8x57 Mauser anyone?

stump shooter · October 27, 2009, 03:27 PM

I have done some searches and this one has me a bit confused.
I am looking to load for my Yugo M48 and I already understand to use the .323" bullets but I am curious about the 30.06 forming versus just buying the bags of new 8mm cases.

What dies and steps are involved to reform the .06 cases?
For consecutive 8mm reloads, go F/L or is Neck sizing and shoulder bumping prefered?

Thank you

bipe215 · October 27, 2009, 06:27 PM

Here you go:

http://www.youtube.com/user/Iraqvete...97/DqBLPGbmXS4

ligonierbill · October 27, 2009, 08:51 PM

Well, bipe215 has you covered on case forming, but it's a lot easier to buy the brass. It's readily available. Regarding full length resizing vs. neck sizing, it's really what works best for your rifle. The 8x57 I have loaded, I did full length (98 Mauser). Opinions vary. For some other calibers (7 mm Mag, 6.5x55) I have been neck sizing only, but truth be known, I'm not sure it makes much difference.

stump shooter · October 27, 2009, 09:41 PM

Wow, that qualifies as a winter project

Thanks bipe215.

FrankenMauser · October 28, 2009, 12:24 AM

Quote:

What dies and steps are involved to reform the .06 cases?

If you buy a sizing die with a tapered expander, there are two steps for the lazy: (3 for those that care more)

(0.) Trim
1. Size
2. Trim

I used an RCBS 3-die set, that included the tapered expander.

If you look around, you'll probably find 8x57 brass to be about the same price as '06. I loaded a few hundred rounds a couple years ago. The brass I found (remington bulk, on midwayusa) was actually $4 cheaper per 100 than '06. (And it wasn't even on sale.) I checked the pricing a few months ago, and the 8x57 was more than '06, but only a few bucks.

F. Guffey · October 28, 2009, 10:11 AM

I use a case/forming die from RCBS. I form the case first, trim .254 from the top of the forming die with a hack saw, finish with a file then lower the ram, then I full length size the case to 8mm57, again I do not pass up the opportunity to adjust the case to the chamber, when using 30/06 cases to form 8mm57 the reloader can not miss, the shoulder on the 30/06 is ahead of the shoulder on the 8mm57 .121 thousands. Before forming dies and before Berdan primed cases were available, the 8mm57 die was used, shoulders developed dents, folds and wrinkles, the dents popp out when fired, the folds became creases and stayed that way. The trim/form die increases the success over the 8mm sizer die.

Bumping sounds like an accident, when adjusting the (A) die to size I control the gap between the die and shell holder with a feeler gage, rather than 'bump' the shoulder back I adjust the gap to avoid moving the shoulder further back than necessary.

On my press(es) and dies full length sizing is full length sizing, the die is adjusted down to the shell holder with an addition guesstimate of a turn 1/8 to 1/4, that is an additional .0085 to .017 thousands, cases sized in this manner are sized to .000 or .005 shorter than a go-gage length chamber from the head of the case to it's shoulder, if my shell holder does not have a deck height of .125 and the die does not size to minimum length I can send them back and have it replaced with a die that is as advertised, the dies are labeled Precision, Competition, bench rest, New Dimension, sizing is not an accident, I expect predictable results, and I do not have to purchase a tool box of tools to verify the results.

So rather than size cases mindlessly by screwing the die down to crush settings, I control the crush or shoulder set back which is anything but 'bump' I would call it 'wreck' as in change, establishing the shoulder .121 further back than the shoulder of the parent case allows the relaoder to establish case length from the case head to the shoulder to effect head space, for the most part I have form/trim dies from 243 to 300 Win Mag.

Success rate, new unfired cases, perfect. Once fired, 2ND best. When necking up as in 30/06 to 3387 or 35 Wileen do not use nickel cases, 30% of the necks could split on once fired cases. When annealing, anneal the case down to the point the new shoulder will be established.

When necking up 30/06 to 35 Whelen I have split 5 out of 100 cases, when using 280 Remington new cases the results is about the same, again the difficult part is trying to find cases with the case length from the head of the case to the shoulder longer than necessary and finding cases that do not shorten when necked up, 30/06 cases can be customed fit to the chamber of the 8mm57, 7.7 Japanease, 308 Winchester etc..

I use a RCBS forming/trim die, cases must be full length sized after forming, I have neck sizer dies and samll base dies, I choose not to use them, I use the full length sizer to neck size, partial neck size, neck size with partial body sizing and full length sizing but I know the size of the case I want.

F. Guffey

Scorch · October 28, 2009, 03:10 PM

You can buy a forming die and form/trim/resize, remembering to check neck ID and OD to make sure they are consistent, or just trim 30-06 to 8X57 length then the run brass into a resizing die, or just save all that time and headaches and buy the 8X57 brass to begin with for about the same price and save yourself a lot of time and effort. I recommend the latter, since I did the other ones for a long time.

F. Guffey · October 28, 2009, 04:05 PM

Scorch, my answer is never 'too much trouble' again, for most moving a shoulder forward is firing the case in a chamber, and they call that fire forming, I do not have an answer for that, I determine head space first then look for a case that has case length that is longer from the head of the case to the shoulder than the chamber length from the bolt face to the shoulder, for me firing is not an option, case forming is, I have to start with a case that is too long from the head of he case to the shoulder, the 30/06 case does that for the 7.7 and 8mm57 by .151 thousands on the Mauser, and again I have an Eddystone that has .016 head space, that one works also, I do not form case because I can, I form cases to the chamber because I understand why, some do not do not form cases first because it is too much trouble, knowing I will need cases necked up to 35 Whelen sooner or later I neck up 400 30/06 cases just to stay ahead, I prefer new unfired military cases that do not have caliber designations.

F. Guffey

F. Guffey · October 29, 2009, 07:58 AM

delete one 'do not'

sorry about that,

F. Guffey

October 27, 2009, 03:27 PM	#1
stump shooter Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Posts: 61	8x57 Mauser anyone? I have done some searches and this one has me a bit confused. I am looking to load for my Yugo M48 and I already understand to use the .323" bullets but I am curious about the 30.06 forming versus just buying the bags of new 8mm cases. What dies and steps are involved to reform the .06 cases? For consecutive 8mm reloads, go F/L or is Neck sizing and shoulder bumping prefered? Thank you

October 28, 2009, 03:10 PM	#7
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,249	You can buy a forming die and form/trim/resize, remembering to check neck ID and OD to make sure they are consistent, or just trim 30-06 to 8X57 length then the run brass into a resizing die, or just save all that time and headaches and buy the 8X57 brass to begin with for about the same price and save yourself a lot of time and effort. I recommend the latter, since I did the other ones for a long time. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

October 27, 2009, 06:27 PM	#2
bipe215 Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2008 Posts: 122	Here you go: http://www.youtube.com/user/Iraqvete...97/DqBLPGbmXS4

October 27, 2009, 08:51 PM	#3
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,646	Well, bipe215 has you covered on case forming, but it's a lot easier to buy the brass. It's readily available. Regarding full length resizing vs. neck sizing, it's really what works best for your rifle. The 8x57 I have loaded, I did full length (98 Mauser). Opinions vary. For some other calibers (7 mm Mag, 6.5x55) I have been neck sizing only, but truth be known, I'm not sure it makes much difference.

October 27, 2009, 09:41 PM	#4
stump shooter Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Posts: 61	Wow, that qualifies as a winter project Thanks bipe215.

October 28, 2009, 10:11 AM	#6
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	I use a case/forming die from RCBS. I form the case first, trim .254 from the top of the forming die with a hack saw, finish with a file then lower the ram, then I full length size the case to 8mm57, again I do not pass up the opportunity to adjust the case to the chamber, when using 30/06 cases to form 8mm57 the reloader can not miss, the shoulder on the 30/06 is ahead of the shoulder on the 8mm57 .121 thousands. Before forming dies and before Berdan primed cases were available, the 8mm57 die was used, shoulders developed dents, folds and wrinkles, the dents popp out when fired, the folds became creases and stayed that way. The trim/form die increases the success over the 8mm sizer die. Bumping sounds like an accident, when adjusting the (A) die to size I control the gap between the die and shell holder with a feeler gage, rather than 'bump' the shoulder back I adjust the gap to avoid moving the shoulder further back than necessary. On my press(es) and dies full length sizing is full length sizing, the die is adjusted down to the shell holder with an addition guesstimate of a turn 1/8 to 1/4, that is an additional .0085 to .017 thousands, cases sized in this manner are sized to .000 or .005 shorter than a go-gage length chamber from the head of the case to it's shoulder, if my shell holder does not have a deck height of .125 and the die does not size to minimum length I can send them back and have it replaced with a die that is as advertised, the dies are labeled Precision, Competition, bench rest, New Dimension, sizing is not an accident, I expect predictable results, and I do not have to purchase a tool box of tools to verify the results. So rather than size cases mindlessly by screwing the die down to crush settings, I control the crush or shoulder set back which is anything but 'bump' I would call it 'wreck' as in change, establishing the shoulder .121 further back than the shoulder of the parent case allows the relaoder to establish case length from the case head to the shoulder to effect head space, for the most part I have form/trim dies from 243 to 300 Win Mag. Success rate, new unfired cases, perfect. Once fired, 2ND best. When necking up as in 30/06 to 3387 or 35 Wileen do not use nickel cases, 30% of the necks could split on once fired cases. When annealing, anneal the case down to the point the new shoulder will be established. When necking up 30/06 to 35 Whelen I have split 5 out of 100 cases, when using 280 Remington new cases the results is about the same, again the difficult part is trying to find cases with the case length from the head of the case to the shoulder longer than necessary and finding cases that do not shorten when necked up, 30/06 cases can be customed fit to the chamber of the 8mm57, 7.7 Japanease, 308 Winchester etc.. I use a RCBS forming/trim die, cases must be full length sized after forming, I have neck sizer dies and samll base dies, I choose not to use them, I use the full length sizer to neck size, partial neck size, neck size with partial body sizing and full length sizing but I know the size of the case I want. F. Guffey

October 28, 2009, 04:05 PM	#8
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	Scorch, my answer is never 'too much trouble' again, for most moving a shoulder forward is firing the case in a chamber, and they call that fire forming, I do not have an answer for that, I determine head space first then look for a case that has case length that is longer from the head of the case to the shoulder than the chamber length from the bolt face to the shoulder, for me firing is not an option, case forming is, I have to start with a case that is too long from the head of he case to the shoulder, the 30/06 case does that for the 7.7 and 8mm57 by .151 thousands on the Mauser, and again I have an Eddystone that has .016 head space, that one works also, I do not form case because I can, I form cases to the chamber because I understand why, some do not do not form cases first because it is too much trouble, knowing I will need cases necked up to 35 Whelen sooner or later I neck up 400 30/06 cases just to stay ahead, I prefer new unfired military cases that do not have caliber designations. F. Guffey

October 29, 2009, 07:58 AM	#9
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	delete one 'do not' sorry about that, F. Guffey