Real Life situation, what I would do differently - Page 2

Superhornet · May 3, 2006, 12:34 PM

Leadcounsel has a very good point. Do not broadcast your potential.

RoSAR1 · May 3, 2006, 02:59 PM

Mica, no offense, but you sound like a 70 year old lady. You immediately think 2 young individuals are up to no good. Ever think they could have been going for a walk, or visiting a friend there, relative etc...

Onebum · May 4, 2006, 01:23 PM

I don't post much anymore, but i'm on here more than once a day scanning new threads and posts. That said, Rosar1, I've noticed the odds of your posts including a personal insult for no reason are about 1:2. Seems just about every other time I see your name on a post you are insulting someone for no apparent reason.

This thread was started because someone had a situation they wanted to tell about, explain their thought process, and discuss other actions they could have taken and/or perhaps should have take. You compare this person to a 70 year old lady, then you make an immediate assumption that every time 2 people are seen the thread starter thinks they are evil.

I feel it was explained very well in the opening post why he was suspect of the intentions of the 2 and didn't think there was any question involving what he identified as a possible threat. It seemed to me he was looking for input on actions he could have/should have taken in place of what he did in the situation.

I'm sure I'll be the target of your next insult, and I don't mind, I just ask that you try to realize this is a forum for exchanging ideas and thoughts, a place where folks come to get answers to questions, real or hypothetical, they have that they are unsure of. TFL has and incredible ammount of knowlege and experience available to anyone who asks.

If its a person with decades of learning and experience OR a newbie that happened to know a good bit of info, the wealth of knowledge and experience available on TFL is amazing. People share what they know so others don't have to learn the hard way by making a poor decision the first time they are in a situation. This is an exchange, not a verbal joust.

RoSAR1 · May 4, 2006, 03:31 PM

If you would have read the thread you would see that the only indication he had that these 2 people were "up to no good" was that they were young. Good call

We all know how the typical 19 year old these days are all looking to rob someone

Like I said, they could have been visiting a friend, relative, or just taking a walk. Last time I checked that's still legal. Human beings do travel on foot, you know.

Onebum · May 4, 2006, 03:50 PM

The thread is not about who is and isn't bad, its about what to do in the situation. If you had read the opening post you may have realized that, good call. There is mention of more than the fact they are young in the opening post, but the makeup of the 2 in the situation doesn't matter at all. If you had read the opening post you may have realized that as well, good call.

Sorry, i don't do smiley faces, and I do hope this will be my last post discussing things with you. You defend yourself to what I said by not talking about what I said. It doesn't matter if it was two old nuns in habits, its a question of what to do in the situation. That he gave any discription is good, but is hardly relevent. None of that matters, if he said they were 12 year olds with supersoakers (the high powered backpack kind, of course) there is still no reason to insult someone. That's the point.

Why do you feel the need to insult someone who disagrees with you? Why do you feel the need to insult someone because of a situation they described? Insulting basically screams that you are a troll...and when its for no reason, it makes you a special troll. Try to contribute something when you post. Read a post/thread, and add to the discussion...don't take one post and rip on the person because of how they said something or how you percieve them to be.

RoSAR1 · May 4, 2006, 04:29 PM

I saw 2 kids the other day at the grocery store around 18 years old. Jesus god man! What kind of 18 year old does their own grocery shopping!!! They were OBVIOUSLY up to no good, guys.

Powderman · May 4, 2006, 05:05 PM

RoSar1:

Ever been mugged? Held up? Jacked? Whatever you want to call it?

If you have, you would recognize from the way the incident was described that there were real and clear warning signs present that the poster heeded. It was a good thing that he did.

Far too frequently, we go about our lives and fail to realize that even on the most beautiful day, that the world can turn into a vicious and nasty place in a split second.

I deal with some of those "ideal" kids you talk about. I always try to give the benefit of the doubt, and have had great interactions with teenagers and adolescents in my jurisdiction. But I have also seen what happend when these teens turn into super-predators--they can and do strike with the shock and impact of a great white shark homing in on a seal. There is almost an art in it--peace and calm in one instant, deadly violence in the next.

Don't believe me? Watch the tape of the security officer in Las Vegas being attacked by about 15 or 20 youths. Without warning, he was swarmed and beaten almost senseless by a mob of predators--for no apparent reason that I could see. There was NOTHING he could to to defend himself, and NOTHING he could have done to prevent it. Note well that the beating only took about 8 to 10 seconds.

I have seen plenty of young guys and girls that are good people, and will be the backbone of our next generation. I have also seen the punkers, straight edgers, bangers, homeboyz and others who I will not turn my back on for a second.

It is obvious from your post that you are possibly a teenager or younger. Do you fall into one of those categories?

Bigfatts · May 4, 2006, 05:24 PM

I have been in a similar situation myself. And I do not think that it is "old ladyish" at all to think that 2 hoodlum looking people (regardless of age), who Mica said obviously did not belong in the area, show up as you are pulling into your parking spot and take up position exactly where they know you must pass by. I think it shows situational awareness.

I definatley would not retreat when about to enter my home, that would show them you are scared of them and make you a bigger target.

RoSAR1 · May 4, 2006, 06:21 PM

My point is that it's pretty irrelevant that he mentioned their age. Somehow he came to the logic that since most people that age don't live there they would have no reason to ever go there, which is false.

Bigfatts, now these 2 kids were "hoodlum" looking? Gee you must have been there because the original post didn't mention that. I also find it rather arrogant that Mica(original poster) would have the nerve to tell them to move along because they didn't belong there, according to him. Who do you think you are? You aren't a cop, and even if you were they aren't breaking the law. You have a CCW, you're not James Bond.

Onebum · May 4, 2006, 07:54 PM

Now you say your point is that he shouldn't have mentioned their age? If that is your new reason for joining, it basically contradicts your first two posts. It seems now that you have been called out, you have a point and a reason for an insult. If you point had been that the age of the people involved didn't matter, why not say that? He described the situation, VERY WELL, and gave estimates and details.

Does it offend you that he gave their age? Does the fact he guessed their age offend you? Because he guessed their age he is a 70 year old woman?

Your argument makes no sense. At least in your most recent post you actually gave a reason, instead of just getting personal for no reason. Basically, your most recent post explains you just stopped by to insult mica.

I was correct when I figured you would then turn on me. Wow, big surprise, thats basically all I've seen you do on these boards, its very rare you actually contribute.

Read the first post completely where he describes them more so later in the post, I would agree with Bigfatts that they were "hoodlum" looking. Nice to know that mica is now a 70 year old lady who is arrogant because where he lives and has property rights he spoke up when someone was on the property that had no right to be there. I guess if someone is in the common area of where I live, they don't live here, I'm arrogant for asking them to move on. Even though its within my rights since I am a legal owner of the common area, just as mica is of common area where he lives. They weren't on public property, there's a difference. Before your new defense is "its a free country, they can go where they want" private property is just that, private property.

Keep on creating new reasons for having insulted mica. While its cute that you are trying to validate the reason you insulted mica, your reasons so far make no sense. Basically, your new arguments show without question that you had no reason for posting other than to insult someone for no reason. Keep creating new reasons for insulting mica, or reasons I'm wrong and I'll keep showing why your reasons don't work by.....actually making sense.

Capt. Charlie · May 4, 2006, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Real Life situation, what I would do differently

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No I didn't shoot anybody.....

Last night around 6pm or so, still light out but overcast, I pulled into my parking space at my condo. As I pulled in and stop 2 guys 18/21 years old walking down the sidewalk turned up the sidewalk that leads to my building.

Anybody recognize this? It's the opening lines to the original post, by Mica. Perhaps we can get back to that?

Onebum · May 4, 2006, 11:47 PM

Capt, you are correct.

Mica, sorry about hijacking your thread when i responded to rosa, I had no intention of it going on further. Anyway, I agree you did a great thing with the open carry...being in virginia myself I love an open carry state. A few others had what may have been wiser actions.

I think of them all, staying in your car and calling 911 would be the best action, that is if you have a cell phone. That way you could eyeball their location in case they ducked in a hallway if a cop car pulled up, also if they turned their attention to another resident you would have been there in a support/witness/relay to police role.

Anyway, you made wise choices...the only different thing I would have done would be to walk with nothing in hand(unless a pipe wrench was handy to trasport to the house for plumbing in case the pistol didn't fix the leak) because anything in your hand is something in the way. If parking in another location and not passing directly between them was an option that would be good, but it didn't sound like that was an option.

RoSAR1 · May 5, 2006, 12:14 PM

He never said in his original post that they were hoodlum looking, I rest my case.

geronimo13 · May 5, 2006, 03:39 PM

The mind is an overactive thing for sure. I don't think being afraid would be possible if you were armed?, and sufficiently distanced. I wouldn't have carried anything in, come back for them later, and have your hands free. Talk to them in a casual way to accertain thier intentions (you can tell in their voice). And pass on one side, excuse yourself and push one to the other's side. Take picture with a cell phone and make a fake call while still in your car. If you show fear then a victim you will be. If they were really going to attack you, knifing you as you passed and stealing your gun would have been easy. They were just kids, out chillin as it played out. Take some aikido classes you might get more confidence, and enjoy it- I know I do.

mica · May 5, 2006, 05:55 PM

Rosar, I don't put every single detail in the post otherwise it would be extremely long. But you are way off the mark.

I KNOW my community I KNOW when someone looks out of place here. Period!!! If you like it or not overly layered clothing, baggie panted teens are out of place where I live, so yes, they will draw an extra look from me. They were at my building with no good intentions.

I never saw them before and I haven't seen them since. Talked to the condo manager and she told me on 6 occasions in the last month 'teens'(that don't LIVE here) had been arrested in our community.

Bigfatts · May 7, 2006, 09:37 PM

Rosar, I apologize for using the word hoodlum too freely

. I acquiesce that he did not mention the word. He did say that they were acting funny (trying too hard to be non-chalant) while blocking the sidewalk and looking like they were up to no good. I would describe that as hoodlum looking, but that's just me.

May 4, 2006, 01:23 PM	#28
Onebum Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Location: VA near DC Posts: 192	I don't post much anymore, but i'm on here more than once a day scanning new threads and posts. That said, Rosar1, I've noticed the odds of your posts including a personal insult for no reason are about 1:2. Seems just about every other time I see your name on a post you are insulting someone for no apparent reason. This thread was started because someone had a situation they wanted to tell about, explain their thought process, and discuss other actions they could have taken and/or perhaps should have take. You compare this person to a 70 year old lady, then you make an immediate assumption that every time 2 people are seen the thread starter thinks they are evil. I feel it was explained very well in the opening post why he was suspect of the intentions of the 2 and didn't think there was any question involving what he identified as a possible threat. It seemed to me he was looking for input on actions he could have/should have taken in place of what he did in the situation. I'm sure I'll be the target of your next insult, and I don't mind, I just ask that you try to realize this is a forum for exchanging ideas and thoughts, a place where folks come to get answers to questions, real or hypothetical, they have that they are unsure of. TFL has and incredible ammount of knowlege and experience available to anyone who asks. If its a person with decades of learning and experience OR a newbie that happened to know a good bit of info, the wealth of knowledge and experience available on TFL is amazing. People share what they know so others don't have to learn the hard way by making a poor decision the first time they are in a situation. This is an exchange, not a verbal joust. __________________ Da Bum

May 4, 2006, 03:50 PM	#30
Onebum Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Location: VA near DC Posts: 192	The thread is not about who is and isn't bad, its about what to do in the situation. If you had read the opening post you may have realized that, good call. There is mention of more than the fact they are young in the opening post, but the makeup of the 2 in the situation doesn't matter at all. If you had read the opening post you may have realized that as well, good call. Sorry, i don't do smiley faces, and I do hope this will be my last post discussing things with you. You defend yourself to what I said by not talking about what I said. It doesn't matter if it was two old nuns in habits, its a question of what to do in the situation. That he gave any discription is good, but is hardly relevent. None of that matters, if he said they were 12 year olds with supersoakers (the high powered backpack kind, of course) there is still no reason to insult someone. That's the point. Why do you feel the need to insult someone who disagrees with you? Why do you feel the need to insult someone because of a situation they described? Insulting basically screams that you are a troll...and when its for no reason, it makes you a special troll. Try to contribute something when you post. Read a post/thread, and add to the discussion...don't take one post and rip on the person because of how they said something or how you percieve them to be. __________________ Da Bum

May 4, 2006, 05:05 PM	#32
Powderman Senior Member Join Date: September 7, 2001 Location: Washington State Posts: 2,166	RoSar1: Ever been mugged? Held up? Jacked? Whatever you want to call it? If you have, you would recognize from the way the incident was described that there were real and clear warning signs present that the poster heeded. It was a good thing that he did. Far too frequently, we go about our lives and fail to realize that even on the most beautiful day, that the world can turn into a vicious and nasty place in a split second. I deal with some of those "ideal" kids you talk about. I always try to give the benefit of the doubt, and have had great interactions with teenagers and adolescents in my jurisdiction. But I have also seen what happend when these teens turn into super-predators--they can and do strike with the shock and impact of a great white shark homing in on a seal. There is almost an art in it--peace and calm in one instant, deadly violence in the next. Don't believe me? Watch the tape of the security officer in Las Vegas being attacked by about 15 or 20 youths. Without warning, he was swarmed and beaten almost senseless by a mob of predators--for no apparent reason that I could see. There was NOTHING he could to to defend himself, and NOTHING he could have done to prevent it. Note well that the beating only took about 8 to 10 seconds. I have seen plenty of young guys and girls that are good people, and will be the backbone of our next generation. I have also seen the punkers, straight edgers, bangers, homeboyz and others who I will not turn my back on for a second. It is obvious from your post that you are possibly a teenager or younger. Do you fall into one of those categories? __________________ Hiding in plain sight...

May 4, 2006, 07:54 PM	#35
Onebum Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Location: VA near DC Posts: 192	Now you say your point is that he shouldn't have mentioned their age? If that is your new reason for joining, it basically contradicts your first two posts. It seems now that you have been called out, you have a point and a reason for an insult. If you point had been that the age of the people involved didn't matter, why not say that? He described the situation, VERY WELL, and gave estimates and details. Does it offend you that he gave their age? Does the fact he guessed their age offend you? Because he guessed their age he is a 70 year old woman? Your argument makes no sense. At least in your most recent post you actually gave a reason, instead of just getting personal for no reason. Basically, your most recent post explains you just stopped by to insult mica. I was correct when I figured you would then turn on me. Wow, big surprise, thats basically all I've seen you do on these boards, its very rare you actually contribute. Read the first post completely where he describes them more so later in the post, I would agree with Bigfatts that they were "hoodlum" looking. Nice to know that mica is now a 70 year old lady who is arrogant because where he lives and has property rights he spoke up when someone was on the property that had no right to be there. I guess if someone is in the common area of where I live, they don't live here, I'm arrogant for asking them to move on. Even though its within my rights since I am a legal owner of the common area, just as mica is of common area where he lives. They weren't on public property, there's a difference. Before your new defense is "its a free country, they can go where they want" private property is just that, private property. Keep on creating new reasons for having insulted mica. While its cute that you are trying to validate the reason you insulted mica, your reasons so far make no sense. Basically, your new arguments show without question that you had no reason for posting other than to insult someone for no reason. Keep creating new reasons for insulting mica, or reasons I'm wrong and I'll keep showing why your reasons don't work by.....actually making sense. __________________ Da Bum

May 4, 2006, 11:47 PM	#37
Onebum Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Location: VA near DC Posts: 192	Capt, you are correct. Mica, sorry about hijacking your thread when i responded to rosa, I had no intention of it going on further. Anyway, I agree you did a great thing with the open carry...being in virginia myself I love an open carry state. A few others had what may have been wiser actions. I think of them all, staying in your car and calling 911 would be the best action, that is if you have a cell phone. That way you could eyeball their location in case they ducked in a hallway if a cop car pulled up, also if they turned their attention to another resident you would have been there in a support/witness/relay to police role. Anyway, you made wise choices...the only different thing I would have done would be to walk with nothing in hand(unless a pipe wrench was handy to trasport to the house for plumbing in case the pistol didn't fix the leak) because anything in your hand is something in the way. If parking in another location and not passing directly between them was an option that would be good, but it didn't sound like that was an option. __________________ Da Bum

May 3, 2006, 12:34 PM	#26
Superhornet Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2005 Location: florida Posts: 292	Leadcounsel has a very good point. Do not broadcast your potential.

May 3, 2006, 02:59 PM	#27
RoSAR1 Junior member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	Mica, no offense, but you sound like a 70 year old lady. You immediately think 2 young individuals are up to no good. Ever think they could have been going for a walk, or visiting a friend there, relative etc...

May 4, 2006, 03:31 PM	#29
RoSAR1 Junior member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	If you would have read the thread you would see that the only indication he had that these 2 people were "up to no good" was that they were young. Good call We all know how the typical 19 year old these days are all looking to rob someone Like I said, they could have been visiting a friend, relative, or just taking a walk. Last time I checked that's still legal. Human beings do travel on foot, you know.

May 4, 2006, 04:29 PM	#31
RoSAR1 Junior member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	I saw 2 kids the other day at the grocery store around 18 years old. Jesus god man! What kind of 18 year old does their own grocery shopping!!! They were OBVIOUSLY up to no good, guys.

May 4, 2006, 05:24 PM	#33
Bigfatts Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2005 Location: Lutz Posts: 1,528	I have been in a similar situation myself. And I do not think that it is "old ladyish" at all to think that 2 hoodlum looking people (regardless of age), who Mica said obviously did not belong in the area, show up as you are pulling into your parking spot and take up position exactly where they know you must pass by. I think it shows situational awareness. I definatley would not retreat when about to enter my home, that would show them you are scared of them and make you a bigger target.

May 4, 2006, 06:21 PM	#34
RoSAR1 Junior member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	My point is that it's pretty irrelevant that he mentioned their age. Somehow he came to the logic that since most people that age don't live there they would have no reason to ever go there, which is false. Bigfatts, now these 2 kids were "hoodlum" looking? Gee you must have been there because the original post didn't mention that. I also find it rather arrogant that Mica(original poster) would have the nerve to tell them to move along because they didn't belong there, according to him. Who do you think you are? You aren't a cop, and even if you were they aren't breaking the law. You have a CCW, you're not James Bond.

May 5, 2006, 12:14 PM	#38
RoSAR1 Junior member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	He never said in his original post that they were hoodlum looking, I rest my case.

May 5, 2006, 03:39 PM	#39
geronimo13 Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 41	The mind is an overactive thing for sure. I don't think being afraid would be possible if you were armed?, and sufficiently distanced. I wouldn't have carried anything in, come back for them later, and have your hands free. Talk to them in a casual way to accertain thier intentions (you can tell in their voice). And pass on one side, excuse yourself and push one to the other's side. Take picture with a cell phone and make a fake call while still in your car. If you show fear then a victim you will be. If they were really going to attack you, knifing you as you passed and stealing your gun would have been easy. They were just kids, out chillin as it played out. Take some aikido classes you might get more confidence, and enjoy it- I know I do.

May 5, 2006, 05:55 PM	#40
mica Member Join Date: March 15, 2006 Location: Shenandoah Valley, VA Posts: 89	Rosar, I don't put every single detail in the post otherwise it would be extremely long. But you are way off the mark. I KNOW my community I KNOW when someone looks out of place here. Period!!! If you like it or not overly layered clothing, baggie panted teens are out of place where I live, so yes, they will draw an extra look from me. They were at my building with no good intentions. I never saw them before and I haven't seen them since. Talked to the condo manager and she told me on 6 occasions in the last month 'teens'(that don't LIVE here) had been arrested in our community.

May 7, 2006, 09:37 PM	#41
Bigfatts Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2005 Location: Lutz Posts: 1,528	Rosar, I apologize for using the word hoodlum too freely . I acquiesce that he did not mention the word. He did say that they were acting funny (trying too hard to be non-chalant) while blocking the sidewalk and looking like they were up to no good. I would describe that as hoodlum looking, but that's just me.