Reloading, its not that I dont wanna learn..its just expensive!

[JerseyDrez]

(Please remind yourself that these prices are from MY AREA, not yours.)

So I just got home from Cabelas, and of course ended up spending 2x the amount I planned to. But hell, when does that NOT happen on a trip there?!

Anyway, I was picking up some reloading supplies for a friend and had to get a salesman to help me as Im unfamiliar with reloading stuff. We got what I needed, and I called my friend to tell him I got whatever (BDS scale, some primers, bullets etc).

So we got into the 'you know, you should really start reloading' and Id answer my usual 'ehh, Id like to but maybe when the market goes does in price'. Of course we go back and forth for a few mins, and it ends with me still not persuaded to reload.

Now youre probably wondering why? Why do you not wanna reload Drez? Hey, Id love to, I really would...Id love to learn, Id love to be skilled at it, Id love to SAVE MONEY!, Id love reloading to turn into a relaxing hobby, etc etc...but right now, I just cant find the 'push' to get me to buy a complete reloading kit, and then be on the search for the ingredients to make rounds (bullets, casings, primers, wads for shotshells, + everything else etc etc).

During this present time, it seems like (in my area), its just as hard to find 9mm casings or bullets than finding regular 9mm rounds. If anything, finding packaged ammo is easier than finding the ingredients to reload. Now I know for most of you, its rather easier to find reloading supplies and its rather inexpensive at that, but another reason why I dont find myself reloading is the price. I mean chit, after all is done - per 500rds of 9mm my friend who reloads ends up paying about 80$ for that 500rds he reloads. I buy 500rd bulk packs for $100 shipped to my door, and I know a $20 is not a lot but it is a good amount, is it worth all the...I dont wanna say hassle, but the whole process to save $20?

I know thats with reloading components/supplies around here, Im sure some of you guys in the boonies (middle of MT, NE, etc shall I say lucky ones?) are probably reloading 500rds of 9mm for like $40 or $50, in which Id say hell yeah, Id reload too! But for now, in this present time of expensive ammo/reloading supplies in my area, I just dont feel that its worth it for me to reload yet. If reloading supplies prices decreased, then Id definitely go out and

Cliff notes:
- Id love to start reloading, but realized [in my area] that reloading supplies are very expensive
- Of course Id like to 'enjoy' the feeling of reloading my own ammo, but I feel its not worth my time and money (right now) when its gonna end up being a few bucks cheaper than buying ammo
- As I compared earlier, my friend reloads 9mm and for 500 reloads, it comes out to about $70-80. I can buy 500rds of American Eagle 9mm for $100 shipped. If it was a bigger savings, lets say $50 for 500, then I would have already bought a press, scales, etc etc, but up until reloading supplies drop that much in price, Im sticking to buying ammo.

What is the point of this thread? Of course its me ranting away, and being bored and typing a whole bunch of BS, but its just a few statements on how its almost just as expensive to reload than to buy ammo, theres not really a 'question' needing an 'answer'. I just thought Id share my own opinions on reloading, as everyone seems to get 'mad' at people who dont reload, and giving them a reason as to why I, myself, dont reload. Of course Id love to, but its just not worth it at this time.

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

You are right. Getting into reloading can be expensive, depending on your taste. Me, I am perfectly happy with my Lee classic turret press. It is fast and makes great ammo. I also cast my own bullets. THIS is where you save th money. For me to load 500 9mm, it costs me $20. Of course I am not counting my time or the little bit of electricity to run my lead pot. I also reload to customize the ammunition to fit my guns. Factory loads are loaded to fit generally all the guns in that givn caliber. I try to squeeze every bit of accuracy out of my firearms. Reloading helps me do this. If you don't have a lot of spare time or don't shoot very often, it would be foolish to start reloading. Good luck, and if you decide it is for you, feel free to ask questions.

[BigJimP]

If you can afford to put out the money to buy in bigger quantities / powder in 8 lb kegs, primers in case lots of 1,000 or 5,000 / bullets in case lots of around 3,500 in 9mm

then I show my costs for a box of 50 9mm ( 124 gr ) with a premium bullet, Montana Gold CMJ - is $ 6.26 a box or $ 62.60 for 500 ......

Once the press is set up / my press will easily turn out 500 rounds in 30 min. It will take me another 30 min to check each round with a case gauge/box them up - so 500 rounds in an hour is pretty easy work / and its a lot more accurate round than American Eagle / and saves about 38% ...so I disagree.

I don't see anyone here getting mad at guys that don't reload / but there is no doubt you can save money on a box of ammo ... but it means you'll probably just shoot more / and that's the point after all.... to have some fun.
But to each his own ...

[Nowhere Man]

To save money reloading you need to buy in bulk. 2000 bullets, 5000 primers and 4-8 pounds of powder. I can look locally but, most times I end up buying online.

For me to reload 9mm FMJ costs less than $10/100. That's half the cost of WWB. .45ACP LSWC costs about the same to reload yet, it costs about 3 times as much to buy loaded. That's a significant savings over retail.


Dave

[angus6]

I'm going to let you in on a little secret if you promise not to tell , there is this thing called the internet <ask Al Gore about it> any way it can be used to order reloading components and you can reload 9mm for under $100 a thousand with cast bullets and under $115 a thousand using jacketed bullets . These prices are shipped to your house as of today
If you cast your own bullets you can get in the $46 a thousand range

[Foxbat]

Let's not forget that the 9mm is perhaps the worst benchmark out there - the saving is marginal.

But it gets progressively bigger as you get into more expensive calibers. For instance, take the .357 Sig. There you can still get the rounds for about 12 cents each, while the best commercial price is around 40 cents. That's about 70% saving.

Another beauty of reloading is not in saving, but in getting what you want. You can load as strong or as weak rounds as you wish, depending upon your needs. I sometimes load super-weak rounds for some types of shooting... good luck buying those!

And of course... your volume will determine whether it makes economical sense.

The way I shoot I save enough in one month to buy a brand new spanking Dillon 650 fully equipped.

And one more thing... there is whole another world between brand new ammo and your own reloading - and that is buying reloaded ammo. Companies like Georgia Arms sell it, and prices are right between the new and your reloads.

[Tex S]

During this present time, it seems like (in my area), its just as hard to find 9mm casings or bullets than finding regular 9mm rounds.

You should look for cases on the ground at the local range. They are free. Thats where I get all mine.

As others have mentioned, 9mm is not a big money saver if you reload it; however, most rifle calibers and some pistol calibers offer substantial savings. I load boxes of 50 in 45auto for less than $7. This ammo is way more accurate too. Try finding a box of 45auto for under $10 bucks anywhere. Its not gonna happen.

Do you own rifles? See what you can save by reloading that ammo. It will be massive savings, and way better ammo to boot.

Google "reloading calculator" and see what pops up. You should be able to find a spreadsheet type document that allows you to see exactly how much you will save by reloading.

[lomaxanderson]

357 mag,45acp,38 special...I paid for my dllon equipment in less than 6 mos of shooting...spend 200 bucks on ammo every weekend gets old...bot dillon stuff bout 800 bucks for everythin to load all these calibures...thats 2 months of shooting at $200 for bought ammo...sleaves of primers and 15$ pound of powder ...brass and you are ready to start saving...better ammo too...worked for me

[chris in va]

Don't reload to save money...reload to shoot MORE for the same amount of cash. And do it because it's interesting and fun.

My entire reloading setup cost me $120. Now that my reloading equipment is 'paid' for, my 50ct box for 9mm is $6 with lead bullets. This will do down drastically once I get a basic lead casting setup.

[bluetopper]

9mm.......I have 9mm 147gr cast lead bullets delivered to my door for $62 a thousand. And I'm loading on an inexpensive Lee turret press.........yes it's waaay cheaper.

I see NO reason to ever buy FMJ or factory ammo again.

[Farmland]

Any hobby will cost money and from reading your thread maybe you don't shoot all that much to make a difference. Reloading can have a small or a large start up cost. Buying components at the wrong place and time can cost even more.

To be honest If you are looking at it from a dollar point of view then maybe your not someone that needs to reload. If your not shooting a large amount of ammunition then maybe your not someone that needs to reload.

However if your someone that wants to expand their love of firearms you may want to reload. If your looking to broaden the hobby then I know you should consider reloading. if you are looking to bring about the best possible match between the gun and bullet then you may want to reload.

I can't argue the start up price to go what I would call first class, though there is a company called Lee that puts reloading with in reach of most people. Remember each time you reload the price of the equipment drops and soon you have covered that first investment. However you have to shoot more than a few hundred rounds a year to do that.

I have a feeling your on the fence. Buy a cheap Lee single stage kit and see if it is for you. So for around $100 plus a few more dollars for components you will know if reloading is for you. The good point is that you can sale that kit and get have of your investment back if it is not more.

[wncchester]

"What is the point of this thread? Of course its me ranting away, and being bored and typing a whole bunch of BS, but its just a few statements on how its almost just as expensive to reload than to buy ammo, theres not really a 'question' needing an 'answer'."

Glad I skipped to the bottom first!

[Sevens]

I think "saving money" and "cheaper ammo" is probably the biggest reason anyone ever gets drawn to reloading. I won't sit here and say that I would keep reloading if it cost me MORE than buying factory ammo-- I'm a very frugal guy and I'm often driven by economics.

BUT I can assure you 100% that if my savings were ZERO, I would absolutely, positively, no doubt continue to reload all my ammo, every bit of it. And no, I would not have said that back before I started reloading, but I damn sure say it and believe it now.

There's a bucket of reasons. Besides that fact that I absolutely love the hobby of it, the number two reason I do it is because I get to control my inventory. I don't ever have to swing by a gun store or sporting goods counter on the way to the range and I don't have to hit the same counters on the way back to replace what I shot. And my range day is NEVER planned around how much ammo I happen to have, because I always have much more than I need at any given time.

I live in a place where it gets cold and lousy in the winter, so I don't shoot often during those months. It's a heap of fun to produce ammo at my own slow place during that time and watch my stockpile build. And it's just as much fun to reload during the nicer months, too.

Reloading is, for me, a way to do "gun stuff" at a moment's notice. Going down to the man cave and working at the bench can be a 20-minute zip or a 5-hour Saturday afternoon, whenever it's convenient or whenever I'd like to do it.

Shooting is great, but it means I have to pack up guns, pack up ammo, pack up gear, drive 50 miles to my range, unload it from the car, haul it to the range, set up my gear, set up my targets, and THEN I get to shoot.

And then it all needs to get packed up, targets cleaned up, hauled out, packed in to the car, drive home, unload, then CLEAN, sort out, it's a b-i-g operation.

Not that I mind doing all of that, but this is something I have to literally plan on the calendar and spend 6-8 hours doing. I -love- my range days, but with a wife and two kids, it's a scheduled event with a lot of stuff involved.

Man cave? Down one flight of stairs and through a door. Nice chair, big bench, music, good lighting, lots of stuff to do. It's right there, right now.

Reloading is an addictive, thoroughly enjoyable hobby. It may not be for everyone.

[NWPilgrim]

Reloading can be as simple and cheap, or complicated and expensive, as you want it to be.

Many of us got started not to reload 9mm (unless you are a competitor and shoot 1,000 per weekend), but because of a more expensive cartridge. For me it was .44 mag. Back in the late 80s 9mm was about $6/50 but .44 mag was $24/50. I could reload .44 mag for about $8/50 back then.

Once you get the basic reloading setup it is cheap to add dies and components for another cartridge.

Handloading for handgun cartridges is simpler and needs less equipment than for rifle. But, reloading for rifle can bring HUGE savings over factory, especially if you get into premium bullets.

If you are interested in trying it out, start simple and inexpensive. Get a Lee single stage or turret press, a set of carbide handgun dies, powder measure, scale, calipers, reloading block (holds the cases between steps). Probably cost about $150. You don't need a huge amount of components to start. Save your brass from factory ammo and just 100 cases will go a long way (basically "free" since you were going to shoot factory anyway). You can get 500 lead bullets for $30. Primers bought locally are maybe $3.30/100. A 1 lb can of powder like W231 or Unique bought locally is about $22 and will load 1,000 - 1,500 cases. Perhaps equipment and components costs about $250 for the first 1,000 loads.

You can usually save about 50% over factory on even the cheapest ammo. 1,000 rounds is 20 boxes of ammo, at a low end ocst of $15/50 for factory, so you are saving about $7.50 or more pre 50 rounds. It would take about 30 boxes or 1,500 rounds of reloads to recoup the startup costs. Every new cartridge you add is even cheaper and pays for itself much quicker, because you are only buying a new set of dies.

So it depends on how fast you would shoot that first 1,500 rounds of ammo. For guys like my Dad who would shoot 20 rounds per year it would take a lifetime. For competitors it may take a weekend. The more you shoot the faster it is too pay off more elaborate equipment such as a progressive press.

In the end, if you enjoy it as a hobby the cost savings becomes secondary to the enjoyment. If you don;t enjoy the process then the material cost savings may not make up for the labor involved, and you may not be as attentive as you would if you enjoyed it. Attention to detail = safety.

[Christchild]

As always, ANY new endeavour/hobby will cost You a bit to get started, and if You shoot quite a bit of ammo, the savings of HandLoading will really show itself in a hurry.

If You're going to be loading more than just 9mm, say if You're loading rifle cartridge(s) also, then You get loads Custom Tailored to Your gun(s).

There were a few aspects/ideas that led me to Handloading.

1.) Factory ammo can tarnish/corrode, and over time, ammo can corrode to an extent that exceeds a safe level, then You're wasting ammo, wasting money.

2.) Ammunition Components, when taken care of and protected from extreme temperature fluctuations and humidity, will last ALOT longer than assembled ammunition.

3.) As I stated above, You can Tailor Your loads to Your FireArm and Your intended purpose.

4.) YOU know exactly what goes into that Handloaded ammunition, increasing reliability and confidence.

5.) When Your loads are Tailored to Your gun(s), You can squeeze finer accuracy out of the entire operation (gun/ammo).

I know I kind of repeated myself, and could have condensed a few of those statements, but why?

[JerseyDrez]

Wow, so many responses!

I work all day tomorrow and am going to the range most of the day sunday. Im gonna try and read everything and post up sometime tomorrow night.

Until then, keep your replies coming...sounds like the internet is where to go for reloading supplies. I skimmed around and saw $100 for 1k rounds. Maybe Ill start saving up for a press now

[javven]

Handloading is what you make it, like most things.

If you want to make it economical - it can be done even in calibers like 9mm (though marginally so).

If you want to make accurate rounds - it can be done. It takes expiramentation with your rifle and usually lots and lots of brass / primper / powder / projectile combinations. If you handload for precision events you'll find COL is your friend your rifle will likely have 1 or 2 'most accurate' combinations of projectile and overall length.

Find a recipe book that has multiple listings for the 45-70. Sometimes you'll see 'trapdoor' sections and 'modern' sections. Some even single out the Ruger #1. Look at the load data and think about published factory ammo velocities and you'll see a reason to reload. You do, though still want to stay within published load data

I've found my reduced loads are perfectly usable for hunting (with the right bullet) or shooting at the rannge and don't tear you up like shooting a full-house round. Thus, for example my 7mm RM can take bears, moose or even small deer and hogs. My son can shoot it comfortably - so can my wife. Thus "Big Bertha" now has 3 roles instead of just 1.

You also get to pick your projectiles. Sure - there's a lot out there these days but you still have more selection with handloading. For example, I prefer round nose bullets. I know spitzers are usually better on paper but RNs do just fine. They also seem to survive handling a bit better - less tip fouling in and out of magazines.

[Edward429451]

Listen to ICH. 20 bucks for 500 9mm? That's what I'm talkin'!!! Yes sir, load that ammo. Oh the savings is only 20 dollars you say? WHat about when they take that away? Than whats it worth? Priceless bro. Do it. I cast. I can load 50 full house 44 mags for 4.00, still!

My SHotgun shells are a break even deal. I can buy them for what it cost to make them, with no more labor than driving to wal mart. But what about when I cant buy them, huh? HUH? Thenm they are priceless. Just do it!

Nike Slogans. Not just for shoes anymore....

[Uncle Buck]

I started reloading because I could not get any .45LC ammo. When I was able to find it, it was anywhere from $40 - $55 a box of fifty rounds. I am talking just lead bullets. The hollow points where running $30 for a box of twenty-five.
I brought by price per round down from .87 cents to .23 cents just reloading. Now I can shoot when-ever I want, what-ever I want, and do not have to worry about having nothing left to shoot next week-end.
I have not figured out the cost savings on the .30-30 rounds yet, but I am betting they will still be cheaper than factory loads.
I have fun, it keeps me occupied (and out of trouble), and I have the ammunition when I want it. I no longer have to rely on stores to get my ammunition. Online ordering is the way to go most of the time.

[wingman]

One way to justify the expense is that reloading gear will only go higher, I've reloaded nearly 40 years now, I do it because I find it relaxing,and I produce better rounds for my guns then I can purchase commercial, accuracy wise. I suggest buy one piece at a time start out slow to find what you really need buying huge kits,etc is a mistake trust me I know as many things get sit to one side and never used.

[JerseyDrez]

Well with so many responses, I cant reply to everyone so Ill just generalize a few statements.

First off, thanks for the numerous comments so far.

I understand what all of you are saying, slowly get into it but GET into it. I dont have to go all out and buy a huge machine kit with everything, more so understand and learn what Ill need and then start buying.

Its funny because I buy shooting gear/ammo/accessories online and never really thought about checking out reloading supplies online. But thats obviously where to go for it, especially when my LGS have shortages on all reloading things and if they do have them, its super expensive.

Quick story - my friend who reloads that I was talking about, we just became friends about a month ago and thurs night we hungout and he set me up with his shell press and whatnot. Man was it fun! Ended up staying awake till like 4 in the morning reloading shells, he went to bed...and I reloaded! Ha.

So for right now, I am probably going to get into reloading by purchasing a basic press for shotshells and work my way into it. Im progressively shooting more and more clay, and I can use the same shells for buckshot (different wads/powder etc of course), but it will start my savings immediately. Even though they are different, Id like to learn with shells as they are a bit simpler and then work my way into handgun reloading. Plus, I dont really have much space for a reloading area right now so a shell press will be good and as I gain more room, I can get more supplies.

It was pretty cool as we met a very nice older gentleman at Cabelas today and shot the chit for a while..long story short, he started to make his own lead shot a few months ago and is selling it cheap as he gets started. So we got his number and Ill be looking forward to purchasing from him, $18$ for a 25lb bag and 2 bags for $30. Not bad right?

By the way, Im going to get what my friend has...a Load-all press in 12ga. Its basic and its cheap, and itll get the job done! Id love to get a progressive so I can bang out a box in just a few presses, but comfortably loading the other night through the Load-all, I was averaging almost 4 cases every 30mins. Not bad for an amateur, and a basic press!

Hows that sound for a start? Suggestions, criticism, comments...feel free!

[Harry Callahan]

JerseyDrez, I am in the same predicamant as you. I go back and forth between reloading or not reloading. Many here at this site have given me their input, for which I am truly thankful. I'm just not sure I shoot enough to make it worth my while. I'm one of those guys that tries to get out to the range once every couple of months. Probably shoot 300-400 rounds per trip. I have been saving for awhile now and have about $1100 "gun money" available. I've tried reloading and it is alot of fun. Even had a friend let me use his Dillon 650XL. What a machine! One could arm small armies in one night with what that thing bangs out! Lately I have been very discouraged by the cost of shooting supplies and their scarcity. Even was considering just buying another gun. However, it seems like the availability is starting to come back. I was at Cabela's last night and saw calibers readily available that I haven't seen in those numbers for quite some time. That being said, it would seem reasonable to expect the market to get more competitive with more product on the shelves. I think I will wait just a little while longer before making my move. Just have to decide whether I shoot enough to justify buying the 650XL or if I should go with something smaller and less productive, but cheaper.

[Colorado Redneck]

Sometimes there are used presses and dies on the internet auction sites.

I use a 22 hornet for prairie dogs (and a 22 mag and a 22-250). Factory loads for the hornet are around $.70 per round...sometime higher. I bought dies and a crimper. Cost per round for me is: Powder (Lil Gun 13 gr) 4 cents, Bullets (Hornady 40 gr. Vmax) 13 cents, primer 3 cents, case (I figure 5 reloads @) 5 cents = $.25 per round. You can't buy these loads, as Hornady only has a 35 gr Vmax load, and I like the 40 grain load better. And, last summer I had a heck of a time even finding 22 hornets in the store. The hand loads shoot really good, and it just makes me happy as heck to do that work. The 22 mag rounds are $.22 @.

It was boring years ago when starting out doing 38 specials, and I almost quit. Then when I started deer hunting again (after 40 years of missing that fun!) a 270 came home with me one day. That was the final straw, and since then I can't wait to load and shoot. The reloading is maybe even more fun than shooting, cause I can walk downstairs and load for a couple hours while the wife is watching a chick-flick on TV.

[JerseyDrez]

Callahan, it does sound like were in the same boat. Im guessing the 650xl is a progressive press, as you said you could supply an army. Id love to get one, but they run $400-600 and as much as you can really crank out boxes with them, a standard press' cost and simplicity will be better for me. Id rather spend $50 on a press, then spend $300 on supplies, but thats just me. We all have our preferences and desires, and of course what is efficient for me may be different for someone else.

CORed, I totally understand the satisfaction of reloading your own hand loads and shooting them. After I loaded all those boxes of shotshells the otehr night, we went trap shooting the next day and it felt great knowing I reloaded them. But Im sure it would feel THAT much better if they were handgun/rifle loads...since you can 'tweak' them a bit more, if you will.

Right now Im set on the Load-all press, but am waiting to purchase it until my friend will hook me up with his 'secret stash' of websites that he gets a lot of his primers and wads and such from. For now Im searching around, but I will probably end up ordering it in the next week or 2.

I bought a clay thrower at Cabelas today, so Im definitely going to have to start reloading now or in the next few months

[NWPilgrim]

Shouldn't be difficult to find primers for shotshells (209). Practically everyone had those in stock even while rifle and pistol primers were out for months.

I like grafs.com, widerners.com, midwayusa.com, natchezss.com, and powdervalleyinc.com for primers and powders.

Can't help you with other shotshell components as I don't reload for them.