concealed carry weapon choice evolution

[checkmyswag]

I started off with a Bodyguard 380, gun was 100% reliable which I loved, but the trigger was long and HEAVY.

Switched to LC9, trigger wasn't too heavy but was LONG.

I know each of these triggers would improve, but I am starting to think that without a reasonable trigger, aimed shots (even decently "point aimed" shots) may be extraordinarily difficult under self defense circumstances.

I could shoot both of them reasonably well at 7 yards, but this is with carefully aimed shots, with quick shots...I'd be on the paper of a man sized target, but it isn't pretty. With so much discussion of bullet placement, especially in a smaller caliber like a 380... me hitting the target in the shoulder, grazing the arm, hitting 2 in the stomach and sending two past the ears isn't "stop him in his tracks" shooting. No, I'm not a horrible shot.

Am I evolving in my CCW selection?

Really seeing the value of a DA/SA pistol or striker fired pistol with a lighter trigger. Thinking SR9c?

[WildBill45]

I could shoot both of them reasonably well at 7 yards, but this is with carefully aimed shots, with quick shots...I'd be on the paper of a man sized target, but it isn't pretty.

I don't know about that! My LC9 shoots well at 25 all day long. I bet I can shoot a standard police silhouette at 50 ... maybe 100 yards!

I may try it next weekend, and video the shoot!!!

My snubbly S&W 325 .45 revolver, and my HI-Point .45 shoot the above target at 100 quite well. Folks get a mental set that small guns can't shoot far, and such is not always the case ... Trust me!!!

[checkmyswag]

Maybe I just need to put a few hundred rounds through to break in the trigger?

[WildBill45]

The long trigger needs good trigger control to keep up with the release point, before shaking off the target!!! Practice and you will get it...

[checkmyswag]

I'm probably guilty of what a lot of casual shooters are guilty of...instead of sticking with a weapon and training with it, always looking for the perfect weapon...and along the way losing $100's of dollars in trades instead of putting $100 into ammo.

[C0untZer0]

My choices in order:

1) Rohrbaugh R9

2) Kahr PM9/CM9

3) Kahr MK9 - basically the same gun as the PM9 but heavier since it's all-steel.

[AK103K]

Pick one, stick with it, and dry fire, dry fire, dry fire. Youll soon have the muscle memory and tone, and it will come as second nature, requiring no thought. Once you get the long DA triggers down, everything else is a breeze.

[Jim243]

I don't know about that! My LC9 shoots well at 25 all day long. I bet I can shoot a standard police silhouette at 50 ... maybe 100 yards!

I was ready to pull out the BS foul flag untill I saw who the poster of that statement was. I have watched you shoot, often. Nice videos by the way, and nice shooting.

You have to remember that most of us can't shoot as often or as well as you do.


Jim

[CWKahrFan]

... probably guilty of what a lot of casual shooters are guilty of...instead of sticking with a weapon and training with it, always looking for the perfect weapon...and along the way losing $100's of dollars in trades instead of putting $100 into ammo.

I feel you hit the BULLSEYE with the above post!... Yes!

To me... (assuming one has adequate eyesight and muscle control)... accurate shooting is around 90% about concentration and breath awareness... Kinda like a Zen thing... Getting in the "zone"...

That said... If you can rent or borrow a Browning HiPower or a Walther PPQ, you'll get some better insight about how much of it is "gun" and how much is "you"...

... my .02 cents...

[checkmyswag]

To me... (assuming one has adequate eyesight and muscle control)... accurate shooting is around 90% about concentration and breath awareness... Kinda like a Zen thing... Getting in the "zone"...

Feel like I have this but under controlled, slow, well aimed fire.

Just point firing a full size gun with a decent trigger, I am way more accurate than with a pocket pistol with a heavy and/or long trigger.

[btmj]

Yes, I agree with practicing dry firing. My wifes first gun that was truly her own gun was (is) a GP-100 357 magnum. At first her DA trigger control was poor, but after a month of daily dry fire practice, she had improved way beyond what I thought would be possible in so short of a time. It was only 3 to 5 minutes a day, but after a month, she was shooting literally like a champ.

[OlympicFox]

I've got 3 Kahr's for carry: CM9, K9 and PM40. All of them have silky smooth, but long trigger pulls. Excellent for concealed carry.

I also have two SA guns for concealed carry: Sig P238 (short but heavy pull) and a Dan Wesson CCO (very short and very light @ 3.7#).

The Sig P238 is for when circumstances make it difficult, impractical or impossible to carry a larger gun. Not an ideal situation, but one of the best 380s.

The Dan Wesson is for when I circumstances suggest a 45 might be a good idea, or when we're on long road trips and I need the 4.3" barrel to get in and out of Canada. But, even after shooting 1911's since the mid-60's that uber trigger makes me nervous. If you think you're so good that you won't make a mistake with a light & fast trigger, then you're due for a reality check.

We also own 4 other Sigs with DA/SA triggers. IMHO, they make fabulous defensive guns and the DA/SA trigger is the best possible trigger for a defensive pistol. But, they are bigger, thicker and heavier than I like to carry. None the less, I do have both pancake and IWB holsters for three of them. An alloy-framed P229 and P239 are excellent carry guns. The 10#/4# DA/SA trigger turns into a 7-8#/sub-4# trigger after an Action Enhancement by Sig. A short reset SA trigger makes for very fast follow-up shots. I'm an old guy and my splits are usually under 0.20 seconds with my P226.

Every once in a while I use my Kahr K9 in IDPA competition. That's the all stainless model with a 3.5" barrel and the "NYPD" trigger - very long, but very smooth. Interestingly, I'm only slightly slower with that Kahr than I am with my M&P 40L complete with its 2.7# Apex Comp-AEK trigger.

Like several of the others, I suggest lots of practice as well as participating in IDPA with your carry pistol. And as for hitting targets at 25 yards . . . if the bad guy is 25 yards away I probably shouldn't be shooting at him. Yes, it does happen that a citizen could be in a long range shoot out, but the odds are oh-so small. If that does concern you, then carry a full-size service pistol. My primary CCW is a Kahr PM40. I'm not much at any distance with it, but I can get off 2 rounds into a 10 yard target from an IWB holster under cover in less than 2 seconds because I do practice with it.

[Mosin44az]

Kahrs have nicer triggers than the BG 380 I used to have. Given you have an LC9 and are thinking SR9, take a look at the Kahr CM9 or CW9. Similar or slightly smaller size range, moderate price.

My CM9 has been pretty good so far, only 3 malfs in nearly 600 rounds, and all were lefthanded limpwrists. Those tiny powerful guns have to be held tight.

The SR9 trigger might be OK from what I can tell. Somewhat bigger and heavier gun than the Kahrs I mention.

Incidentally my BG 380 had a number of issues and I sent it back to Smith. Amazing service, they send Fed Ex to your door and it's back in a week. Their charge. A policy that would bankrupt Taurus pretty quickly.

Anyway, I complained about the BG trigger and when it came back the trigger was much lighter. OTOH, I discovered the BG wouldn't fire my regular practice ammo consistently! I think they put in a lighter striker spring. It would still fire with quality US defense loads though.

[jimbob86]

You can either practice with those long and heavy triggers until you "master" them .....

....or you can get a gun with a decent SA trigger....... this does require you to carry C&L, but TANSTAAFL ........

The 1911, Browning Hi-Power, and CZ75B can all be carried conditon 1, IIRC.

[*NOVA*]

BodyGuard is a great little gun for pocket carry - I agree with others - gotta practice with it! I was like you and hated it at first. But you've got that neat little built in laser, so use it for instant feedback on your dry fire practice.

For cold weather months I prefer not to use a pocket gun - the additional clothing, like an extra shirt with shirt tail out, a jacket or coat allows conceal carry using a shoulder or belt holster. The CZ75 in an OWB holster works fine for me as a conceal carry weapon of choice.

[checkmyswag]

Kind of frustrated with myself on that one. Really liked the BG 380 but thought I could find a better trigger. So I gave up my 100% reliable SW and now have issues w my Ruger.

[ScotchMan]

Well, you've got three threads going about the same thing here. My advice remains the same, I haven't seen a compelling reason why you need a tiny microgun, check out a SR9c (or Glock 26, or XDm 3.8, etc, I am not being a Ruger fanboy, just the gun you have mentioned a few times now). These guns are small and thin enough to be super concealable while offering you decent triggers, capacity, and shootability.

I don't know for sure, but I get the impression you are trending towards pocket guns just because you think they are all that is concealable. Are you carrying in your pocket? If you carry IWB you can carry just about anything, you will find better triggers and range experiences on larger guns. Keep in mind these are already very miniaturized versions of bigger guns.

[checkmyswag]

Might just quit buying CC guns and take up boxing.

[loose_holster_dan]

no, you're right. the triggers on those two are terrible. i like sa/da, striker, or best yet the p7 squeeze cocking action.

you seem to like the little ones, so try the hk p7, walther pps, or colt officer frame. the walther is the smallest, lightest, and cheapest. it is my usual carry. they are going pretty cheap now too. put any of them in a kydex holster from fist, and you won't have any trouble concealing them.

[Walklightly]

I don't know about that! My LC9 shoots well at 25 all day long. I bet I can shoot a standard police silhouette at 50 ... maybe 100 yards!

I may try it next weekend, and video the shoot!!!

"Anybody"!!!! can make a photo (2feet-200yards) of a target shots and make claims, but to back it on video is the real deal.

[Mrgunsngear]

I shoot my LCP like you shoot your BG380, therefore it rarely comes with me. I have a CM9 that is so much easier to fire accurately under simulated stress. I agree with the earlier posts that practice will help more than anything but a gun with good ergos helps a lot too.

[excelerater]

for CCW gun I want a long trigger and heavy too
I think many folks dont shoot enough...try 500 rounds a month for a few months and then youll rethink your choices

[AZAK]

Am I evolving in my CCW selection?

Really seeing the value of a DA/SA pistol or striker fired pistol with a lighter trigger. Thinking SR9c?

Totally depends on what you are really looking for.

I have a LCP for pocket carry. One can improve with the trigger, given practice; then again this is a pocket pistol and short sight radius with almost non-existent sights and a long heavy trigger pull.

I also have a SR9c. Great trigger, light (relatively) poly pistol with options for mag capacity from the factory, decent sight radius and sights. Totally different animal. Doesn't fit so well in the pocket though. OWB carry works very nicely.

I also have a number of different pistols with varying specs, including some nicely smithed/ semi custom built 1911s. Now we are talking truly great triggers and accuracy potential.

Care to guess which I carry the most?
SR9c these days. Light, easy to carry, accurate with a pretty darn nice factory trigger and choice of 10 or 17 round mags.

Sure it is possible to improve the accuracy when shooting the LCP, but not likely as easily or as accurately as a Wilson Combat 1911.

Government 1911, no matter how nicely put together it is, still is big and heavy; when compared to a LCP or SR9c.

I am happy with the compromise of the SR9c; however, I still do carry the LCP and 1911s on a fairly regular basis, just the SR9c most often these days.

YMMV