Open Carry Vs. Concealed carry

[PT111]

I think Thumper's 99% is a little high. However IMHO it isn't extremely high as was pointed out how many get on here and give a list of where they OC'd that day,what the reaction was and how they walked by a certain person, guard or LEO and tried to make sure they saw the gun. For some it is an ego trip for them to OC especially in a place that has a sign posted prohibiting Concealed Carry and laughing that since they didn't say Open Carry it was OK.

I really don't think that it is going to do the cause much good if the first thing you do when a LEO walks up to you is pull out a list of rights and start reading them off telling him to go chase thyself that you haven't broken any laws and you refuse to tell him your name without a search warrant. However acting like it is a natural thing, trying not to draw attention to yourself and being courteous can go a long way. If we want people to respect our rights we must show them that we respect their rights.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

I don't get your comment, Al. Do you mean that folks who don't OC when they can advance disarmament or just CC in general. I would disagree with the latter as I think the 40 states shall issue laws have brought positive gun usage more to fore in the public mind and strengthened the RKBA debates. Access to carry makes more folks consider it and then want to own guns and protect that right.

[Diesel1]

I believe you lose an advantage if you are carrying in the open.
Better not to scare the sheep. If your going to act like the wolf,
you'll need the element of surprise. I believe it's lost when you show your cards at the outset.

[Redneckrepairs]

Folks if you should want to OC and it is legal where you live ( it is where i live ) by all means have at it . It will lead to contacts from LE deal with it . For myself i conceal carry , but then i did also back when i was in LE . I was not the cop you saw at the cafe with his gun and badge on display . I am not anti OC, but realize that if i OC it will draw attention i really dont care for , kinda like if i walk down the street only wearing a thong swimming suit here in colorado . I can legally do that also , tho it is almost garonteed to draw the attention of the local finest faster than the handgun would and i likely would be cuffed faster ( for officer safety ) to boot .

[Wildalaska]

kinda like if i walk down the street only wearing a thong swimming suit

If I was to do that carrying a Lewis Gun over my shoulder, the calls to the cops would NOT be "man with a gun"

WildiwouldgetchargedwithpublicgrossnessAlaska TM

[Redneckrepairs]

Oh yea Ken , the " by the way he is armed " would be less mentioned than the " perv on the loose " call lol .

[TheNatureBoy]

I'm always concealed. People freak out when they see guns. I don't need the unnecessary attention.

_________________________

"Attack. Attack. No recriminations,
no defensive strategy."

[Glenn E. Meyer]

In San Antonio, there is an ordinance that says you must cover the family jewels and the butt hole. Thus, some dude went bicycling around the ritzy neighborhood just wearing a flesh color thong. Despite complaints, he was legal. He later killed himself as he was rather disturbed.

Since it is legal to carry a long arm, one could put on your tactical thong, sling on your AR-15 and take a stroll by Central Market.

The resulting yuppie hilarity would be fun to observe - may not after the cops treat you ill. Then you can sue.

[tegemu]

Open Carry = Shoot me first.

[David Armstrong]

If I was to do that carrying a Lewis Gun over my shoulder, the calls to the cops would NOT be "man with a gun"

Ummm, man in possession of a dead weapon?

[Capt. Charlie]

This is a family board. Several inappropriate posts and a response have been deleted.

Let's clean it up a bit folks.

[Kruniac]

Well, when it comes down to it, I have to go with Conceal.

Open is good for encouraging criminals to seek a caper elsewhere, but theres two problems with this.

1 - The crime will most likely take place elsewhere.

2 - If they really dont care, they'll do it anyway, AND blast you first.


Conceal has one very distinct advantage. Ignoring the legal ramifications, as one would in a true life-or-death (or someone else's death) scenario, a conceal carry weapon has surprise.

Imagine a young guy who looks harmless enough, wearing normal clothes, getting some chips at a gas station. A man walks in to rob said gas station. Now you are behind this guy, you are wearing normal clothes (he did not register you as a threat), you arent armed (so he thinks) - he'll just ignore you and be about his intimidating posturing, and perhaps even murder.

With an open carry, you wouldnt even have THIS advantage. In a "Storm the gates" robbery, in which the peice is pulled while entering/before entering, the criminal already is pumped up for action, possibly even with narcotics. He IS ready to get down to business, and WILL see a threat to himself in your openly carried sidearm.

With a concealed carry, the gas station attendant is being threatened. This pumped up individual could just waste anyone in the gas station, or anyone in the area who tries to stop him. He doesnt care about you - you are harmless to him. Thats when the heat which he so easily missed comes out. One .380 (Insert concealed carry of choice caliber here if you dont like it) ACP later, we have a witness to your intervention, a dead perp (or greviously injured, read: harmless), and a lot of explaining to do to the police.

All in all, not a bad idea.

Go concealed if you want ACTIVE defense, and Open if you want PASSIVE defense. Open carry does all the work for you, any deterrant is lost on hardcore criminals, then its go time. Concealed carry REQUIRES you to take action (active defense), and is nothing of a deterrant.

I guess if you have a bulge in your pants leg, however, the perp might think twice about the job anyway.

[Archie]

In the world as it is, I must carry concealed. Okay, that's the way it is. I'm comfortable with it.

However, I would prefer to carry openly. (Presuming this to be legal and non exceptional.) One can carry a full size pistol and I find open carry more comfortable and convenient.

The concept of 'shoot me first' has been mentioned, and I counter with this: The bad guy walks into a 7-11 or bank, intent on robbery and quickly spots three people all carrying sidearms. Hmmm.

However, that probably won't happen this week.

[dawg23]

A couple of guys from this area (Louisiana) advocate open carry on a couple of "gun boards." Both are immature attention seekers who love confrontations........confrontations with soccer moms who are frightened, or confrontations with LEO's who stop them for questioning.

They love the idea of shocking the public, but claim they do so in an effort to advance our right to keep and bear arms. I personally don't need their kind help in advancing my rights.

On some boards they are labeled as "attention whores." This description may be too graphic here.....if so I apologize in advance and ask the mod to change the term to something less offensive, like "attention prostitute" or "attention slut."

ETA: My reference to AW's is directed at the two individuals I have mentioned in my comments above - not at any members who have posted in this thread.

[MyXD40]

Wow glad this thread is still making its rounds.

Winter time I conceal. But only because of my jacket covers it. When I go into a resturant, my jacket comes off, and theres my gun in open carry format.

Im not against concealed carry, I just find it uncomfortable. Plus half the time, people don't even notice my all black XD40. I was out iwht my friend the other day car shopping, we went to her storage unit, unloaded stuff out of her truck, went to one dealership, looked at a few cars, went to lunch, sat and ate, then went to another dealership. Test drove 3 cars, then when she came over to hug me or to kick my a$$ (shes a really good friend) she felt it, and said "I DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE PACKING! ADAM!!!!" ...4 HOURS, she didn't even notice. And the sales woman who was helping us at the 2nd dealership, she didn't notice until after we got out of the 4 car we test drove!

Unless you look for it, odds are you'll not notice it. But yes, there is that risk..you will be the first target if the BG wants to go through with his actions.

[PT111]

dawg23: Your comments about the AW's hit the nail on the head IMHO. I really don't think they are doing any thing to advance the 2A cause. I wish that SC had OC for the simple reason that I wouldn't have to worry quite so much about keeping it hid, more like TN where a permit is a carry permit rather than a CWP. Even with OC I would at least try to be unobtrusive about it rather than waving it in everyone's face.

I don't know that any of the situations about OC or CC being a deterent hold much water when the BG is strung out looking for a quick buck to buy another hit. hmmm - Rather than robbing the local 7-11 for money to buy drugs why doesn't he rob the drug dealer and get them all at one time? - hmmm. Sorry, off track for a moment. While carrying act like you been there before and be courteous, nothing turns people away like a smart mouth and do whatever is confortable.

[BluesBear]

I understand where you're coming from Dawg. There are a few on www.opencarry.org who could be classified as being an "Attention Ho".
But then I have met quite a few "A-Hos" who get a concealed carry permit and think they're Popeye Doyle or Starsky AND Hutch. They are always bragging about their permit, boasting about what they carry. Out in poublic they "adjust" their "weapon" more than Michael Jackson. And in locales where you have to keep your CCW completely concealed they always seem to flash their extra magazines.
Let's face it, in all walks of life, there will always be braggarts and fools that tarnish the image of the rest of us. Which is why we must strive to be the best ambassadors for our beliefs that we can be.

The two primary reasons I carry at three o'clock or nine o'clock are that it's easier for me to draw and my arm offers natural cover. When I open carry I'm not a peacock about it. I leave my hand tooled El Paso "barbeque" holster at home. I tend to use a plain Baker Pancake so as to draw as little attention as possible. I use holsters that completely cover the barrel.
The whole idea is to carry openly so that it becomes second nature both for me and for everyone else.
It's there.
It's a gun.
So what?

[isshin68]

In Texas open carry is illegal. I usually carry in a black fanny pack turned to front. I have my CCP in my left shirt pocket along with driver's license. I am 50 something middle class in shape. I grew up extreme inner city and got to middle class. The type of person that would assault/rob you can smell GUN on a middle class white male with an obvious large fanny pack carried in this manner. I don't mind. I have not shot anyone yet and hope not to. I have not been interviewed by th police but if said happened, I would reach to front small obvious shirt pocket for ID not to pocket near fanny pack. Oh, I usually carry S&W 686 + 4in. barrel or full size 1911 either 38super or para ord. 14s .45.

[ghalleen]

When I go into a resturant, my jacket comes off, and theres my gun in open carry format.

I do not open carry. However, when I'm in a restaurant, my jacket usually comes off, but I position myself so that you cannot see the firearm, or I sit next to my jacket, with the jacket covering the firearm.

[stephpd]

Just got my ccw and that is how I carry. Although open carry is allowed here in DE it's frowned on and not worth the hassle. Being stopped by the police or having the alarmed citizen calling the cops every few minutes is a waste of my time. Also if in a bad situation I'd rather not let the bad guys know that I'm their worst enemy, give me an edge since I look less threatening.

[blackbear]

When I see someone walking around in public with an exposed handgun, I get my wife and kids and leave. This ain't Dodge City in the 1800's. I carry, but I don't have to advertise it. There is no tactical advantage in exposing your sidearm.

[tegemu]

It's a shoot me first sign.

[Al Norris]

Glenn, I apologize in not getting back to this thread sooner, as your question deserved a timely and thoughtful answer.

Originally Posted by Glenn E. Meyer

Do you mean that folks who don't OC when they can advance disarmament or just CC in general. I would disagree with the latter as I think the 40 states shall issue laws have brought positive gun usage more to fore in the public mind and strengthened the RKBA debates. Access to carry makes more folks consider it and then want to own guns and protect that right.

While the driving/travel analogy isn't exact, it is instructive.

My argument was less clear than what I intended. What I should have said:

Those that CC and oppose OC are in fact helping to bring about complete the disarming of the people. How? Since the mid to late 19th century, most States passed laws restricting the ability of citizens to carry concealed. Too, many States (and individual jurisdictions where allowed) were also passing laws limiting the ability of citizens to carry openly.

To expand upon that thought:

A few States and their Supreme Courts, continued to allow open carry as a fundamental right. However, in much of the US, it passed out of common practice and hence out of favor.

Fast forward to the late 1980's, where "shall issue" licensing became to be widespread.

It is this acceptance of licensing and the common opposition to open carry that parallels (though not a precise parallel) the early 1920's to the mid 1040's with licensing of citizens and their private transportation (something that was initially only used to regulate commercial transport) and the acceptance of the populace of the licensing. A populace that began to oppose unlicensed driving. We lost a fundamental right to travel and it's corollary right to use whatever means of travel we wanted in non-commercial travel over public roads and highways.

You must meet the minimum requirements of a particular States licensing scheme and your Drivers License is "shall issue." Does any of this sound familiar? Read on...

Reciprocity issues with other states were settled the same exact way that reciprocity with CC permits are now being instituted. The Federal Government had and has no involvement with either of these licensing and reciprocity issues, then or now.

Read any gun-board that deals with issues such as open carry v. concealed carry and you will find the same arguments used in this thread. Both for and against. With very little editing, the same arguments were used in drivers licenses and why you should be licensed as opposed to just driving without paying the state a fee for a permission to do what you had a legal right to do.

Now, juxtapose the licensing requirements for guns in general (in some States) and concealed carry in particular.

How many people think that all guns must be licensed in order to even own them? Even in States where such is not a legal issue, the average person still thinks that gunowners must have some sort of license. After all, we license drivers, why not those that carry guns? Isn't that the uninformed argument?

So then the question becomes, how long before the rest of the States fall into line and require a license for any carry? A subsidiary question is, how long before all guns must be registered, just like vehicles must be?

So how long, before the logical progression of governmental regulation, catches up to gun owners, the way it has with people who own and drive vehicles (which is basicly everyone)?

Hence my reasoning that those who espouse CC and oppose OC are helping to defeat a basic and fundamental right. Carrying a firearm for personal protection should not be restricted to only those that can meet the criteria of the State for a license, which is often times prohibitive in cost to lower income people.

And thus, the people become disarmed.

[WhiteFeather93]

Very good post Antipitas.


Antipitas's point is that anything can be spun to sound good and turn out horribly bad. And if you think attempts to make only the social elite armed aren't going to be made think again they already have.

http://www.gunlawnews.org/sullivan.html

California has recently passed legislation requiring Microstamping of hanguns.

http://www.reuters.com/article/domes...e=domesticNews

Not only will this drive up the cost of firearms but many firearm makers are warning that this legislation will cause them to choose not to sell their product in California. Thus without even banning firearms California will have done so.

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51254

You may not like the idea of OC and feel that it gives up some "Tactical Advantage." imagined or not but by concealing your right, you conceal the truth from those need to learn it before it is too late.

P.S. Some people already think carrying a firearm for protection is "in bad class and tasteless." concealed or not.

P.P.S. Just don't let our country end up like this...

http://www.weaponvideos.org/viewvide..._the_UK__NRA_/

[P5 Guy]

But I'd rather open carry.