2 questions for short barrel 9mms

[cajun47]

its ok to shoot +p in the shield? im guessing yes but gotta ask.

what sd round do you carry for short 9mm barrels? and why? did you do research or just go with the most popular?

[carguychris]

Originally Posted by cajun47

its ok to shoot +p in the shield?

Yes, albeit with a caveat. Here's what the manual says on page 9:

Originally Posted by S&W

Use only commercially manufactured ammunition with internal ballistic pressures which are in strict accordance with the specifications of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers’ Institute (SAAMI). If you are uncertain, contact your ammunition supplier for verification.

There IS a SAAMI pressure specification for 9mm+P, so this statement implicitly endorses its use.

Please note that there IS NOT a SAAMI specification for 9mm+P+, so the endorsement does NOT extend to +P+.

From Page 11:

Originally Posted by S&W

“Plus-P” (+P) ammunition generates pressures in excess of the pressures associated with standard ammunition. Such pressures may affect the wear characteristics or exceed the margin of safety. Use of “Plus-P” ammunition may result in the need for more frequent service.

“Plus-P-Plus” (+P+) ammunition must not be used in Smith & Wesson firearms. This marking on the ammunition designates that it exceeds established industry standards, but the designation does not represent defined pressure limits and therefore such ammunition may vary significantly as to the pressures generated and could be DANGEROUS.

So there you go. +P may require more frequent service, but the manual doesn't outright say "We Won't Service It." OTOH if you use +P+, you're on your own.

[Tomac]

I carry 147gr bonded in all my 9's. Good performance regardless of bbl length and a little more push but less snap for faster followup shots.
Tomac

[Ibmikey]

I keep a couple of thousand 9mm FMJ on the shelf, my carry Sig 938 loves the stuff so for me that is what I shoot and carry. Practicing how to deliver a shot under stress is the most important issue.

[ClydeFrog]

In the S&W owner's manual I had for my full size 9x19mm M&P pistol, it stated it was safe to fire factory made +P & +P+ loads. note; just like any well made modern firearm, extended use of +P or +P+ ammunition will increase the overall wear.

As for good defense or duty rounds in 9mm, Id look at these choices;
Remington Golden Saber 124gr JHP +P(bonded), Speer Gold Dot 124gr +P JHP, Corbon DPX or PowRball, Winchester Ranger T/T series 124gr JHP +P, Ranger T 127gr +P+ JHP(a common 9mm duty round with many US law enforcement units), MagSafe SWAT, Glaser Safety Slug(silver), Hornady Critical Duty 135gr +P.

The newer Hornady Critical Duty +P round has good reviews & did very well in FBI protocol testing(a T&E of common barriers like auto glass, fabric, wood).

If you carry a factory made 9x19mm round in your Shield, Id suggest carrying a spare mag or 2 of factory made milspec 124gr FMJ(ball) ammunition.
If the +P or JHPs fail to work, you may need more penetration & you'll need rounds that can feed/cycle in the compact M&P pistol. Winchester Ranger T 9mmNATO, Hornady, Remington all sell FMJ loads.
Some 9mm owners & armed officers like the 147gr. Id rather carry a 124gr JHP & buy cheaper milspec 124gr NATO rounds to practice with.
With prices so high & logistics/supply being such a hassle, you may be limited in your selection(s).

Clyde

[southjk]

In the S&W owner's manual I had for my full size 9x19mm M&P pistol, it stated it was safe to fire factory made +P & +P+ loads.

But, he has a Shield which in the manual specifically states not to use +P+.

[MrApathy]

I havent seen a S&W manual that stated +p+ was safe to use in fact the manual states +p+ ammo is potentially dangerous. S&W sticks to saami standards.

Smith and Wesson manuals in .pdf availible for download and review
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...4_757812_image

[carguychris]

Originally Posted by MrApathy

I havent seen a S&W manual that stated +p+ was safe to use in fact the manual states +p+ ammo is potentially dangerous. S&W sticks to saami standards.

I was going to point out the same thing.

There are two M&Ps in my household- a M&P9 FS and an M&P9c. I checked both manuals, and although they're slightly different from one another in a few respects, both contain the exact same "(+P+) ammunition must not be used" warning I copied from the Shield manual in post #2.

ClydeFrog, I suggest you double-check that manual, and if it really does endorse the use of +P+, I'd like to see a copy of that. IIRC the only legit manufacturer's endorsements I've seen for using 9mm+P+ in a relatively commonplace pistol were for the Glock 17/19 and the HK USP.

Originally Posted by Ibmikey

...my carry Sig 938 loves [9mm FMJ] so for me that is what I shoot and carry.

FWIW I'm not comfortable carrying FMJ because of overpenetration concerns.

[WVsig]

In a short barrel 9mm I like 147gr Ranger Ts they make better use of the powder.

When we redesigned the Ranger T Series of ammunition we widened the velocity window under which the round would expand to allow for the slower velocities that shorter than standard barrels produce. What this means is that if you own a standard or sub compact pistol the round should have adequate expansion. In 9mm I would recommend the 147 grain bullet as it loses a lower velocity percentage than the faster lighter bullet in shorter than normal barrels. This is because the bullet has more dwell time in the bore and has a greater opportunity to burn the powder before the bullet exits the bore. Powder that is burned outside the bore does nothing for velocity. The lighter faster bullets generally have more powder to burn and since the lighter faster bullets have less time in the bore they are not efficient burners of powder in the shorter barrels.

We increased the velocity window under which the round would expand by increasing the size of the hollowpoint, tweaking the jacket thickness and the depth of the cuts on the inside of the jacket petal segments.

Sincerely,

Paul Nowak
Senior Technical Specialist
Winchester Law Enforcement Ammunition