Anyone use wood dye?

[JJ45]

I have seen recommendations to refinish a walnut stock using wood dye instead of other options such as walnut stains, etc.

I would use either Tung or Boiled linseed in combination with the dye as well.

Looking for advice on wood dye like what brand and what color for a medium to dark walnut and any special techniques, etc....Thanks, JJ

[Schlitz 45]

In my experience walnut doesn’t take dye or stain very well. You can always try but it seems that most of it comes right back off & doesn’t penetrate even after sanding to bare wood & whiskering. If it’s a nice piece of wood a hand rubbed oil finish followed by a couple coats of wax is about as good as it will get.

[ballardw]

From: https://www.woodcraft.com/blog_entries/stain-or-dye

There is a difference. Stains are made of colored pigments that stick in the grain and pores of the wood surface while dyes consist of microscopic particles that penetrate the wood itself. As a result, dyes and stains produce different effects and affect different wood species in different ways.

Dyes used in woodworking are similar to those used in dying cloth. When mixed with the proper solvent, dye crystals dissociate into individual molecules. That makes them tiny enough to penetrate deep into the wood. Most common wood dyes are powders that are mixed with water or alcohol. Because they’re so small, dye molecules go deep into wood and bond directly to it, so it is not necessary to have a separate binder included. That’s an advantage since there is no film left on the wood surface that could cause problems when the finish is applied.

Advantages:

Penetrates deeper into the wood and reduces the potential for future scratches to show.
Allows the addition of deep, vibrant colors without obscuring the grain.
Better suited to dense or figured woods.

Disadvantages:

Dyes can be more prone to fading in sunlight than pigmented stains.

Stains are similar to very thin oil or water-based paints. They are composed of a pigment, a carrier to help you flow the pigment on and a binder to help the pigment stick. Most stain binders are made of the same resins used to make finishes. The pigment lodges in the large pores of the wood, creating contrast, unlike dye colors which tend to be more uniform.

Although color change is its primary function, stain can also intensify or diminish the grain of the wood, depending on the type of wood and the type of stain you use. Note that because the binder forms a thin seal over the wood, it does not absorb a second coat of stain as well as the first.

Advantages:

Does a better job of bringing out the grain pattern in large grain woods such as ash and oak.
Because stains contain a binder, you can treat them a little like paint, leaving a bit more pigment on the surface. Just use restraint to avoid obscuring the grain entirely.

Disadvantages

Stains need to be stirred often to insure because the particles tend to settle on the bottom.
Multiple applications to darken the color may obscure the grain.
Will not work well on dense, close grained wood.

Since many of the woods used for stocks come in the "dense, close grained" variety you may want to experiment with dyes. But denser materials take longer to absorb enough dye, especially if you will follow with more sanding.

Experiment on scrap similar to yours. Wipe on dye. Wipe off different bits at different time to see the effects.
I suspect a lighter dye may take a longer time than a darker to achieve notable results.

[HiBC]

I've used Feibelings alcohol base leather dye . In particular,on wood like curly maple for muzzle loader stocks.
Walnut has more color,and the natural contrasts can be lost with stains and dyes.(I did say "Can" ,not necesarily "Will" be lost)

Using the example of curly maple,the wood in natural state is pretty colorless.You see grain,but not contrast. The wood grain is compressed. Ripples,waves. That creates some side grain and some end grain.

Thee are traditional methods like Maple Magic,or is it Aqua Fortis ? A solution of acids and nails and alchemy.. I've used a chromic acid solution...not one I recommend,though it works. These are applied and allowed to dry,then scorched with a flame. The whole stock goes dark cinnamon,like a coat of flat red primer. And you go "What have I done!!!???" But then you sand the stock.
The side grain brightens/lightens up,and the end grain remains dark. You get the beautiful stripes.

I found if I go back over it with the leather dye...it MAY have been "Medium Gold",but I'm not sure. I would get a rich,luminous effect. Yes,you lightly sand again. I suggest selecting a few dyes,cutting some 1/4 in thick strips of stock wood,and do a couple dozen experiments till you discover what you like.

[603Country]

In my humble opinion, Walnut rarely needs a stain or dye, but I have from time to time used them on Walnut and Cherry. I use Transtint and JE Moser dyes mostly and mix them in distilled water to the color density I want. I normally do quite a few tests at different dye strengths till I find what I want. Sand to whatever grit you want, but to at least 220 grit. Then wet and dewhisker, but be careful to not remove the dye. Or, to not disturb the dye, apply a coat of Waterlox Original, dry 24 hours and then dewhisker. Then 2 or 3 more coats. It’s a film builder that melts into (sort of) the previous coat. You can apply coats till all the pores are filled, or not. If it’s a gun stock, I hang it from the ceiling of my workshop and apply the Waterlox lightly with a small foam brush.

And, I’ve done the oiled stock approach with BLO or Tung Oil. They also turned out great, though it’s a lot of work to get it right. The Waterlox repels water, but the oil finish does not. Both can be repaired.

[RickB]

I stripped the stain from a walnut stock, revealing a couple of areas that were white (I guess that's why they stained it?).
Not wanting to stain it again, I selectively applied brown RIT dye to the white areas, and it looks quite good.

[Scorch]

Winchester and Remington were famous for dying their wood. They learned it making military rifles during WW1, and it made all the guns on the rack look the same. Uniformity. It can be good and bad. The stocks all have that same reddish brown lifleless look to them. People even had names for the dyed wood, Winchester red, Remington walnut, Marlin orange finishes. It's one reason why people looked at custom stocks for rifles, different pieces of wood will look totally different based on cut, finish, level of sanding, etc. Nowadays we are seeing a lot more natural wood gunstocks than we ever saw in the past.

I use dyes occasionally to dye or enhance wood grain. I have stripped old Winchester stocks to refinish and found light-colored sap wood under the dye, so dying wood also made it cheaper to make wood stocks, less wasted wood from a log. And if your stock looks like a piece of carboard you can enhance the grain as well.

I have dyed stocks prior to sanding in oil finish, there is less chance of sanding through stain and having to strip and redo a stock. I buy wood dye from woodworker supply stores. The stuff you get from the hardware store is basically the cheapest stuff out there, no good unless you are refinishing uncle Larry's old nightstand.

[ballardw]

Originally Posted by HiBC

I've used Feibelings alcohol base leather dye .

I guess I should have known that someone else has done this. Not for gun stocks but other wood working projects. I can tell where the wood was harder to carve by the less intense dye take up as the denser wood is harder to carve.

[Dfariswheel]

Water or alcohol based leather dyes work very well for staining wood.
It soaks in instantly and penetrates well.
You can mix it to get other colors.

Here's some AK-74 wood done in a Russian Red using Cordovan leather dye.....





Oil based stains seldom work well on gunstock woods, they just lay on the surface and don't soak in much at all.

Brownell's sell some excellent spirit based wood dyes that work extremely well.