How do statistics work?

[J. Williams]

OK - I'm reading an article about how a convience store clerk shot an armed robber (yea for the clerk). The robber is then transported to the local hospital and is treated for his wounds.

Now tell me how this works -

A) Does the robber become one of the "gun violence victims" statistics in the Brady Campaign fuzzy math program?

B) As he is robbing for a living and probably does not have insurance coverage, Does he become one of the numbers used by these cities who bring lawsuits against gun manufacturers for the costs of services (i.e. ambulances, emergency rooms, hospital bills, etc.) due to gun violence?

Or - do the number crunchers separate criminal behavior out from real accidents?

[dZ]

if he's under 21 then he's a child injured by an unregulated defective product endorsed by the NRA that costs America millions in medical bills every year

[Thairlar]

dZ, you forgot the more dangerous to the person who owns it than to people who attack them part.

[Coronach]

That is an excellent question. And, as with all excellent questions, the answer is "it depends."

Mostly it depends on who is crunching the numbers. It also has a lot to do with UCR codes (Uniform Crime Reports- a DOJ compilation of state and local crime stats) and local stats (each PD defines, records and reports things differently).

In short, if you're a "researcher" with an axe to grind, you define that offense into the category that best supports your hypothesis.

If you're a real researcher, you have to be very careful about how the crime is coded by the locals before you categorize it. Now, this is not usually done on a case-by-case basis, but rather by looking at how local agencies report different types of crimes, and translating them into your categories appropriately.

Mike

[J. Williams]

Another thought...

What about true firearm accidents that happen to employed, taxpaying citizens who do have insurance coverage - does the municipality pick up the tab for their treatment or does the private insurance company?

If the insurance company pays (even part of) the emergency treatment, ambulance, hospital stay of that victim, then how can municipalities sue gun manufacturers for "gun violence" costs?

In a general, unsubstantiated viewpoint, some might say that the municipalities who bring these lawsuits want the gun manufacturers to pay for the treatment of people who are unemployed (unemployable) and uninsured!!! Maybe?

[mcneill]

How do statistics work? It's like this -

Did you hear about the statitician who drowned while crossing a river with an average depth of three feet?
(Sorry, couldn't resist.)

Jim

[J. Williams]

did that statitician work for Brady Campaign?

[40ozflatfoot]

"did that statitician work for Brady Campaign?"

Gore campaign. Some of 'em are still recounting.

[Malpaso]

Two of my favorite sayings on the issue:

There are three falsehoods in life; lies, damn lies and statistics.

Figures lie, and liars figure.

[HKguy9]

Handguns are more dangerous to people who carry them. That's why all cops carry them. Speaking of cops, when the cops shoot someone, I wonder if that counts as a victim of gun violence...I mean in the true sense of the word, they are, but when we think of 'gun violence' we think of children that shoot themselves, at least 'gun violence' is marketed that way.

[mcneill]

>>did that statitician work for Brady Campaign?<<

Nah, but they went to the same school.

Jim

[Alerion]

Usually they work any way the group funding the study wants them to work!

Tom