Who's better than you? - Page 2

Hal · April 24, 2002, 07:39 PM

ronin,
Maybe one of these days we'll get a chance to swap some range time, and I can do a little better job of explaining it instead of typing it.

LOL! Long as there's no competition....well maybe a "bet you can't hit that" kinda thing,,,

ronin308 · April 24, 2002, 09:28 PM

RAE- LOL! I'm always up for a good friendly shootout. My brother and I grew up doing that all the time. Our favorite was shooting at clay birds with rifles at unknown distances from a standing position. Even if you make me look like a newbie, I'll still have a great time

Flexmoney · April 25, 2002, 04:23 AM

This being my first post on TFL...I'll see if I can't tick somebody off.

I agree with Ronin. If you think you are a good shot...chance are you aren't worth a big steaming pile of crap.

I have been around guns my whole life. I've made great shoots on game. Shot expert with rifle and pistol in the Air Force (shooting better than most everyone around me). Then, a couple of years ago, I went to an USPSA action pistol match. I got my butt completely handed to me. I don't think I was in the top two-thirds. It was very enlightening.

I have stuck with it...and improved. Since that time I have seen many guys (gals have less ego) show up, score much lower than they expected, and never come back. The truth sometimes hurts. It takes a bit of character to show up and get spanked...then do it again the next match, and the next.

Hey Ohio guys...where do you shoot?

falconer · April 25, 2002, 06:19 AM

Caliban, yes once, and never gain

I have some BIG plans for next season.

Ronin, I'm all up for an IDPA match, just gotta buy more mags for the CZ. Let me know what the match schedule is for May & June.
I'm especially interested in any sort of tactical shotgun match.

Flexmoney, I shoot at the OSU range the most. Sometimes I shoot at Pro Gun (akron),the deer hunter (barberton) or Stonewall (cleveland). Sometimes I also shoot at the CPD range with Coronach.

The Tusco Rifle club is pretty much the meeting place for the Ohio TFLers. We usually gather there once a month for the steel plate shoots. You should definately come next month.

KP95DAO · April 25, 2002, 07:16 AM

Enough to make the shooting portion of my life interesting.

At regional and national IDPA matches about one third of all other shooters score better than I do, to always include my eldest son.

Flexmoney · April 25, 2002, 07:20 AM

Let me know a date and directions...and what to bring.

I shoot mostly action pistol. Here is a link that covers many of the Ohio pistol matches.

Rayner's Range has a 3-gun (pistol, rifle, shotgun) side match every other month. Ft. Harmar IDPA (Marietta) has a shotgun side match this Sunday.

ronin308 · April 25, 2002, 08:56 AM

falconer- I'll keep you posted on the May and June matches w/ shotgun. We're having a tactical match this weekend for rifle and pistol. I'll finally get to knock the dust off of my AR

falconer · April 25, 2002, 08:58 AM

Why don't you knock that silly muzzlebreak off Caliban's AR while you're at it?

Steve Smith · April 25, 2002, 10:36 AM

Obviously I'm here late, and this probably won't be read by the folks who were reall into this conversation, but here goes anyway.

I'm mainly with Ronin in this. I shoot NRA Highpower Rifle and CMP matches. That's a huge portion of my life. Outside of HP I'd say I shoot in the top 10% of all people who ever touch a gun, but that's not hard to do. I am a pretty good shooter in this realm. Inside HP, its tough. I am just barely making Expert now, but this is just my second year. I expect to knock on the heels of Master by the end of this year, but I know guys who have spent years at the Expert level. Expert means you're picking up 89 to 93.99% of all points available in the match. There are so many guys that can stomp my butt its amazing to me. This is where I belong...looking up, striving to get better. there are some who seem to have a natural ability, but they rarely get beyond Master in a hurry. Being a "natural" only gets you so far. The rest is disciplene.

You guys who don't shoot competition are missing out on a great experience, no matter the discipline.

jaysouth · April 25, 2002, 01:05 PM

Before I had a cataract removed in December, EVERYONE that showed up at the range shot better that me. Now with improved vision, I manage to outshoot someone every now and then. However, no one has ever had more fun that I do at the range.

Jim Watson · April 25, 2002, 01:23 PM

To those polled who only know five or fewer people who can outshoot them:

You guys should try to get out more.
Or am I reading about you in the magazines under your real names?

Correia · April 25, 2002, 03:09 PM

I used to think that I was hot stuff. I could outshoot any of my friends.

Then I started shooting IDPA.

Competition really forces you to be better. You can't just discount all of those times you miss in the backyard shooting cans. Not when you are shooting for score, while being timed, and a mess of folks are watching you.

And then if you think you are getting good, find an IPSC Grandmaster and shoot against them, man on man, in a steel challenge match. Very humbling. The only time I have been able to beat somebody that good on a stage is when they have a really bad malfunction.

I consider myself a pretty good generalist, meaning that I'm pretty good at most types of shooting, pistol, rifle, shotgun. (maybe that is why my highest finishes are at 3 gun) But then when you get into specialization, whoa, then it is really easy to get blown away by how good some people out there are. I can go out shotgunning with a bunch of buddies, and beat just about anybody I know if we are hand throwing clay pigeons out in the desert, but if I were to go to a Sporting Clays match, I would get my butt handed to me.

ronin308 · April 25, 2002, 06:12 PM

falconer- Caliban gets so POed when people talk smack on his muzzle brake. We should just hacksaw it off when he's sleeping...but on the other hand, the muzzle brake does clear up my sinuses

Jamie Young · April 26, 2002, 12:09 AM

TFL member K80Geoff wanted to shoot My Beretta 92FS just to see what the hub bub was all about. He picked it up, shot it better than I ever shot it, and handed it back to me and said, "I don't like the Trigger."

speed · April 26, 2002, 12:22 AM

It's tough to post something that does'nt go at least a little off subject.
When I posted this question originally I figured it would end up here sooner or later.
As of now, TFL'ers are lookin pretty good as I suspected they would.In my opinion it only makes sense .
The question say's how many people do you (KNOW PERSONALLY OR CASUALLY)..... Not...... (KNOW OF)
I think many who voted 30 or more included people that they (KNOW OF)...........Am I correct?.............Well either I am or you all are some friendly SOB's

Modifiedbrowning · April 26, 2002, 03:00 AM

Unfortunately, I have been shooting pretty much by myself, except for a friend or two I dragged along. Until I join the local range I guess I don't know for sure. Any TFL shooters here in Montana near Bozeman?

Flexmoney · April 26, 2002, 03:49 AM

Looks like the is a club right down the street from you...in Belgrade. Link here.

Heck, you could jog there. I am jealous...My shortest drive to a match is an hour.

[Edit] O.K., it looks like it is on the other side of Belgrad. Better drive. (Ammo gets heavy.)

Modifiedbrowning · April 26, 2002, 04:51 AM

Flex, friend o mine, first of all Belgrade is eight(8) miles from Bozone, Logan is at least another six(6). Just kidding, I've actually been to the Logan range, but this is Montana, and Logan is an outdoor range. Also, I can't afford to join right now so that it why I've been going to the local national forest for my shooting needs.

Hal · April 26, 2002, 06:21 AM

falconer (Tom) said it best.
It's all relative.

It's all relative to what your goal is. The only person I have ANY desire to beat is myself.

RickB · April 26, 2002, 12:32 PM

I shoot B/USPSA and Sharpshooter/IDPA; all of the A, Master, etc. shooters can outshoot me. That said, I suspect I can outshoot over 90% of the gun owners in the world.

Fatelvis · April 27, 2002, 10:01 AM

In HP comp, I`m surrounded by better shots than me. The makings for improvement in MY shooting!!

vetts1911 · April 28, 2002, 05:24 PM

Jim Watson well said, I shoot around the world champ for IPSC and some of his friends. They put me at the 75% side and the only reason I beat any off them is cause a gun broke. You top guns try finding a match and not a can on the fence post. It will WAKE U UP!!!

whizz · April 29, 2002, 08:58 AM

So either the majority are BS:ers, are competing at world top level or have never entered a "real" competition. I know that at least 50 IPSC shooters in sweden can outshoot me ... :-). Thats what happened at the swedish nationals last year anyway.

wakal · April 29, 2002, 09:33 AM

I'm an IPSC "B" class shooter. The "B" means that a "Boatload" of shooters can whup me on a regular basis

I've noticed that any shooter can beat any other shooter, at least once in a while. My wife (who I have beat on a steel shoot...with a reload...using a Colt SAA against her SiG P226) has beat me (quite legitimately) on some stages.

I've beat Grandmasters now and then, but surely not often. I've RO'ed some of the best shooters currently in the game, and I know I'm not even CLOSE to the same level as they are. Fun to try, though

Alex

Hal · May 18, 2002, 04:01 AM

http://www.rbcd.net/

Down at the bottom of the page.

David A. Stoker

I've never met him though. (Although i'd certainly like too. Shooting like that is just a pure pleasure to watch,)
I can honestly say that's a group that I'm not capable of firing at that range. 20 years ago I might have been able to come extremely close to it, maybe even duplicate,,,maybe even beat. Today ain't 20 years ago though.

*shrug* Oh well, so it goes.

View Poll Results: How many people do you know that can outshoot you?
1-5	27	38.03%
5-10	11	15.49%
10-30	12	16.90%
30 or more	21	29.58%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

April 24, 2002, 09:28 PM	#27
ronin308 Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Posts: 1,977	RAE- LOL! I'm always up for a good friendly shootout. My brother and I grew up doing that all the time. Our favorite was shooting at clay birds with rifles at unknown distances from a standing position. Even if you make me look like a newbie, I'll still have a great time __________________ If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara desert in five years there’d be a shortage of sand. -Milton Friedman

April 25, 2002, 04:23 AM	#28
Flexmoney Member Join Date: April 25, 2002 Location: Ohio (Columbus, McConnelsville) Posts: 23	This being my first post on TFL...I'll see if I can't tick somebody off. I agree with Ronin. If you think you are a good shot...chance are you aren't worth a big steaming pile of crap. I have been around guns my whole life. I've made great shoots on game. Shot expert with rifle and pistol in the Air Force (shooting better than most everyone around me). Then, a couple of years ago, I went to an USPSA action pistol match. I got my butt completely handed to me. I don't think I was in the top two-thirds. It was very enlightening. I have stuck with it...and improved. Since that time I have seen many guys (gals have less ego) show up, score much lower than they expected, and never come back. The truth sometimes hurts. It takes a bit of character to show up and get spanked...then do it again the next match, and the next. Hey Ohio guys...where do you shoot? __________________ Have fun, Kyle

April 25, 2002, 07:20 AM	#31
Flexmoney Member Join Date: April 25, 2002 Location: Ohio (Columbus, McConnelsville) Posts: 23	Let me know a date and directions...and what to bring. I shoot mostly action pistol. Here is a link that covers many of the Ohio pistol matches. Rayner's Range has a 3-gun (pistol, rifle, shotgun) side match every other month. Ft. Harmar IDPA (Marietta) has a shotgun side match this Sunday. __________________ Have fun, Kyle

April 25, 2002, 08:56 AM	#32
ronin308 Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Posts: 1,977	falconer- I'll keep you posted on the May and June matches w/ shotgun. We're having a tactical match this weekend for rifle and pistol. I'll finally get to knock the dust off of my AR __________________ If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara desert in five years there’d be a shortage of sand. -Milton Friedman

April 24, 2002, 07:39 PM	#26
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	ronin, Maybe one of these days we'll get a chance to swap some range time, and I can do a little better job of explaining it instead of typing it. LOL! Long as there's no competition....well maybe a "bet you can't hit that" kinda thing,,,

April 25, 2002, 06:19 AM	#29
falconer Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Location: somewhere Posts: 546	Caliban, yes once, and never gain I have some BIG plans for next season. Ronin, I'm all up for an IDPA match, just gotta buy more mags for the CZ. Let me know what the match schedule is for May & June. I'm especially interested in any sort of tactical shotgun match. Flexmoney, I shoot at the OSU range the most. Sometimes I shoot at Pro Gun (akron),the deer hunter (barberton) or Stonewall (cleveland). Sometimes I also shoot at the CPD range with Coronach. The Tusco Rifle club is pretty much the meeting place for the Ohio TFLers. We usually gather there once a month for the steel plate shoots. You should definately come next month.

April 25, 2002, 07:16 AM	#30
KP95DAO Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2000 Posts: 699	Enough to make the shooting portion of my life interesting. At regional and national IDPA matches about one third of all other shooters score better than I do, to always include my eldest son.

April 25, 2002, 08:58 AM	#33
falconer Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Location: somewhere Posts: 546	Why don't you knock that silly muzzlebreak off Caliban's AR while you're at it?

April 25, 2002, 10:36 AM	#34
Steve Smith Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 1999 Posts: 4,131	Obviously I'm here late, and this probably won't be read by the folks who were reall into this conversation, but here goes anyway. I'm mainly with Ronin in this. I shoot NRA Highpower Rifle and CMP matches. That's a huge portion of my life. Outside of HP I'd say I shoot in the top 10% of all people who ever touch a gun, but that's not hard to do. I am a pretty good shooter in this realm. Inside HP, its tough. I am just barely making Expert now, but this is just my second year. I expect to knock on the heels of Master by the end of this year, but I know guys who have spent years at the Expert level. Expert means you're picking up 89 to 93.99% of all points available in the match. There are so many guys that can stomp my butt its amazing to me. This is where I belong...looking up, striving to get better. there are some who seem to have a natural ability, but they rarely get beyond Master in a hurry. Being a "natural" only gets you so far. The rest is disciplene. You guys who don't shoot competition are missing out on a great experience, no matter the discipline. __________________ Favor the X. Steve Smith NRA Life Member

April 25, 2002, 01:05 PM	#35
jaysouth Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2001 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 787	Before I had a cataract removed in December, EVERYONE that showed up at the range shot better that me. Now with improved vision, I manage to outshoot someone every now and then. However, no one has ever had more fun that I do at the range.

April 25, 2002, 01:23 PM	#36
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,546	To those polled who only know five or fewer people who can outshoot them: You guys should try to get out more. Or am I reading about you in the magazines under your real names?

April 25, 2002, 03:09 PM	#37
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	I used to think that I was hot stuff. I could outshoot any of my friends. Then I started shooting IDPA. Competition really forces you to be better. You can't just discount all of those times you miss in the backyard shooting cans. Not when you are shooting for score, while being timed, and a mess of folks are watching you. And then if you think you are getting good, find an IPSC Grandmaster and shoot against them, man on man, in a steel challenge match. Very humbling. The only time I have been able to beat somebody that good on a stage is when they have a really bad malfunction. I consider myself a pretty good generalist, meaning that I'm pretty good at most types of shooting, pistol, rifle, shotgun. (maybe that is why my highest finishes are at 3 gun) But then when you get into specialization, whoa, then it is really easy to get blown away by how good some people out there are. I can go out shotgunning with a bunch of buddies, and beat just about anybody I know if we are hand throwing clay pigeons out in the desert, but if I were to go to a Sporting Clays match, I would get my butt handed to me.

April 25, 2002, 06:12 PM	#38
ronin308 Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2001 Posts: 1,977	falconer- Caliban gets so POed when people talk smack on his muzzle brake. We should just hacksaw it off when he's sleeping...but on the other hand, the muzzle brake does clear up my sinuses __________________ If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara desert in five years there’d be a shortage of sand. -Milton Friedman

April 26, 2002, 12:09 AM	#39
Jamie Young Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2000 Location: SE/PA Posts: 4,834	TFL member K80Geoff wanted to shoot My Beretta 92FS just to see what the hub bub was all about. He picked it up, shot it better than I ever shot it, and handed it back to me and said, "I don't like the Trigger." __________________ Find out about Gun Shows and Training activities. www.TheRallyPoint.org Get your gun club involved!!

April 26, 2002, 12:22 AM	#40
speed Senior Member Join Date: September 30, 2001 Posts: 353	It's tough to post something that does'nt go at least a little off subject. When I posted this question originally I figured it would end up here sooner or later. As of now, TFL'ers are lookin pretty good as I suspected they would.In my opinion it only makes sense . The question say's how many people do you (KNOW PERSONALLY OR CASUALLY)..... Not...... (KNOW OF) I think many who voted 30 or more included people that they (KNOW OF)...........Am I correct?.............Well either I am or you all are some friendly SOB's __________________ ::::::::::::::::::::::::::speed::::::::::::::::::::::::

April 26, 2002, 03:00 AM	#41
Modifiedbrowning Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 613	Unfortunately, I have been shooting pretty much by myself, except for a friend or two I dragged along. Until I join the local range I guess I don't know for sure. Any TFL shooters here in Montana near Bozeman? __________________ "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are" Buckaroo Banzai

April 26, 2002, 03:49 AM	#42
Flexmoney Member Join Date: April 25, 2002 Location: Ohio (Columbus, McConnelsville) Posts: 23	Looks like the is a club right down the street from you...in Belgrade. Link here. Heck, you could jog there. I am jealous...My shortest drive to a match is an hour. [Edit] O.K., it looks like it is on the other side of Belgrad. Better drive. (Ammo gets heavy.) __________________ Have fun, Kyle

April 26, 2002, 04:51 AM	#43
Modifiedbrowning Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 613	Flex, friend o mine, first of all Belgrade is eight(8) miles from Bozone, Logan is at least another six(6). Just kidding, I've actually been to the Logan range, but this is Montana, and Logan is an outdoor range. Also, I can't afford to join right now so that it why I've been going to the local national forest for my shooting needs. __________________ "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are" Buckaroo Banzai

April 26, 2002, 06:21 AM	#44
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	falconer (Tom) said it best. It's all relative. It's all relative to what your goal is. The only person I have ANY desire to beat is myself.

April 26, 2002, 12:32 PM	#45
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	I shoot B/USPSA and Sharpshooter/IDPA; all of the A, Master, etc. shooters can outshoot me. That said, I suspect I can outshoot over 90% of the gun owners in the world.

April 27, 2002, 10:01 AM	#46
Fatelvis Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Lockport, IL Posts: 490	In HP comp, I`m surrounded by better shots than me. The makings for improvement in MY shooting!!

April 28, 2002, 05:24 PM	#47
vetts1911 Member Join Date: March 26, 2002 Location: MARYLAND Posts: 65	Jim Watson well said, I shoot around the world champ for IPSC and some of his friends. They put me at the 75% side and the only reason I beat any off them is cause a gun broke. You top guns try finding a match and not a can on the fence post. It will WAKE U UP!!!

April 29, 2002, 08:58 AM	#48
whizz Member Join Date: January 25, 2002 Location: sweden Posts: 93	So either the majority are BS:ers, are competing at world top level or have never entered a "real" competition. I know that at least 50 IPSC shooters in sweden can outshoot me ... :-). Thats what happened at the swedish nationals last year anyway. __________________ "When you hear someone shout DUCK, do not do the quack-quack sound ..."

April 29, 2002, 09:33 AM	#49
wakal Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2000 Location: San Angelo, Texas Posts: 317	I'm an IPSC "B" class shooter. The "B" means that a "Boatload" of shooters can whup me on a regular basis I've noticed that any shooter can beat any other shooter, at least once in a while. My wife (who I have beat on a steel shoot...with a reload...using a Colt SAA against her SiG P226) has beat me (quite legitimately) on some stages. I've beat Grandmasters now and then, but surely not often. I've RO'ed some of the best shooters currently in the game, and I know I'm not even CLOSE to the same level as they are. Fun to try, though Alex

May 18, 2002, 04:01 AM	#50
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	http://www.rbcd.net/ Down at the bottom of the page. David A. Stoker I've never met him though. (Although i'd certainly like too. Shooting like that is just a pure pleasure to watch,) I can honestly say that's a group that I'm not capable of firing at that range. 20 years ago I might have been able to come extremely close to it, maybe even duplicate,,,maybe even beat. Today ain't 20 years ago though. shrug Oh well, so it goes.