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Old August 11, 2019, 09:29 AM   #26
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Hand fitting.
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Old August 11, 2019, 09:31 AM   #27
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I am puzzled about the price differences between the different kinds of revolvers. The cheapest revolvers are single action 22 calibers (Heritage Rough Riders) that sell for a little over $100. However, if you want a 22 caliber double action revolver, they start at well over $300 for the cheapest and the premium brands are much more expensive. Double action 38 Special revolvers are much cheaper starting at slightly over $200 and up to expensive for premium brands.

I don't understand why double action 22 revolvers are so much more expensive that many larger caliber double action revolvers. I recently bought a Charter Arms 22 caliber revolver. Charter Arms and Taurus were the only double action 22s I could find under $400 and the premium brands started at over $600 and most were well over $700. My Charter Arms 22 was over $100 more than the 38 Special I bought at about the same time.
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Old August 11, 2019, 12:17 PM   #28
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I don't understand why double action 22 revolvers are so much more expensive that many larger caliber double action revolvers.
Niche market.

It costs the maker as much (perhaps slightly more) to make a .22LR DA as it does to make a .38, .357, or other popular calibers. They don't sell nearly as many .22s as others so profit is less.

Same basic reason that .22 Hornet costs more than .30-30 (or .223). Even though the smaller Hornet rounds use slightly less material (case & powder) the cost to run the machinery making them is the same as larger rounds, and they sell far fewer, so the price is higher.
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Old August 11, 2019, 01:31 PM   #29
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Niche market.

It costs the maker as much (perhaps slightly more) to make a .22LR DA as it does to make a .38, .357, or other popular calibers. They don't sell nearly as many .22s as others so profit is less.

Same basic reason that .22 Hornet costs more than .30-30 (or .223). Even though the smaller Hornet rounds use slightly less material (case & powder) the cost to run the machinery making them is the same as larger rounds, and they sell far fewer, so the price is higher.
I don't think .22 DA revolvers are a niche market, but they do cost more. More chambers means more machine time, inspection time, the timing/lockwork is different vs a 5 or 6 shot revolver.
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Old August 11, 2019, 02:08 PM   #30
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Look at a revolver and examine all of the machined surfaces. Look at a plastic pistol and see the simple work.

A revolver's cylinder has 6 boreholes, six locking notches, six precision tabs to rotate the thing, ejection star, machined trigger assembly with a half dozen parts, steel frame and barrel, etc...

A Metal framed pistol is just as complex to make, with hammer, frame, slide, etc but they are made in greater volume.

When you buy a plastic framed pistol you get essentially a steel slide and barrel with a few steel parts that are fitted to a plastic frame that was cast around some components and the rest of it is put together by robots. (probably).

The glock can cost as little as $500 because it is cheap to make and the company wants to sell millions of them. It worked.

The 1911 and other steel frame handguns, if you buy a quality 9mm about in the quality range of a glock will cost you in the range of $800 to even $1,200

You can buy a revolver, a smith in .357 magnum for about $800.

An aluminum frame revolver can be had for less than the price of a glock. $400 dollar range.

A revolver can be a bargain. They are not more expensive than a high end pistol. I can get a boxed pair of vaquero .357s for about $1,700. A super redhawk alaskan for $1,000. A S&W 629 classic .44 magnum sells for $900.

A rather ordinary 1911 at the same place goes for $1,000. Upper scale 1911s with some custom features will cost well into the $2,000. and up range.

Don't look at an M&P and compare it to a steel framed revolver, or even a steel framed pistol. It's apples to prunes.
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Old August 11, 2019, 02:46 PM   #31
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I am puzzled about the price differences between the different kinds of revolvers. The cheapest revolvers are single action 22 calibers (Heritage Rough Riders) that sell for a little over $100. However, if you want a 22 caliber double action revolver, they start at well over $300 for the cheapest and the premium brands are much more expensive. Double action 38 Special revolvers are much cheaper starting at slightly over $200 and up to expensive for premium brands.



The prices for these things are absolutely logical. Is a rough rider a well made gun firing heavy duty loads? Not even remotely close. Aluminum frame .22 with painted finish on some, rough construction, icky looking. They don't sell for $100, you will mostly find them closer to $200. A cheap .38 of the same general grade will cost about $300. A smith and wesson bodyguard will cost about $400.

In the case of the smith, you will get a pretty nice nylon carrying case to hold ammo and lock the gun into a special holster type sling. The rough rider, well, you get a cardboard box.

people say that you get what you pay for. Wrong. You usually get whatever you are willing to pay. A good revolver is a bargain at these prices. A rough rider is what you get if you will only pay $200.

The $600 Glock 19-4 is the same glock 19-4 that you can find on sale at various places at various times of the year for only $450, or $500 any day of the week.
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Old August 11, 2019, 04:14 PM   #32
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A name brand, compact microwave oven costs $50 everyday and $25 on a black Friday sale. The microwave has far more parts, newer technology, larger footprint than any handgun but that is what people will pay for them.
If we stop paying $400 for guns, the prices will drop too.
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Old August 11, 2019, 05:25 PM   #33
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A name brand, compact microwave oven costs $50 everyday and $25 on a black Friday sale. The microwave has far more parts, newer technology, larger footprint than any handgun but that is what people will pay for them.
If we stop paying $400 for guns, the prices will drop too.
I get the feeling that in the case of revolvers, if we do that, the companies will just stop making them.
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Old August 11, 2019, 05:25 PM   #34
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A $40 microwave oven? I was about to throw the BS flag on you before I checked at Walpurgis Mart!

The difference between a $40 microwave and any firearm is that the microwave will always be put in a cart full of popcorn, coke, maybe a dish or two. It's probably not going to sell alone in more than 10% of purchases. it's a loss leader baitfish.

A cheap microwave is put together with dirt cheap indonesian components. Stamped casing. Universal cheap components that are found in maybe a million different machines made every year. A $10 magnetron tube, a $4 time and control unit, and a cord. A microwave now is not the same as the $600 amana that I bought when I got married, and ran for literally fifteen years or so. We have owned only three microwaves in forty years.

I don't know exactly how the rough rider is made. It is obviously made with four foot sections of barrels bought from Backhairastan. The components are investment cast in bangladesh and assembly is done in India.

Probably.

The fact is that millions of components for microwaves are produced every year by semi-third world nations, and these components are then assembled in more advanced nations before being sold to discount stores who aren't planning on making a profit on some of the models. They are the equivalent of the $5 pocket knife that you will find in a jar at the counter of the hardware store.

Look at this $24 bowie knife by schrade. 15" long with nylon sheath. Free shipping with store pickup.

(image courtesy of Home Depot)


The chinese take a strip of prepared steel and laser or waterjet cut it to shape. Hook it into a jig and use computerized machining to cut two edges and a roundover. Then they drill and screw on scales.

when you take off the plastic and put on figured walnut and make a leather sheath, it's cute as heck hanging on the wall.
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Old August 11, 2019, 05:35 PM   #35
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If we stop paying $400 for guns, the prices will drop too.
That ties into what I said about you get whatever you are willing to pay for something. Sometimes you get something far better than you should expect to get for the price you pay. Other times that $40 microwave isn't even worth the price of a light bulb.
If we stop buying $400-1,000 pistols one of two things will happen. the prices may go down to a more comfortable range. That may happen, but it is also possible that they are already at a cost and profit spread that they won't or can't reduce production costs or reduce prices. It's very likely that they will just stop making them and let taurus take over the market. The american businesses abandoned the side by side shotgun forty years ago, maybe, and then they were only made overseas by cheaper skilled labor. You could still get a gun quite equal to the winchesters at about the same price.
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Old August 11, 2019, 07:13 PM   #36
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44Amp.....thanks for the history lesson,, I appreciate it,,,,lot of stuff I had forgotten or didn’t remember correctly
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Old August 11, 2019, 07:44 PM   #37
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The prices for these things are absolutely logical. Is a rough rider a well made gun firing heavy duty loads? Not even remotely close. Aluminum frame .22 with painted finish on some, rough construction, icky looking. They don't sell for $100, you will mostly find them closer to $200. A cheap .38 of the same general grade will cost about $300. A smith and wesson bodyguard will cost about $400.

In the case of the smith, you will get a pretty nice nylon carrying case to hold ammo and lock the gun into a special holster type sling. The rough rider, well, you get a cardboard box.

people say that you get what you pay for. Wrong. You usually get whatever you are willing to pay. A good revolver is a bargain at these prices. A rough rider is what you get if you will only pay $200.

The $600 Glock 19-4 is the same glock 19-4 that you can find on sale at various places at various times of the year for only $450, or $500 any day of the week.
You clearly haven't shopped affordable revolvers. Heritage Rough Riders sell for $120 and up at Buds Gun Shop and 9 are $130 or less.

Buds Gun Shop also have 38 Special revolvers as low as $207 and he had 22 listed for $300 or less (including 1 S&W Bodyguard).

Look for yourself: https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/
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Old August 11, 2019, 09:22 PM   #38
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Osborne, those prices came from one and only one source. I didn't cherry pick, I just took what i could easily obtain and gave the true prices from those sources. I spent about an hour putting the post together to tell the true story as best as I could determine it from the perspective of some guy who could just walk into an average store that he has near home or easily find online. That took a lot of work for someone who was stuck on a couch with a migraine. I probably should have picked other places and different guns. I hoped that it would help.

Yes, a Smith .38 cost more than a rough rider. In this case, value isn't getting a gun for the price of a box of cigars. It's getting a gun for the price of a better box of cigars and maybe getting a better or more worthwhile product for a better price. I've got to stop now. I don't want switch the focus to only what I think because everyone has a right to express their their thoughts without someone shouting him down.
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Old August 11, 2019, 09:49 PM   #39
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I must add one more thing. The laws of economics are odd. If someone would fully examine the price of the VHS tape during the eighties and a bit further, boy, it could give you the biggest migraine of all. I did back when I was selling them by the thousands every year. They were mostly manufactured to the same case specs and there were only a few companies actually making the tape, basf was the biggest maker of tape, and that tape was in nearly every tape made that sold between three and ten dollars. but of course, nobody was supposed to know that, not even the people who sold them. My employer at the time was fond of pointing out that Tylenol, a name brand, was the same product that we sold for a fraction of the price from the same factory. You should have seen the margin between Prescription Motrin and generic, many from the same maker. Boots rufen was a good one, prescription grade of a simple chemical was enormously more expensive than the same product that was manufactured by the cargo container by another maker. they were both sold as approved products in the same pharmacies and eventually OTC. We are worked like morons by the makers and manufacturers in every possible way. That is the way of things. The products are quite often sold at prices that don't reflect their true value.

A person should never forget that every maker and seller of any product has a multi million dollar budget paid to marketing geniuses with MBAs that work to fool us. We have to spend our time and do our due diligence before we buy anything.

Do the rough rider guns still come with a black paint? The have the ruger wrangler in black cerakote for 250 at lipseys. Do they still sell at buds for about 200? Oh, geez, they are out of stock it seems at both places.

sorry, this was snarky. Maybe I shouldn't have posted it, but I've taken some meds to get rid of the headache and I'm not really myself. I don't intend to call you stupid or ignorant and I really, seriously apologize to everyone if it comes across that way. I admit that I am sometimes a nasty guy and often talk out of turn.

I still love that knife. it's as cute as can be and it cost me a pittance and a few hours to make it look great.

This really is the last time I'm going to visit this thread, I think that I have said everything that I can say. Most people here will probably agree.
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Old August 12, 2019, 12:32 AM   #40
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Why are revolvers so expensive ?
There are expensive revolvers, and there are cheap revolvers; somewhere in between, there are affordable, quality revolvers.
I don't want a cheap revolver. I cannot afford a genuine Colt SAA. A Ruger Vaquero or Blackhawk will have to do, and it will do so rather nicely. If we have noticed that even these cost a lot more than they used to, we ought to realize that the aforementioned Blackhawk has not essentially changed in over 45 years. So it's value is the same as it ever was. It's your money that buys a fraction of what it did 45 years ago.
It's better to buy and own just one really good revolver that you really like, even though it costs as much as three of the El Cheapo versions. After the money is spent, the better gun costs little or nothing more. It's the ammo you continue to spend on. You will probably never need more than one revolver anyway, so make it a good one. Ya don't have to be like Emelda Marcos and her shoes.
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Old August 12, 2019, 12:06 PM   #41
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In addition to the more difficult machining and assembly, I rather imagine that revolver manufacturers have lost any economy of scale that they once had, as semis have taken such a large part of the market.
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Old August 12, 2019, 12:59 PM   #42
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"...A new Colt..." Any Colt will cost more because it has 'COLT' stamped on it. Colt has been marketing on the name for eons. So has Browning and Winchester, among others.
However, as mentioned, it takes more machine shop time to make a revolver. They're far more complicated machines than any pistol.
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Old August 12, 2019, 01:30 PM   #43
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Osborne, those prices came from one and only one source. I didn't cherry pick, I just took what i could easily obtain and gave the true prices from those sources. I spent about an hour putting the post together to tell the true story as best as I could determine it from the perspective of some guy who could just walk into an average store that he has near home or easily find online. That took a lot of work for someone who was stuck on a couch with a migraine. I probably should have picked other places and different guns. I hoped that it would help.

Yes, a Smith .38 cost more than a rough rider. In this case, value isn't getting a gun for the price of a box of cigars. It's getting a gun for the price of a better box of cigars and maybe getting a better or more worthwhile product for a better price. I've got to stop now. I don't want switch the focus to only what I think because everyone has a right to express their their thoughts without someone shouting him down.
I used on source because Buds has a good variety and you can find what you are looking for in a couple of minutes. I can spend about 10 minutes online and beat Buds prices nearly every time. I've bought 5 new guns this year but only a couple from Buds because I found better prices or they were available locally for a better price and they were immediately available. I bought 3 affordable revolvers this year alone and have accumulated 5 (one was a gift and another used) within the last 10 months which means I seriously shopped. How many have you bought in that time period?
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Old August 12, 2019, 04:23 PM   #44
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I’ve picked up 4 in the last 3 months. All 4 have ended up being S&Ws. I happily paid the premium for the difference in refinement.

Rugers are strong and well built, but they always feel chunkier in my hand. Upside is they are a bit cheaper.

Charter and Taurus both make functional revolvers, neither are the quality of S&W, Ruger or Colt.

You can buy affordable revolvers, but trade off is refinement.
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Old August 13, 2019, 07:33 AM   #45
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Get a RIA, for around $250, Great little shooter. And 6 rounds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBYFwS5jhSg
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Old August 13, 2019, 09:06 AM   #46
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It’s an old saying that’s been roughly true forever: “a good revolver costs an ounce of gold”.

Even with CNC machined parts, a revolver requires skilled hand assembly and fussing with precise little fussy parts that are subject to great forces over years and years of use.

Gold is about $1400 an ounce... you could buy a decent S&W for less (or a lemon from S&W, but I digress) or a gem from Freedom Arms for twice as much that ounce of gold. The price is in the craftsmanship.

You can say a lot about Glock, but “beautiful work of the gunsmith’s art” isn’t one of them.

The price differential between Glock and Taurus is a little bit of materials, a bit more Q/C, and a lot of marketing. (25 years ago there were Brazilian revolvers I owned and liked, those days are gone.)

To be really honest, the new ruger revolvers I have gotten are pale imitations of my old single actions.

Good used revolver is all I would consider now.

Old guy final rant: “kids pay a thousand dollars for a stinking cell phone that lasts 2 years but balk at paying $700 for a firearm that will last 100 years”

Get off my lawn, too!
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Old August 13, 2019, 09:37 AM   #47
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Look at a revolver and examine all of the machined surfaces. Look at a plastic pistol and see the simple work.

A revolver's cylinder has 6 boreholes, six locking notches, six precision tabs to rotate the thing, ejection star, machined trigger assembly with a half dozen parts, steel frame and barrel, etc...

A Metal framed pistol is just as complex to make, with hammer, frame, slide, etc but they are made in greater volume.

When you buy a plastic framed pistol you get essentially a steel slide and barrel with a few steel parts that are fitted to a plastic frame that was cast around some components and the rest of it is put together by robots. (probably).

The glock can cost as little as $500 because it is cheap to make and the company wants to sell millions of them. It worked.

The 1911 and other steel frame handguns, if you buy a quality 9mm about in the quality range of a glock will cost you in the range of $800 to even $1,200

You can buy a revolver, a smith in .357 magnum for about $800.

An aluminum frame revolver can be had for less than the price of a glock. $400 dollar range.

A revolver can be a bargain. They are not more expensive than a high end pistol. I can get a boxed pair of vaquero .357s for about $1,700. A super redhawk alaskan for $1,000. A S&W 629 classic .44 magnum sells for $900.

A rather ordinary 1911 at the same place goes for $1,000. Upper scale 1911s with some custom features will cost well into the $2,000. and up range.

Don't look at an M&P and compare it to a steel framed revolver, or even a steel framed pistol. It's apples to prunes.
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Old August 17, 2019, 04:57 PM   #48
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When you consider that a revolver involves forging the frames and barrels or in Rugers case casting the parts from a one time use ceramic mold and the the final machining, polishing has to be done. A stainless gun can be smoothed and polished and the exterior is finished. A blued gun has to be hand polished and then blued. And bluing does not hide flaws. It shows them up. Then add in all the hand fitting and wood grips sanded to fit the frame you get a better idea of why a good revolver cost what it does.

In the book "Glock, Rise Of Americas Gun" it stated at that time it cost Glock about $100 to make each gun. There is no extended polishing done. Most of the parts are molded plastic and stamped flat metal pieces with a minimum of machine work done and it really raises the question of not "why do revolvers cost so much" but why do Glocks cost what they do?

I have a S&W SW9VE 9mm. A Glock knock off. And comparing the S&W to the Glock they are very close. The S&W cost me $325 new with a $50 rebate and two free factory mags. So about $200 or so in value. The Glocks are being sold at close to a 500% mark up. Why? Because people are willing to pay it. My BIL (newly minted cop) just bought a Gen5 model 22 Blue Box and he paid around $350 IIRC. And I promise you Glock still made money on the sale.
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Old August 17, 2019, 09:10 PM   #49
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I can only say that I like my glock because it fits well to my needs and fits my hands. It's a better fit for me than the others I looked at. Yep, it made someone a lot of money, and it cost me more than alternatives, but in the end I got what I paid for. I could have saved money but I wouldn't have had the satisfaction of a gun that really works well for me.

I wish that I could pick up a K frame for a few hundred.
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Old August 17, 2019, 09:48 PM   #50
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I can only say that I like my glock because it fits well to my needs and fits my hands. It's a better fit for me than the others I looked at. Yep, it made someone a lot of money, and it cost me more than alternatives, but in the end I got what I paid for. I could have saved money but I wouldn't have had the satisfaction of a gun that really works well for me.

I wish that I could pick up a K frame for a few hundred.
I picked up a 67-1 and 686-1 in the last few weeks for about the equivalent on a Gen5 19 for each. There are deals to be had out there for them.
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