SAA Timeing

olmontanaboy · April 11, 2009, 06:18 PM

I got a SAA 45 clone (Pietta) It's unfired. in examining it I see that the cylinder indexing if off a little, when I shine a light down the barrel I can see a slight sliver of the cylinder face on one side of each of the six cylinders, maybe 1/32 of an inch at it's thickest. The action cycles fine and it locks up tight upon cocking. I have two spare cylinders that came with the gun and each has the same problem when installed in the gun. the cylinder locking bolt fits in the frame fine and has no play or looseness. I got this used so returning it is not an option. Is this something that can be adjusted?
Thanks

D.Delozier · April 11, 2009, 07:42 PM

Is it turning too far or not far enough? this makes a difference on how you go about correcting the problem.Also make sure the bolt is in fact going into the stop notches and not just kinda jamming it's self in the begining of the opening,If you have a dial caliper check the thickness of the bolt and the width of the stop notches,the bolt should be a bit smaller than the notches.The bolt needs to fit properly before any thing else goes on.If it does not fit dont just start fileing on it,It makes a difference which side of the bolt you take the metal off of depending on if it;s over or under turning.If it's over indexing the pawl or hand that turns the cylinder is a bit to long, thats easier to fix than under indexing.Under indexing means the hand may be too short,I've read about people straighting out the hand a bit to make it longer(dont know if thats proper or not) or welding a little tit on the end of the hand and fileing and stoneing till everything works right and the rehardening the hand.There are others here who are smarter than me about this stuff that I'm sure will ring in here,But I'm sure the bolt and notch interface is where you want to start.

CaptainCrossman · April 11, 2009, 08:22 PM

what he said, take the bolt out of the gun, try it in the cylinder notches, see if it fits- I've had to file down bolts before on the sides, and debur cylinder notches, to get a good timing lockup alignment

that is a damned shame- where the heck is their QC inspection ? These importers are sending these POS guns to the USA, and taking us for fools, just like the Chinese are with all the junk they send here. A Uberti is NOT a cheap gun- it's actually pret-ty expensive for a repro. I've seen Rugers made in USA 45 LC for only $300 at gun shows, and Ubertis are sometimes even more.

that may be a bolt problem, or if you're lucky, the 2nd lower finger of the hand may be too long. You could try to file it down, see if it helps- but is it over-cocking, or not moving far enough to line up ?

you could try swapping in different cylinders, bolts, hands, triggers and see if it comes in.

I'd take it back if I was you. You should not have to 'smith a new gun. Take it back and buy a Ruger.

what was the purchase price, if you don't mind me asking ?

olmontanaboy · April 12, 2009, 05:28 AM

Well, aside from the alinement issue it's a very nice revolver, I got it as part of a trade, I figure I'm into it for about $200.00. fit and finish is very nice, I have several Pietta C+P and several Ubertis all of recent manufacture the latest being a Uberti Walker. I think their both pretty good guns. In my opinion your much better off buying one in person if you can, if you can't, go with Cabela's, if you get one that's unacceptable they will send you another one or refund your money with no problems.
Years ago I had a second gen Colt model P .45, it was made in 1955, first year of reissue, wow what a beauty, it was unfired in the box, I never shot it and later traded it off. That gun today would be worth thousands. Now this Pietta aint no origional Colt and It might require some adjustments but It's a pretty fair copy of that old Colt I had, and at a price where people who otherwise couldn't touch an origional can shoot the hell out of it, holster it and teach you grandkids to shoot with. Rugers are great guns and I've had my share of them, trouble free right out of the box and I like them. That said, their a breed of their own with coil springs and unique lockwork their also more expensive than a lot of the Italian clones.
I know some of us have had some issues with the Italian guns and I've a few too, but I'm glad their availble and am willing to sort out the few problems I might encounter. Without them how many of us would get to hold a Walker much less shoot one and call it yours.

olmontanaboy · April 12, 2009, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Is it turning too far or not far enough? this makes a difference on how you go about correcting the problem.Also make sure the bolt is in fact going into the stop notches and not just kinda jamming it's self in the begining of the opening,If you have a dial caliper check the thickness of the bolt and the width of the stop notches,the bolt should be a bit smaller than the notches.The bolt needs to fit properly before any thing else goes on.If it does not fit dont just start fileing on it,It makes a difference which side of the bolt you take the metal off of depending on if it;s over or under turning.If it's over indexing the pawl or hand that turns the cylinder is a bit to long, thats easier to fix than under indexing.Under indexing means the hand may be too short,I've read about people straighting out the hand a bit to make it longer(dont know if thats proper or not) or welding a little tit on the end of the hand and fileing and stoneing till everything works right and the rehardening the hand.There are others here who are smarter than me about this stuff that I'm sure will ring in here,But I'm sure the bolt and notch interface is where you want to start.

Thanks, very helpfull

Hawg · April 12, 2009, 07:25 AM

I'm pretty much in agreement with D. Delozier. I wouldn't waste any time trying to straighten or lengthen a hand tho as cheap as they are. First you need to determine whether it's over traveling or stopping short and go from there.

arcticap · April 13, 2009, 02:13 PM

I've heard that Uberti has some good customer service. Maybe if you contact them and describe the situation, they'll fix it for you and you'll only be out the cost of shipping it.
I've had 2 new Ruger revolvers with issues, one of which is just waiting to be sent back now.

CaptainCrossman · May 3, 2009, 08:46 AM

The Ruger Old Army is far stronger than any Colt open top ever made, by Colt, Belgium, or Italy.

Teriod · May 3, 2009, 10:17 AM

Noise deleted

CaptainCrossman · May 3, 2009, 04:22 PM

Teriod: Interesting first post- it appears your "lurking" skills outweigh your gunsmithing/posting skills- next time, just use your "real" username ??

cylinder indexing is adjusted with the hand

not the bolt

all the bolt has to do, is fit snugly in the cylinder notch and lock the cylinder- OP has to check that first, then replace/adjust the hand length, to correct indexing

I believe you're confusing filing the vertical sides of the bolt, with filing a lead in one top edge of the bolt- 2 different issues

madcratebuilder · May 3, 2009, 05:13 PM

Quote:

I've been lurking here for quite awhile, even before I joined, and for the most part the information i have recieved has been great and accurate from 99% of the members on this site,

but im my opinion, CC is going to get someone hurt, and his biggest problem with open colts is his own mods and the swapping of model parts, for example "I've had to file down bolts before on the sides" when it is widly known you only file down the leading side

Near mind the capt, just put him on the ignore list. I think new users well see that he apparently has an axe to grind with cap and ball revolvers.

Quote:

The action cycles fine and it locks up tight upon cocking. I have two spare cylinders that came with the gun and each has the same problem when installed in the gun.

If you are getting a solid lock up with all three cylinders and all three are mis-aligned the same amount, I'm fairly certain it's a bolt problem. I would shoot it and see if it spits any lead and is reasonably accurate. a /132 is .031 inch. you have a forcing cone to help with minor mis-alignment.

April 11, 2009, 06:18 PM	#1
olmontanaboy Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Location: Northeast for now Posts: 266	SAA Timeing I got a SAA 45 clone (Pietta) It's unfired. in examining it I see that the cylinder indexing if off a little, when I shine a light down the barrel I can see a slight sliver of the cylinder face on one side of each of the six cylinders, maybe 1/32 of an inch at it's thickest. The action cycles fine and it locks up tight upon cocking. I have two spare cylinders that came with the gun and each has the same problem when installed in the gun. the cylinder locking bolt fits in the frame fine and has no play or looseness. I got this used so returning it is not an option. Is this something that can be adjusted? Thanks

May 3, 2009, 10:17 AM	#9
Teriod Junior member Join Date: April 16, 2009 Posts: 2	Noise deleted Last edited by 4V50 Gary; May 5, 2009 at 10:22 AM. Reason: Nap time.

May 3, 2009, 04:22 PM	#10
CaptainCrossman Junior member Join Date: April 2, 2009 Posts: 381	Teriod: Interesting first post- it appears your "lurking" skills outweigh your gunsmithing/posting skills- next time, just use your "real" username ?? cylinder indexing is adjusted with the hand not the bolt all the bolt has to do, is fit snugly in the cylinder notch and lock the cylinder- OP has to check that first, then replace/adjust the hand length, to correct indexing I believe you're confusing filing the vertical sides of the bolt, with filing a lead in one top edge of the bolt- 2 different issues Last edited by CaptainCrossman; May 3, 2009 at 05:32 PM.

April 11, 2009, 07:42 PM	#2
D.Delozier Member Join Date: March 28, 2009 Location: S.C Posts: 35	Is it turning too far or not far enough? this makes a difference on how you go about correcting the problem.Also make sure the bolt is in fact going into the stop notches and not just kinda jamming it's self in the begining of the opening,If you have a dial caliper check the thickness of the bolt and the width of the stop notches,the bolt should be a bit smaller than the notches.The bolt needs to fit properly before any thing else goes on.If it does not fit dont just start fileing on it,It makes a difference which side of the bolt you take the metal off of depending on if it;s over or under turning.If it's over indexing the pawl or hand that turns the cylinder is a bit to long, thats easier to fix than under indexing.Under indexing means the hand may be too short,I've read about people straighting out the hand a bit to make it longer(dont know if thats proper or not) or welding a little tit on the end of the hand and fileing and stoneing till everything works right and the rehardening the hand.There are others here who are smarter than me about this stuff that I'm sure will ring in here,But I'm sure the bolt and notch interface is where you want to start.

April 11, 2009, 08:22 PM	#3
CaptainCrossman Junior member Join Date: April 2, 2009 Posts: 381	what he said, take the bolt out of the gun, try it in the cylinder notches, see if it fits- I've had to file down bolts before on the sides, and debur cylinder notches, to get a good timing lockup alignment that is a damned shame- where the heck is their QC inspection ? These importers are sending these POS guns to the USA, and taking us for fools, just like the Chinese are with all the junk they send here. A Uberti is NOT a cheap gun- it's actually pret-ty expensive for a repro. I've seen Rugers made in USA 45 LC for only $300 at gun shows, and Ubertis are sometimes even more. that may be a bolt problem, or if you're lucky, the 2nd lower finger of the hand may be too long. You could try to file it down, see if it helps- but is it over-cocking, or not moving far enough to line up ? you could try swapping in different cylinders, bolts, hands, triggers and see if it comes in. I'd take it back if I was you. You should not have to 'smith a new gun. Take it back and buy a Ruger. what was the purchase price, if you don't mind me asking ?

April 12, 2009, 05:28 AM	#4
olmontanaboy Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Location: Northeast for now Posts: 266	Well, aside from the alinement issue it's a very nice revolver, I got it as part of a trade, I figure I'm into it for about $200.00. fit and finish is very nice, I have several Pietta C+P and several Ubertis all of recent manufacture the latest being a Uberti Walker. I think their both pretty good guns. In my opinion your much better off buying one in person if you can, if you can't, go with Cabela's, if you get one that's unacceptable they will send you another one or refund your money with no problems. Years ago I had a second gen Colt model P .45, it was made in 1955, first year of reissue, wow what a beauty, it was unfired in the box, I never shot it and later traded it off. That gun today would be worth thousands. Now this Pietta aint no origional Colt and It might require some adjustments but It's a pretty fair copy of that old Colt I had, and at a price where people who otherwise couldn't touch an origional can shoot the hell out of it, holster it and teach you grandkids to shoot with. Rugers are great guns and I've had my share of them, trouble free right out of the box and I like them. That said, their a breed of their own with coil springs and unique lockwork their also more expensive than a lot of the Italian clones. I know some of us have had some issues with the Italian guns and I've a few too, but I'm glad their availble and am willing to sort out the few problems I might encounter. Without them how many of us would get to hold a Walker much less shoot one and call it yours.

April 12, 2009, 07:25 AM	#6
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,190	I'm pretty much in agreement with D. Delozier. I wouldn't waste any time trying to straighten or lengthen a hand tho as cheap as they are. First you need to determine whether it's over traveling or stopping short and go from there.

April 13, 2009, 02:13 PM	#7
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	I've heard that Uberti has some good customer service. Maybe if you contact them and describe the situation, they'll fix it for you and you'll only be out the cost of shipping it. I've had 2 new Ruger revolvers with issues, one of which is just waiting to be sent back now.

May 3, 2009, 08:46 AM	#8
CaptainCrossman Junior member Join Date: April 2, 2009 Posts: 381	The Ruger Old Army is far stronger than any Colt open top ever made, by Colt, Belgium, or Italy.