house when i'm not in a tent Posts: 2,483	I would insist on money orders or USPS money orders for the purchase/shipping costs. If the money cashes, then ship. If the user fails their background check, you might pay for the return trip, but you have the $ and the goods. Personally, I never shipped to California. __________________ I'm right about the metric system 3/4 of the time.

November 23, 2021, 08:52 AM	#2
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,459	First, you have the buyer's money, right? If you ship a gun for repair, it can be returned directly to you. Not so sure about a sale, legally. But I'm pretty sure the FFL that receives the gun and records it in his bound book will only ship it to another FFL. And someone, probably you, will have to pay the shipping. And you will probably have to pay the transfer fee at your FFL to get it back. The good news is, you have the buyer's money. Take your costs out and return the balance to him. In any case, it's on the buyer. Maybe they can make a deal with the receiving FFL, if it is a gun shop, to buy the gun or sell it on consignment. And, of course, report the miscreant to Gunbroker. Personally, I have never had this happen in at least a dozen GB sales.

November 23, 2021, 01:13 PM	#4
Rockrivr1 Senior Member Join Date: June 6, 2002 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 271	Yep, as others have said. You have the buyers money and the gun now with an FFL. Not your problem unless you decide to take the gun back and refund the money. NEVER send the gun without payment first.

November 23, 2021, 05:18 PM	#6
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,459	Everyone has their own strategy. And lots of bidders wait until late to bid. Good luck.

November 28, 2021, 09:52 AM	#9
NRA-LIFE-MEMBER Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2007 Location: Birth State of Daniel Boone Posts: 100	If you state everything in your Auction listing (returns, costs, etc) there should be little you need to worry about. Check with your local FFL whom you normally do business with. I find using a local FFL eliminates most problems and avoids shipping issues. Using your FFL will cost a little money, but they can ship through the USPS where you will not be able to through modern pistols.

November 29, 2021, 10:48 AM	#12
Tawaliga Member Join Date: January 24, 2016 Posts: 34	You are worrying about things you don't need to worry about. Everything is seamless on gunbroker, just follow the process, and don't ship until you have the FFL info. A buyer is not going to choose an FFL that won't process the transfer. Be sure to state "Your FFL must accept shipment from a private party" in your ad, and also be sure to update the shipping info once you send it out, and keep everything buttoned up on your end. I have bought and sold many things on gunbroker and never had any issue at all. It is just ebay, but for guns and ammo.

November 30, 2021, 10:44 AM	#13
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	I am always a bit skeptical of penny auctions with no reserve. I have caught shill bidders before on Ebay. I'm sure the same thing happens on Gunbroker.