Bulge in casing?

[JJT10]

Finished my first 50 rounds, of 40 S&W, using Lock n Load single stage press and Hornady dies. 20% of which had a bulge at the top by the mouth after seating and crimping. Trying to figure out why? Did not matter lube or no lube, thought maybe I didn't have enough flare and the bullet didn't go in right added a little more, no help. Thought maybe the crimp, but tried to seat the bullets on a few and stop just before the crimping, backed it off and did see a bulge starting to form before it even crimped. Set the dies up per instructions. What am I doing wrong? I even tried not using the deburing tool, no luck.

I have a bullet puller, can I take the depriming pin out and resize the casing and still keep and reuse the primer in it?

[50of4064]

Are you using plated or lead bullets?
I am not an expert, but don't some plated bullets have a larger call out and affect the case in this way?
( JJT, this is whats rocks about this site, there are guy's here that will forget more about thing's gun's, than I will ever remember !)

[Win_94]

Try more flare. I tried loading a 38 special without flaring the mouth and had a bulge in the mouth as you describe.

[JJT10]

Yes they are plated, using Hornady 155gr XTP. I'll flare a bit more and see what kind of results I get. Thanks

[PA-Joe]

XTPs are jacketed not plated. Plating is thinner and you have to use "lead" loading data.

[steve4102]

How about a picture of the bulge? Without a picture my guess would be the "bulge" is nothing more that the base of the bullet showing through the brass case. If this is the "bulge" then it's normal.

Yes they are plated, using Hornady 155gr XTP.

Plated bullets are lead bullets with a very thin electroplated copper coating, The Hornady XTP is a real "Jacketed" bullet with a thick copper jacket.

[JJT10]

Here is a pic. The bulge is at the top by the mouth.

[TATER]

Wow, OK, I see that you are new to the board.
I am going to go out on a limb and say, New to reloading too??...
If so, Please, Stop where you are at and get a manual.....

The die body controls the amount of crimp placed on the “Case”.
The stem controls setting depth of the “Bullet”
You need a tapered crimp with this round and not a roll crimp. Back off the die body.
Please Please get a manual, .40 cal in my opinion is NOT for beginners....
It is an extremely high pressure round and setting depth is crucial.

[JJT10]

Yes, I'm new but not foolish. If it doesnt look right it gets trashed. Have the manual and checked and mic'd all measurements with each round. Just was wondering why 10 of 50 ended up like this. Made a few die adjustments and tried 10 more rounds so far theyre good.

[TATER]

Sorry, That should read, Seating Depth..
The last thing in the world I want to do is step on any toes.
I apologize If I came across wrong... Those are some “Monster Crimps”
to the point of distorting/deforming the bullets.

[JJT10]

Np Tater, Thats the nice thing about these forums to get advice and help when needed. those rounds went right in the trash, not gonna take any chances. added a bit more flare, actually cleared it up, I think there was to little because the bulge actually started before the crimp.

[bigwrench]

Looks like your getting crimped before bullet is fully seated. Probably caused by brass being differant lengths, or inproperly adjusted crimp/seating dye. Measure a few hand fulls of brass and see that lengths are fairly uniform. Are you using mixed headstamp brass?

From pics. It looks most likely that crimp is being applied before bullet is fully seated.

[700cdl]

Put a case in the shell holder, no bullet in it. Bring the press to full stroke and then thread the die in until it touches the case mouth. Lower the press arm and then thread the die in about an additional 1/2 turn. Now back out the seating rod several turns and begin seating a bullet just to the point you can feel the press arm resistence. Check your seating depth at this point and continue doing the same until your case mouth is barely over the canalure and complete the stroke. You should have a pretty good looking crimp in the middle area of the canalure. Adjust up or down as needed to keep seating depth within the canalure. Remember that your seating depth is controlled by the seating rod located in the top of the die, and crimp is adjusted by the die body pressing against the case mouth. If you are getting inconsistent crimps and seating depth, you will need to trim your brass according to spec or this problem will continue to plague you.
One more tip. Your primers are a little too deep. They only need to be a about .001" below the case head.
Good luck and give it another go, you'll get it.

[PA-Joe]

Does your seating die bottom out on the shellholder? Too much crimp. You may want to crimp as a separate step. Seat bullets then remove seating stem and do your crimping.

[LDBennett]

JJT10:

Boy, you are getting lots of conflicting advice here! None of it is wrong but some of it is just wrong for your problem. You have it figured out... not enough flare. The bullet drags too much on the case mouth as it enters the case and pulls the case mouth so a bulge occurs. The flare should be enough so that when you set the bullet onto the flared case, the base of the bullet goes inside the case enough that the bullet will not fall out. Too much flare may not allow the case to enter the crimping die and will over work the brass with each reloading cycle, shortening its life.

Now that you have that figured out, here is the way you set up the seating die:

Screw the die in until it bottoms then pull it out a turn or two. Turn in the rod in the die so that it is way too deep into the die. Without using a full stroke, seat a bullet to the appropriate cartridge overall length (slowly, repeatedly measuring it to get it exact). This is you standard for seating depth. Remove the seating rod in the center of the seating die. Put the test cartridge in the shell holder and raise the ram to full up. Slowly lower the die body until it starts to taper crimp the case. Adjust the die down until the taper crimp is just perfect (see your manual for pictures of how that looks or compare it to a factory round). Lock the die body down. Re-install the seating rod carefully so that it just touches the bullet in the test cartridge when the ram of the press is fully up and lock the seating rod down. Now do another round, measuring it to see that all is well and make small adjustments as necessary. Moving the die body changes the seating depth of the bullet so get the crimp right before re-installing the seating rod in the die.

LDBennett

[JJT10]

Thanks everyone for the advice and help.

[t45]

It looks like you need a little more flare and a little less crimp. Taper crimp that is. Good luck!

[Miata Mike]

Having loaded this very same bullet last night, I find the pictures a bit odd considering how deep the actual base of the bullets are really seated past the damage. Glad to hear that just adding some more bell helped.

I am very much a newbie to loading and loaded my first ten test loads in .40 S&W last night. I was very careful measuring and remeasuring the overall length and taper crimp diameter. I was surprised at how much deeper the bullets get seated compared to the plated .45acp and 9mm I have loaded.

[engineermike]

JJT;
You may want to consider not crimping and seating in the same step. I ran into this a while back loading 38 special rounds. I to use the Hornady dies and found that I may not have had the seating pin screwed out of the die body far enough when I set my crimp. I later found I needed to screw the seating pin out as far as it would go "to almost completely our" just hanging on by a thread or two before setting my crimp. I later decided not to seat and crimp at the same time and added an other step to my process. "Here is that thread if you care to read it."http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=421865&highlight=38+special

But as stated before, you may want to check to make sure your die and press is adjusted properly. As I always tell myself "If you're having a problem Mike take everything apart and start all over from the beginning." In most cases I find I have made a mistake in the set up process. I would also say that loading S&W 40 and 38 Special is a little different process but you may pick up something/or not from the above thread.

Mike
See if this link works better:http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...+spl+reloading

[cdoc42]

I'm not sure I agree that the amount of case mouth flare is the problem. Too little flare will cause some difficulty in seating just because you don't have a good start in the case mouth.

I do agree with those who have suggested the problem is the case is being crimped before the bullet is fully seated.

To completely eliminate the problem - and I now ALWAYS do it this way - seat the bullets in one step and then crimp them in a following step.

The Lee Load-ALL press has these two separate steps. If I use my RCBS Rock Chuker, I set the die for proper crimping as described in the previous posts, and back out the seating stem. RCBS dies (esp. .38/.357; .44 special/.44 Mag) come with what looks like a washer. Put the washer between your die and the press and screw the die down. Now it won't crimp. Set the die to seat the bullets and seat them all. Remove the washer, back out the seating stem, then reinsert the die and crimp all the rounds.

Takes longer but avoids the bulged rounds.

[dakotashooter2]

A couple other possibilities: some brass is thicker than others and may result in a slight bulge, I notice this more with cast bullets that may be slightly oversized. Also if the incorrect or improperly fitting seating stem is used the bullet may seat crooked and leave a bulge on one side.

[Miata Mike]

"If you're having a problem Mike take everything apart and start all over from the beginning."

I didn't have any troubles with my loads. I just thought out loud that the bullets get seated much deeper that what I have loaded before, but I am 100% sure I have things seated right to spec.

[Colorado Redneck]

I agree with Engineermike. Encountered exactly the same problem. If seating and crimping in the same stroke, the slightest variation in case length can result in just what you have going on. So, seating the bullet in one operation and then crimping in the next works best for me. This is with 38 special, and since they are used in 357's the case length is not too critcal to me. I just like a bit of crimp to assure no bullet creep.

[engineermike]

Sorry Miata,
The Mike I was referring to in my quote was me. (I talk to myself quite a lot ) Meaning when I have problems I usually find it is in my set up. Again sorry, I was not talking about your set up.

Mike