January 10, 2011, 08:32 PM | #51 |
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I suppose you're right. They probably even have a receptionist that answers calls.
Well if you find that safe with a UL rating that's using ceramics as it's primary insulation, please let me know. I have looked myself, asked everybody I know in the business (including manufacturers), and even looked over seas at foreign manufacturers. I can't find one. I think a gun safe getting a UL fire rating would be good for business. It would be worth whatever it cost, as there is currently nothing like it on the market.
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January 10, 2011, 08:47 PM | #52 |
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I was hoping to post these photos earlier, but I had trouble tracking them down. This was just a little something, non scientific, that I did a while back.
People usually have a tough time understanding what really happens inside of a safe during a fire. What I did was place a few common items on a cookie sheet, and placed then in an oven at 350 degrees for a half hour. Here are the items before: Here are the items after: You will notice that most of the items weren't really destroyed. The CDs were warped and would no longer play. The photos had turned very dark, with the Polaroid actually being destroyed. The paper did OK, but you may notice in the after photos that it started to darken. If you compare these photos to others where "shadows" are claimed to be causing the color distortion, you can draw your own conclusions. I'm not posting these photos to say that this type of damage is bad. It should be expected, as this is what most fire rated safes are designed to do. The thought behind a fire rated safe is to keep paper documents in readable condition. Some damage is to be expected.
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January 10, 2011, 09:30 PM | #53 | ||
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It's time for me to depart this forum. Again, anyone here who has any questions about Sturdy Safes, just ask us direct. You guys are what keep us going! Last edited by Sturdy Gun Safe, Mfg; January 10, 2011 at 09:51 PM. |
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January 10, 2011, 09:40 PM | #54 |
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Ad hominem attacks does not an appealing manufacturer make.
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January 10, 2011, 10:03 PM | #55 | |
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I've never seen one, nobody I've ever talked to has seen one, and nobody can show me one. Since you and Adirondack seem to be the only two making the claims of the superiority of ceramic insulations, I would assume that you would have examples to hold out. Remember, we are looking for safes with a UL fire tag that use ceramics as their sole primary insulation. I suppose I should also add that I sell safes that use ceramics for their insulation as well. None of them are UL rated.
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January 10, 2011, 10:29 PM | #56 |
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Not sure what you meant by that KChen986 but Sturdy Gun Safe is one of the best companies I've ever dealt with both professionally and personally. And, they have every right to defend themselves; I have actually been amazed at their patience.
Thank you for providing the contact info for the expert at UL Alyssa. I guess I'm a little embarrassed because that was the kind of expert I was referring to back on post #17 but didn't take the initiative.
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January 10, 2011, 10:46 PM | #57 |
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http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost....&postcount=236
I actually contacted Frank about purchasing a safe, but he recommended I go local. He has also frequently participated in multiple gun boards, offering advice and knowledge about safes. It's funny, because I often see Sturdy only when they want to defend their reputation, or extoll how great their safes are. I'm sure Sturdy makes a great safe, and I'm sure they're a good company. But Amsec v. Sturdy and Ceramic v. Wool gets pretty old.
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January 10, 2011, 10:48 PM | #58 | |
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...probably the greatest concentration of talent and genius in the white house except for perhaps those times when Thomas Jefferson ate alone. John F. Kennedy, Describing a dinner for Nobel Prize winners, 1962 Last edited by Adirondack; January 10, 2011 at 10:58 PM. |
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January 10, 2011, 11:00 PM | #59 | |||
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I know what manufacturers use, because I can see it with my own two eyes. I may not know the exact ingredients, but I can clearly see the difference between cast and ceramic wool. I have never seen, nor have any of the other professionals that I know, a UL listed safe using ceramic wool as its primary insulation. Quote:
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January 12, 2011, 03:34 PM | #60 |
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I'm glad I invested 5 minutes in order to be educated.
I called Mr. Koepke, who was nice enough to speak with me for a few minutes. When asked if a safe existed, that had a UL fire rating, which used solely ceramic wool as its insulation, his reply was "I can not answer that question one way or another". Even when offered the opportunity to answer that question yes, or no, without mentioning any names, he repeated that they were under contractual obligation not to disclose any material used in any safe submitted to them for testing, which includes materials not used. Seems to me like they have a tight lip policy. I wonder why he blabbed to other callers, and not to myself.
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January 12, 2011, 04:00 PM | #61 | |
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