Rifle for Tender Shoulder

JSMidd · June 24, 2014, 07:07 PM

For those that want to skip the story, my question is in red below.

So, I'm wanting to hunt this year. My region of Washington is full of deer and elk, and my wife wants me to fill up the freezer (yep, I picked a good one).

I haven't hunted since high school, when I hunted often with my dad. I know I want a 30-06, but here's my situation...

I've had four surgeries on my shooting shoulder. All of them to repair nerve damage. I have since shot several rifles, but everything beyond a .22 hurts badly, and some of the bigger rifles make it so that I can't rotate my shoulder for up to 45 minutes afterwards.

So, I know that there are pads and such that can be used, and I'm not above using them.

But here's my question...

Would an auto-loading rifle (such as the Browning BAR Safari or the Remington Woodsman) reduce the kickback of 30-06 just a little, or is it a dramatic reduction?

I am able to shoot my Browning Maxus 12-gauge about 15 times before I start to hurt, if that helps at all.
Thanks in advance to any answers offered. I do appreciate your time and help.

zoomie · June 24, 2014, 07:17 PM

The auto will help. How much is subjective. It's a more complex recoil pulse because of the action, which you might perceive differently than others.

Why a 30-06? A 308, 270, or 260 (among others) will recoil less and still get the job done.

Also consider hunting with a suppressor. Less noise and less recoil. Might be too late for this season, but it'll help next year.

You also might learn to shoot with your other hand.

g.willikers · June 24, 2014, 07:33 PM

I feel your pain.
One of my aging shoulders can get aggravated with a .22, if I shoot it long enough.
There's plenty of hunting rifles in calibers suitable for the game you mentioned, that are much easier on the shooter than a 30-06.
The Remington auto loader in 30-06 I once had, kicked almost the same as a bolt action.
Hunting rifles, that are designed to be carried all day, are just too light to avoid it.
With all the modern ammo and selection of bullet weights, even a .243 would probably do an admirable job.
To help with reducing recoil, for what ever rifle and caliber you choose, a thick cushy recoil pad is really helpful.
If you're a wimp, like me, a thick gel pack shoulder pad can add even more protection.
If the rifle comes with a hollow synthetic stock, that can be filled with lead for even more recoil reduction, but at the cost of a heavier gun to tote all day, though.
Hope some of this helps.
Pain is no fun.

std7mag · June 24, 2014, 07:34 PM

Instead of being stuck on the 30-06, you might want to think of the 7mm-08, or one of the fine 6.5 mm out there.

All kick less that an 06.
Can load 7mm from 100 gr hollowpoints for varmints, to 175 gr. for moose/elk.

JSMidd · June 24, 2014, 07:49 PM

So, it looks like thus far, I need to not be married to the 06. My only reasoning behind that is it is what I grew up with, and what I know.

So... that opens up the discussion quite a bit.

jmr40 · June 24, 2014, 07:50 PM

Gas operated semi's reduce "felt" recoil.
Heavier guns reduce actual recoil.

Most semi's are a lot heavier than bolt rifles, so yes the difference will be noticeable, but you'll have to lug around a much heavier gun which is also hard on joints.

Different calibers reduce actual recoil too, and many modern bullets make the need for more powerful loadings un necessary.

Some things to consider. A 308 shoots the same bullet weights as a 30-06 about 3-4% slower, but with 25% less recoil in rifles of the same weight. A 7-08 would probably be every bit as effective on the game you are hunting with even less recoil.

603Country · June 24, 2014, 08:28 PM

Heavy rifle in 243 or 250 Savage. Get a top of the line recoil pad. That won't kick much at all. Heck, you could add a muzzle brake too.

Lakota · June 24, 2014, 08:34 PM

Limb saver helps plus if you are hunting and not shooting 20 or 40 rounds at paper from a bench rest. I know I have two bad shoulders and bench rest shooting with big recoil rifles sucks. But I figure once I have it dialed in I figure I won't be shooting that much when and maybe not at all. But the limb save slip on pad works wonders. Just my 2c

Colt46 · June 24, 2014, 08:43 PM

Accurate, deadly, and mild recoiling seems to be tailor made for those with recoil issues.

There is also a comapny called E. A. Brown that makes a single shot rifle using a 6.5 MM Benchrest cartridge that is mild recoiling, accurate and not too expensive. I think they retail for about $1,000
Seems quite promising. Check them out.

olddav · June 24, 2014, 08:51 PM

If you must get a 30-06 install a muzzle break and at least 1" recoil pad. My suggestion may a bit of over kill but shooting is support to be fun. You may also want to think about a 243 but I still would add both the muzzle break and pad.
Let the game feel all the pain!

Ruger480 · June 24, 2014, 09:17 PM

If your just looking to fill the freezer and and simply can't do it with a rifle, look at getting it done with a crossbow.

Blindstitch · June 24, 2014, 10:06 PM

Crossbow is an option but in many cases I see them for well over the price of a good rifle. But still an option. I would think a 243 should be a great option and I believe it's the same parent case as 30-06.

But like others are saying as long as a rifle is zeroed correctly and you only have to shoot it a few times during deer season recoil shouldn't matter.

But if you're out and have to buy a rifle there are many options.

zoomie · June 24, 2014, 10:14 PM

Quote:

I would think a 243 should be a great option and I believe it's the same parent case as 30-06.

308 parent case.

olddav · June 24, 2014, 10:23 PM

25-06 may be another good option. It shoots a little faster and can be loaded with bullets around 120 grain and as you may have guessed it's based on the 30-06 case.

Art Eatman · June 24, 2014, 10:25 PM

A .243 will darn sure ruin Bambi's day. In my ignorance about elk, I'd likely want to take a neck shot at relatively close range, though. Probably inside of maybe 150 yards.

An eight-pound .243 with a modern recoil pad has little felt recoil.

big al hunter · June 24, 2014, 10:27 PM

Get a muzzle brake put on the 30/06 of your choice. There will be almost no recoil. I had a brake put on my '06 so my wife could use it (she never shot it) but it ended up becoming my favorite close quarters bear hunting gun. I don't feel any recoil and still have full 30/06 power. On the bench it pushes just enough to feel it move.

**44 AMP** · June 24, 2014, 10:58 PM

Quote:

In my ignorance about elk, I'd likely want to take a neck shot at relatively close range, though. Probably inside of maybe 150 yards.

About 30 some odd years ago, I met an old boy, easily in his 70s, if not 80s, who did exactly that. Met him in a diner just off the mountains. He was VERY pleased with his .243 Winchester, as he had just take his 6th elk with that gun.

Only took neck shots, and only when he was certain of a good shot. A .243 will work, if you are sportsman enough to only take shot within its proven ability. An 06 is a proven performer with nearly any decent shot.

A muzzle brake is a good thing for reducing the recoil, but it makes the BLAST a lot worse. (sorry, no free lunch)

Savage99 · June 24, 2014, 11:16 PM

What with nerve damage to your shoulder and the surgeries I would not shoot a 30-06 even from an auto loader and with a very soft recoil pad.

Quite a bit of hunting can be done with a 243 and the best bullets. While I am not sure about elk the 243 will take deer.

Yes an autoloader will help some and so will a soft Decelerator recoil pad and and heavier rifle. I would not put on a muzzle brake and risk ear damage.

big al hunter · June 24, 2014, 11:33 PM

OP is in central Washington, that means east of the cascade mountains. Open fields or sparse trees, with shots ranging from up close to 300+ yards. I'm not saying it is impossible to get close, but sometimes it is not going to be easy. I would not hunt elk on the east side with less than a 270 win. Simply for the range and penetration that is needed. On the west side of Washington it is more likely to be close and a 243 would be adequate but far from ideal. IMO the 30/06 is directly between barely enough and way more than necessary. That is part of why it has been so popular for over a hundred years. If that is what the OP is used to and confident with, it should be what he uses. But that is just my opinion and he will have to decide for himself, what will be best for him.

big al hunter · June 24, 2014, 11:43 PM

Quote:

I would not put on a muzzle brake and risk ear damage.

All firearms produce sounds over the threshold of damaging hearing. Muzzle break or not we should all be wearing hearing protection. Many models of ear protection are available that allow you to hear and even amplify normal low volume sounds while dampening gun shots.

tdoyka · June 25, 2014, 02:07 AM

get an tc encore (preferably a 6.5 creedmoor

) a 243 up to a 308, a high plains gun stock with a limbsaver, and a past recoil pad. i am getting one to help the 444 marlin, and bellm's muzzle brake. i shoot one handed because of a stroke and the right arm/leg don't work

http://matchgrademachine.com/

http://www.highplainsgunstocks.com/w...ion%20page.htm

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...ields_And_Pads

http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=151

this is my 20 vartarg, it also has a 6.5 creedmoor with a 16 1/4" mgm barrel

Geezerbiker · June 25, 2014, 03:24 AM

Plus one to a good muzzle brake. A friend of mine has a .338 Win mag with a brake on it and it kicks less than my .308 Win. If you Put a brake on a .25-06 or a .243 Win along with a good recoil pad, it could very well be tolerable for you...

If that fails a hunting buddy that can shoot for you is the best I can think of.

Tony

JD0x0 · June 25, 2014, 03:37 AM

A .270 Winchester in a mid weight rifle with a brake and a pad, should recoil like a pussycat and have more than enough power to take down anything in the continental US.
.270 win has all the power of a .30-06 with a tad less recoil. An auto loader like a BAR should bring down the shock even further.

green_MTman · June 25, 2014, 07:49 AM

.243 or .257 roberts or .250 savage

Picher · June 25, 2014, 08:28 AM

If you don't want to get a new rifle, consider using 30-06 "Reduced Recoil" factory ammo. They use 125 grain larger game bullets, but at reduced pressures to achieve adequate killing force out to 200 yards. Recoil is much like a .243 Win, but it makes a bigger hole in game.

I have Remington Reduced Recoil ammo for my .270 Win because my grandkids wanted to hunt and I didn't have a .243 Win for them. Other makers are also offering reduced recoil ammo. One caution: Dispite claims, they may shoot a bit off the zero used for full-power rounds, so be sure to sight-in with the ammo you're going to use.

June 24, 2014, 07:07 PM	#1
JSMidd Member Join Date: February 4, 2014 Location: Central Washington State Posts: 55	Rifle for Tender Shoulder For those that want to skip the story, my question is in red below. So, I'm wanting to hunt this year. My region of Washington is full of deer and elk, and my wife wants me to fill up the freezer (yep, I picked a good one). I haven't hunted since high school, when I hunted often with my dad. I know I want a 30-06, but here's my situation... I've had four surgeries on my shooting shoulder. All of them to repair nerve damage. I have since shot several rifles, but everything beyond a .22 hurts badly, and some of the bigger rifles make it so that I can't rotate my shoulder for up to 45 minutes afterwards. So, I know that there are pads and such that can be used, and I'm not above using them. But here's my question... Would an auto-loading rifle (such as the Browning BAR Safari or the Remington Woodsman) reduce the kickback of 30-06 just a little, or is it a dramatic reduction? I am able to shoot my Browning Maxus 12-gauge about 15 times before I start to hurt, if that helps at all. Thanks in advance to any answers offered. I do appreciate your time and help. __________________ "Those who were rebuilding the wall and those who carried burdens took their load with one hand doing the work and the other holding a weapon...neither I, my brothers, my servants, nor the men of the guard who followed me, none of us removed our clothes, each took his weapon even to the water." Nehemiah 4

June 24, 2014, 07:49 PM	#5
JSMidd Member Join Date: February 4, 2014 Location: Central Washington State Posts: 55	So, it looks like thus far, I need to not be married to the 06. My only reasoning behind that is it is what I grew up with, and what I know. So... that opens up the discussion quite a bit. __________________ "Those who were rebuilding the wall and those who carried burdens took their load with one hand doing the work and the other holding a weapon...neither I, my brothers, my servants, nor the men of the guard who followed me, none of us removed our clothes, each took his weapon even to the water." Nehemiah 4

June 24, 2014, 08:43 PM	#9
Colt46 Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: Campbell Ca Posts: 1,090	Swedish Mauser might be just the ticket Accurate, deadly, and mild recoiling seems to be tailor made for those with recoil issues. There is also a comapny called E. A. Brown that makes a single shot rifle using a 6.5 MM Benchrest cartridge that is mild recoiling, accurate and not too expensive. I think they retail for about $1,000 Seems quite promising. Check them out.

June 24, 2014, 10:27 PM	#16
big al hunter Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2011 Location: Washington state Posts: 1,558	Get a muzzle brake put on the 30/06 of your choice. There will be almost no recoil. I had a brake put on my '06 so my wife could use it (she never shot it) but it ended up becoming my favorite close quarters bear hunting gun. I don't feel any recoil and still have full 30/06 power. On the bench it pushes just enough to feel it move. __________________ You can't fix stupid....however ignorance can be cured through education!

June 24, 2014, 11:33 PM	#19
big al hunter Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2011 Location: Washington state Posts: 1,558	OP is in central Washington, that means east of the cascade mountains. Open fields or sparse trees, with shots ranging from up close to 300+ yards. I'm not saying it is impossible to get close, but sometimes it is not going to be easy. I would not hunt elk on the east side with less than a 270 win. Simply for the range and penetration that is needed. On the west side of Washington it is more likely to be close and a 243 would be adequate but far from ideal. IMO the 30/06 is directly between barely enough and way more than necessary. That is part of why it has been so popular for over a hundred years. If that is what the OP is used to and confident with, it should be what he uses. But that is just my opinion and he will have to decide for himself, what will be best for him. __________________ You can't fix stupid....however ignorance can be cured through education!

June 24, 2014, 07:17 PM	#2
zoomie Senior Member Join Date: January 23, 2006 Location: GA Posts: 1,870	The auto will help. How much is subjective. It's a more complex recoil pulse because of the action, which you might perceive differently than others. Why a 30-06? A 308, 270, or 260 (among others) will recoil less and still get the job done. Also consider hunting with a suppressor. Less noise and less recoil. Might be too late for this season, but it'll help next year. You also might learn to shoot with your other hand.

June 24, 2014, 07:33 PM	#3
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	I feel your pain. One of my aging shoulders can get aggravated with a .22, if I shoot it long enough. There's plenty of hunting rifles in calibers suitable for the game you mentioned, that are much easier on the shooter than a 30-06. The Remington auto loader in 30-06 I once had, kicked almost the same as a bolt action. Hunting rifles, that are designed to be carried all day, are just too light to avoid it. With all the modern ammo and selection of bullet weights, even a .243 would probably do an admirable job. To help with reducing recoil, for what ever rifle and caliber you choose, a thick cushy recoil pad is really helpful. If you're a wimp, like me, a thick gel pack shoulder pad can add even more protection. If the rifle comes with a hollow synthetic stock, that can be filled with lead for even more recoil reduction, but at the cost of a heavier gun to tote all day, though. Hope some of this helps. Pain is no fun.

June 24, 2014, 07:34 PM	#4
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,611	Instead of being stuck on the 30-06, you might want to think of the 7mm-08, or one of the fine 6.5 mm out there. All kick less that an 06. Can load 7mm from 100 gr hollowpoints for varmints, to 175 gr. for moose/elk.

June 24, 2014, 07:50 PM	#6
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,976	Gas operated semi's reduce "felt" recoil. Heavier guns reduce actual recoil. Most semi's are a lot heavier than bolt rifles, so yes the difference will be noticeable, but you'll have to lug around a much heavier gun which is also hard on joints. Different calibers reduce actual recoil too, and many modern bullets make the need for more powerful loadings un necessary. Some things to consider. A 308 shoots the same bullet weights as a 30-06 about 3-4% slower, but with 25% less recoil in rifles of the same weight. A 7-08 would probably be every bit as effective on the game you are hunting with even less recoil.

June 24, 2014, 08:28 PM	#7
603Country Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2011 Location: Thornton, Texas Posts: 4,039	Heavy rifle in 243 or 250 Savage. Get a top of the line recoil pad. That won't kick much at all. Heck, you could add a muzzle brake too.

June 24, 2014, 08:34 PM	#8
Lakota Member Join Date: March 14, 2012 Location: South Florida Posts: 58	Limb saver helps plus if you are hunting and not shooting 20 or 40 rounds at paper from a bench rest. I know I have two bad shoulders and bench rest shooting with big recoil rifles sucks. But I figure once I have it dialed in I figure I won't be shooting that much when and maybe not at all. But the limb save slip on pad works wonders. Just my 2c

June 24, 2014, 08:51 PM	#10
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	If you must get a 30-06 install a muzzle break and at least 1" recoil pad. My suggestion may a bit of over kill but shooting is support to be fun. You may also want to think about a 243 but I still would add both the muzzle break and pad. Let the game feel all the pain!

June 24, 2014, 09:17 PM	#11
Ruger480 Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2013 Location: Central Iowa Posts: 720	If your just looking to fill the freezer and and simply can't do it with a rifle, look at getting it done with a crossbow.

June 24, 2014, 10:06 PM	#12
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,696	Crossbow is an option but in many cases I see them for well over the price of a good rifle. But still an option. I would think a 243 should be a great option and I believe it's the same parent case as 30-06. But like others are saying as long as a rifle is zeroed correctly and you only have to shoot it a few times during deer season recoil shouldn't matter. But if you're out and have to buy a rifle there are many options.

June 24, 2014, 10:23 PM	#14
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	25-06 may be another good option. It shoots a little faster and can be loaded with bullets around 120 grain and as you may have guessed it's based on the 30-06 case.

June 24, 2014, 10:25 PM	#15
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	A .243 will darn sure ruin Bambi's day. In my ignorance about elk, I'd likely want to take a neck shot at relatively close range, though. Probably inside of maybe 150 yards. An eight-pound .243 with a modern recoil pad has little felt recoil.

June 24, 2014, 11:16 PM	#18
Savage99 Senior Member Join Date: May 17, 2004 Posts: 567	What with nerve damage to your shoulder and the surgeries I would not shoot a 30-06 even from an auto loader and with a very soft recoil pad. Quite a bit of hunting can be done with a 243 and the best bullets. While I am not sure about elk the 243 will take deer. Yes an autoloader will help some and so will a soft Decelerator recoil pad and and heavier rifle. I would not put on a muzzle brake and risk ear damage.

June 25, 2014, 02:07 AM	#21
tdoyka Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2013 Location: windber, pa Posts: 300	get an tc encore (preferably a 6.5 creedmoor) a 243 up to a 308, a high plains gun stock with a limbsaver, and a past recoil pad. i am getting one to help the 444 marlin, and bellm's muzzle brake. i shoot one handed because of a stroke and the right arm/leg don't work http://matchgrademachine.com/ http://www.highplainsgunstocks.com/w...ion%20page.htm https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...ields_And_Pads http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=151 this is my 20 vartarg, it also has a 6.5 creedmoor with a 16 1/4" mgm barrel

June 25, 2014, 03:24 AM	#22
Geezerbiker Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Location: Willamina, OR Posts: 1,909	Plus one to a good muzzle brake. A friend of mine has a .338 Win mag with a brake on it and it kicks less than my .308 Win. If you Put a brake on a .25-06 or a .243 Win along with a good recoil pad, it could very well be tolerable for you... If that fails a hunting buddy that can shoot for you is the best I can think of. Tony

June 25, 2014, 03:37 AM	#23
JD0x0 Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2013 Posts: 1,037	A .270 Winchester in a mid weight rifle with a brake and a pad, should recoil like a pussycat and have more than enough power to take down anything in the continental US. .270 win has all the power of a .30-06 with a tad less recoil. An auto loader like a BAR should bring down the shock even further.

June 25, 2014, 07:49 AM	#24
green_MTman Senior Member Join Date: March 27, 2014 Location: southeastern Vermont,USA Posts: 325	.243 or .257 roberts or .250 savage

June 25, 2014, 08:28 AM	#25
Picher Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Maine Posts: 3,701	If you don't want to get a new rifle, consider using 30-06 "Reduced Recoil" factory ammo. They use 125 grain larger game bullets, but at reduced pressures to achieve adequate killing force out to 200 yards. Recoil is much like a .243 Win, but it makes a bigger hole in game. I have Remington Reduced Recoil ammo for my .270 Win because my grandkids wanted to hunt and I didn't have a .243 Win for them. Other makers are also offering reduced recoil ammo. One caution: Dispite claims, they may shoot a bit off the zero used for full-power rounds, so be sure to sight-in with the ammo you're going to use.