original load for .380 ACP?

HisSoldier · July 1, 2020, 05:04 PM

When I started to look this up I thought it would be easy to find, but the powder and ballistics information of the original JMB .380 are not as comon as I had assumed.
Do any of you know what they used for powder, is it available today? Were the bullets FMJ or were they cast? And I had assumed the original load produced 850 FPS but have been told it was closer to 950.

Do any of you know?

Thanks in advance,

jaguarxk120 · July 1, 2020, 05:21 PM

The 1945-1946 Gun Digest list's Winchester 380 Automatic Colt with a 95 grain bullet at
970FPS. The bullet is listed as full patch.

HisSoldier · July 1, 2020, 10:35 PM

Thanks Jaguar, and I know I sound ignorant because I am about some things, what's a "full patch" exactly?

HisSoldier · July 1, 2020, 10:38 PM

The reason I asked is I'd never heard of patching a handgun bullet, thought maybe it's a euphemism for "Jacket".

**44 AMP** · July 1, 2020, 11:31 PM

"full patch" is an old slang for FMJ

until Super Vel proved there was a market, the major ammo makers made two kinds of bullets in factory ammo. Lead bullets in revolver rounds and FMJ bullets in semi auto pistol rounds.

There were few exceptions, and handloaders could get JHP and JSP bullets long before the big makers offered them as loaded ammo.

1970 Lyman manual list .380 factory duplication load as 2.9gr Bullseye, 95gr jacketed bullet, velocity 982fps. This is also the max load listed.

The test firearm was a Husqvarna 5" barrel.

You probably won't get that much velocity from a shorter barrel gun.

HisSoldier · July 2, 2020, 12:20 AM

Thanks 44 AMP,
I spent the 30 minutes buying up old books on the subject. Every book is a separate nasty comment by my wife, "More books!", heh heh.

74A95 · July 2, 2020, 12:52 AM

The 1925 Winchester catalog lists the 380 with a 95 grain (SP or FMP) bullet at 855 fps from a 3.5" barrel.

**Unclenick** · July 2, 2020, 11:21 AM

Bullseye powder and Unique were both available from Laflin and Rand when Browning introduce the 380 in 1908. Back then, the Bullseye produced (starting in 1898) was scrap from grain screening other powders and nothing like the purpose-made version today and probably much less consistent from lot-to-lot. Unique was introduced in 1900. In your shoes, I would probably look to Bullseye as the closest thing likely to have been used then. I know it was used in the 45 Auto by the military in the 1920s from having seen ammunition boxes so labeled, so it seems the odds are good Browning used when he introduced the round in 1904, and if so, it would mean he was familiar with the powder and liked it well enough.

July 1, 2020, 05:04 PM	#1
HisSoldier Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2007 Location: Oregoncoast Posts: 1,793	original load for .380 ACP? When I started to look this up I thought it would be easy to find, but the powder and ballistics information of the original JMB .380 are not as comon as I had assumed. Do any of you know what they used for powder, is it available today? Were the bullets FMJ or were they cast? And I had assumed the original load produced 850 FPS but have been told it was closer to 950. Do any of you know? Thanks in advance, __________________ CNC produced 416 stainless triggers to replace the plastic triggers on Colt Mustangs, Mustang Plus II's, MK IV Government .380's and Sig P238's and P938's. Plus Colt Mustang hardened 416 guide rods, and Llama .32 and .380 recoil spring buttons, checkered nicely and blued.

July 1, 2020, 10:35 PM	#3
HisSoldier Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2007 Location: Oregoncoast Posts: 1,793	Thanks Jaguar, and I know I sound ignorant because I am about some things, what's a "full patch" exactly? __________________ CNC produced 416 stainless triggers to replace the plastic triggers on Colt Mustangs, Mustang Plus II's, MK IV Government .380's and Sig P238's and P938's. Plus Colt Mustang hardened 416 guide rods, and Llama .32 and .380 recoil spring buttons, checkered nicely and blued.

July 1, 2020, 10:38 PM	#4
HisSoldier Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2007 Location: Oregoncoast Posts: 1,793	The reason I asked is I'd never heard of patching a handgun bullet, thought maybe it's a euphemism for "Jacket". __________________ CNC produced 416 stainless triggers to replace the plastic triggers on Colt Mustangs, Mustang Plus II's, MK IV Government .380's and Sig P238's and P938's. Plus Colt Mustang hardened 416 guide rods, and Llama .32 and .380 recoil spring buttons, checkered nicely and blued.

July 1, 2020, 11:31 PM	#5
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 30,479	"full patch" is an old slang for FMJ until Super Vel proved there was a market, the major ammo makers made two kinds of bullets in factory ammo. Lead bullets in revolver rounds and FMJ bullets in semi auto pistol rounds. There were few exceptions, and handloaders could get JHP and JSP bullets long before the big makers offered them as loaded ammo. 1970 Lyman manual list .380 factory duplication load as 2.9gr Bullseye, 95gr jacketed bullet, velocity 982fps. This is also the max load listed. The test firearm was a Husqvarna 5" barrel. You probably won't get that much velocity from a shorter barrel gun. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

July 2, 2020, 12:20 AM	#6
HisSoldier Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2007 Location: Oregoncoast Posts: 1,793	Thanks 44 AMP, I spent the 30 minutes buying up old books on the subject. Every book is a separate nasty comment by my wife, "More books!", heh heh. __________________ CNC produced 416 stainless triggers to replace the plastic triggers on Colt Mustangs, Mustang Plus II's, MK IV Government .380's and Sig P238's and P938's. Plus Colt Mustang hardened 416 guide rods, and Llama .32 and .380 recoil spring buttons, checkered nicely and blued.

July 1, 2020, 05:21 PM	#2
jaguarxk120 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 2,626	The 1945-1946 Gun Digest list's Winchester 380 Automatic Colt with a 95 grain bullet at 970FPS. The bullet is listed as full patch.

July 2, 2020, 12:52 AM	#7
74A95 Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2016 Posts: 1,674	The 1925 Winchester catalog lists the 380 with a 95 grain (SP or FMP) bullet at 855 fps from a 3.5" barrel.

July 2, 2020, 11:21 AM	#8
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,742	Bullseye powder and Unique were both available from Laflin and Rand when Browning introduce the 380 in 1908. Back then, the Bullseye produced (starting in 1898) was scrap from grain screening other powders and nothing like the purpose-made version today and probably much less consistent from lot-to-lot. Unique was introduced in 1900. In your shoes, I would probably look to Bullseye as the closest thing likely to have been used then. I know it was used in the 45 Auto by the military in the 1920s from having seen ammunition boxes so labeled, so it seems the odds are good Browning used when he introduced the round in 1904, and if so, it would mean he was familiar with the powder and liked it well enough. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle