handgun wildcating

Carbon_15 · March 30, 2002, 09:43 PM

Can anyone point me in the direction of some information, advice, or software that deals with the development of handgun wildcats? I'm particularly interested in developing a long range, flat shooting varmint cartridge for use in semi-auto handguns based on a 10mm case necked down to .223 or even .17. I would have liked to have had access to the .224 BOZ cartridge, but the developers are quite protective of it. I think it would be quite easy to develope a similar but not identical load without infringing on anyones licence.
(Actualy, i have recently learned that the BOZ is not based off the 10mm case, but the finished product has a length and head deminsions which make it suitable for use in modified 10mm guns)

Chris McDermott · March 31, 2002, 05:01 PM

I've never heard of anyone wanting to do this in a semi-auto; though it was popular back in the 50's/60's in revolvers. Revolvers have problems you don't need to consider in a semi-auto; the case lengthening and getting wedged between the chambers shoulder and the recoil shield tying up the gun. Semi-autos could have trouble feeding from a magazine due to the case length that touches the feed lips being shorter; and I don't know of any smiths setup to make a barrel with that small of a caliber. You might try to talk to Gary Reeder, he makes revolvers with cartridges that have been necked down and might be able to tell you more.

Gary Reeder Custom Guns

kurt IA. · April 3, 2002, 12:43 PM

I think its already ben done. A guy in MT. had one very similar to that, Developed for bolt action though. Never saw how it grouped, and he is the only one with it that I know of. Can't even think of his name now. Old age!!

db4 · April 7, 2002, 12:50 AM

Ah yes, the British ballistic miracle, the .224 BOZO- oops i guess i mean BOZ. Short answer is that there is nothing really new under the sun, we have been necking up, necking down, shortening, stretching, straightening,forming, reforming,profiling, and generally messing with cartridges since there have been cartridges. The sillier among us have even tried patenting these derivatives (see: 22 Varminter).The brit twits may have some patent protection in blighty but all their bluster is absolutely meaningless here- which explains their aggressive bull****, the only hope is intimidation. Wanna develop something very similar? Hell, wanna develop something absolutely identical? Go ahead. Not a thing they can do about it
And the feds? Smallish 22's are nothing new or special. ballistically, almost nothing is new or special. build what you like, but avoid names like copkiller or fedwhack or armorbleed, try and keep a low profile...but i gotta kinda like fedwhack...

**Bud Helms** · April 7, 2002, 04:56 AM

db4: "Short answer is that there is nothing really new under the sun, we have been necking up, necking down, shortening, stretching, straightening,forming, reforming,profiling, and generally messing with cartridges since there have been cartridges. "

Db4's right. I remember the first time I got my hands on P.O. Ackley's Handbook For Shooters and Reloaders. I reached the conclusion that the forward thinking cartridge makers of 60 years ago were thinking pretty darned far ahead of me!

C.R.Sam · April 7, 2002, 11:33 AM

If it looks new, your memory is lacking.

Good promoter can always get more mileage out of an old workhorse with a catchy new name.

Sam

March 30, 2002, 09:43 PM	#1
Carbon_15 Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2001 Location: Lexington, SC Posts: 938	handgun wildcating Can anyone point me in the direction of some information, advice, or software that deals with the development of handgun wildcats? I'm particularly interested in developing a long range, flat shooting varmint cartridge for use in semi-auto handguns based on a 10mm case necked down to .223 or even .17. I would have liked to have had access to the .224 BOZ cartridge, but the developers are quite protective of it. I think it would be quite easy to develope a similar but not identical load without infringing on anyones licence. (Actualy, i have recently learned that the BOZ is not based off the 10mm case, but the finished product has a length and head deminsions which make it suitable for use in modified 10mm guns) __________________ Molon Labe http://carolinashootersforum.com/index.php

March 31, 2002, 05:01 PM	#2
Chris McDermott Senior Member Join Date: March 30, 2000 Posts: 245	I've never heard of anyone wanting to do this in a semi-auto; though it was popular back in the 50's/60's in revolvers. Revolvers have problems you don't need to consider in a semi-auto; the case lengthening and getting wedged between the chambers shoulder and the recoil shield tying up the gun. Semi-autos could have trouble feeding from a magazine due to the case length that touches the feed lips being shorter; and I don't know of any smiths setup to make a barrel with that small of a caliber. You might try to talk to Gary Reeder, he makes revolvers with cartridges that have been necked down and might be able to tell you more. Gary Reeder Custom Guns

April 3, 2002, 12:43 PM	#3
kurt IA. Senior Member Join Date: February 19, 2001 Location: Iowa Posts: 141	I think its already ben done. A guy in MT. had one very similar to that, Developed for bolt action though. Never saw how it grouped, and he is the only one with it that I know of. Can't even think of his name now. Old age!!

April 7, 2002, 12:50 AM	#4
db4 Member Join Date: December 8, 2001 Location: Oregun Posts: 53	Ah yes, the British ballistic miracle, the .224 BOZO- oops i guess i mean BOZ. Short answer is that there is nothing really new under the sun, we have been necking up, necking down, shortening, stretching, straightening,forming, reforming,profiling, and generally messing with cartridges since there have been cartridges. The sillier among us have even tried patenting these derivatives (see: 22 Varminter).The brit twits may have some patent protection in blighty but all their bluster is absolutely meaningless here- which explains their aggressive bull****, the only hope is intimidation. Wanna develop something very similar? Hell, wanna develop something absolutely identical? Go ahead. Not a thing they can do about it And the feds? Smallish 22's are nothing new or special. ballistically, almost nothing is new or special. build what you like, but avoid names like copkiller or fedwhack or armorbleed, try and keep a low profile...but i gotta kinda like fedwhack...

April 7, 2002, 04:56 AM	#5
Bud Helms Senior Member Join Date: December 31, 1999 Location: Middle Georgia, USA Posts: 13,198	db4: "Short answer is that there is nothing really new under the sun, we have been necking up, necking down, shortening, stretching, straightening,forming, reforming,profiling, and generally messing with cartridges since there have been cartridges. " Db4's right. I remember the first time I got my hands on P.O. Ackley's Handbook For Shooters and Reloaders. I reached the conclusion that the forward thinking cartridge makers of 60 years ago were thinking pretty darned far ahead of me!

April 7, 2002, 11:33 AM	#6
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	If it looks new, your memory is lacking. Good promoter can always get more mileage out of an old workhorse with a catchy new name. Sam