Bumpstock/mod trigger sales records.

imagunnut · March 25, 2019, 06:25 PM

Has anyone inquired with any company who sold a bumpstock/mod triggers with regards to their sales records? I don't want to name any companies, but I have tried numerous times to find out if my personal information has been shared, or had their records subpoena'd by any gov't agencies. To date, I have not received any responses. My hope is that they will do all they can to protect my privacy, but the lack of responses is concerning to me.

jrinne0430 · March 25, 2019, 07:43 PM

Is it tomorrow that bump stick owners become “felons”?

Absolutely shameful! How will it be enforced if records were not kept or knowing who is the current owner? Either way, being a felon for possession is unbelievable.

jrinne0430 · March 25, 2019, 08:05 PM

ATF has put out instructions on how to destroy them. Maybe 30rd mags will be next? Like the bump stocks, no grandfather clause offered. Also, Red flag laws either preceding or post.

As for records of who they were sold to, hard to tell since it was not a mandatory record requirement. If the company’s records are demanded or subpoena, I’m sure they will have many of the original purchasers’ info.

https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...how-to-destroy

imagunnut · March 26, 2019, 11:52 AM

Last I heard, the issue is headed to SCOTUS.

LineStretcher · March 26, 2019, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagunnut

Has anyone inquired with any company who sold a bumpstock/mod triggers with regards to their sales records? I don't want to name any companies, but I have tried numerous times to find out if my personal information has been shared, or had their records subpoena'd by any gov't agencies. To date, I have not received any responses. My hope is that they will do all they can to protect my privacy, but the lack of responses is concerning to me.

My advice is to do what you need to do to comply with the law at this time. If you are charged with a felony you will not just loose your bump stocks and probably serve time, you will never own a gun again.

Once you've complied and preserved what's left of your second amendment rights you can fight to regain the right to own bump stocks/mod triggers. It will be a tough battle but I think we will prevail and then if we decide we still need them, we will be able to replace them.

TXAZ · March 26, 2019, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagunnut

Last I heard, the issue is headed to SCOTUS.

It looked like SCOTUS declined to block the ban.
If you still have them... don’t have them.
Today is the day.

imagunnut · March 26, 2019, 12:32 PM

I have no intention of violating law, (just or unjust), whether or not people comply is not my concern. My concern is the lack of communication by some manufacturers. Should these bans be defeated, I will think twice about buying product from companies who do not communicate with their customers, or have no interest in protecting personal information, even to the extent of going to court to fight a subpoena. The fact I am not receiving a response from companies speaks volumes to this issue.

Glenn E. Meyer · March 26, 2019, 01:19 PM

Roberts didn't grant a temporary save:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sup...bump-stock-ban

LineStretcher · March 26, 2019, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imagunnut

I have no intention of violating law, (just or unjust), whether or not people comply is not my concern. My concern is the lack of communication by some manufacturers. Should these bans be defeated, I will think twice about buying product from companies who do not communicate with their customers, or have no interest in protecting personal information, even to the extent of going to court to fight a subpoena. The fact I am not receiving a response from companies speaks volumes to this issue.

I agree that a lack of communications concerning this matter is concerning. Hopefully it will be resolved soon.

rickyrick · March 26, 2019, 03:40 PM

Washington state patrol was buying them at 150$ a pop with a limited budget and a limit of five per person. I heard rumors that people were 3D printing them and had ordered cheap Chinese stocks and pocketing some cash. Seen a guy online offering to print them for material cost. People on the news that were interviewed at the buyback admitted to buying them brand new just weeks ago.

So I’m not sure if the streets are safer

I think the Intent was to buy back 1000 and that goal was reached. Believe the budget was $150000, so the math works out.

youngridge · March 26, 2019, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyrick

Washington state patrol was buying them at 150$ a pop with a limited budget and a limit of five per person. I heard rumors that people were 3D printing them and had ordered cheap Chinese stocks and pocketing some cash. Seen a guy online offering to print them for material cost. People on the news that were interviewed at the buyback admitted to buying them brand new just weeks ago.

So I’m not sure if the streets are safer

I think the Intent was to buy back 1000 and that goal was reached. Believe the budget was $150000, so the math works out.

Good way to spend some tax dollars.....I am not a fan of bump stocks but I think this will be the case of where does it end after this?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

**Aguila Blanca** · March 26, 2019, 06:51 PM

If the State of Washington conducted a buyback of a newly banned item but limited it to the first 1,000 examples of the banned item that walked in the door ... wouldn't (and shouldn't) that open the State of Washington up to a huge lawsuit for unequal treatment under the law? I can see nothing fair, just, or reasonable about paying 1,000 people the full price (or more) that they paid for an "evil" item while leaving thousands or tens of thousands of other people to suck it up and dispose of their identical "evil" items at the loss of their purchase price.

Thet thar just ain't raht.

riffraff · March 29, 2019, 11:20 AM

I think it's good and bad that there aren't reporting requirements (ie not saying by owners just by what firearms/products make it into circulation).

I fill out a 4473, says someone bought a gun, well in actuality I bought a pistol, 2 complete lowers, and 2 rifles, all semi auto stuff.. Someobe later using NICS stats then estimates 5x low on that gun sale stat then applies a figure to it assuming only a fraction of gun sales are semi autos..

When it comes to > 10 round magazines we probably have billions in the US but no way to prove it.. semi auto rifles and handguns, specific models like an AR15 are likely waaaaay under estimated since they base it on background checks and likely miss masses of lowers people buy a half dozen at a time that eventually become rifles.

These stats would help us if they were available.

rickyrick · March 29, 2019, 02:32 PM

People have been ghosting ARs since before I even knew it was a thing. Ain’t no telling how many uppers there is out there. My ARs have extra uppers for each lower.

Most of us don’t give two hoots about bump-stocks, but... the ease of which they we’re banned is troubling. It’s only just a plastic accessory. What other “accessories” are they going to ban with a swoop of the pen?
I was reading the ruling, a little bit ago... and they made it work by saying that “single function of the trigger” really means “single pull of the trigger” of course it includes “harnessing the energy of the recoil blah, blah , blah” but it all hinges on being able to refine what a single function of the trigger meant. They were able to put a little extra icing on the cake because apparently there’s a spring involved.

So by saying they had been interpreting “single function of the trigger” incorrectly for a good chunk of a century they can now say “by golly, it’s a machine gun!” Sounds a lot like it depends on what the definition of is is.

I expect AR pistols to go next lol.

riffraff · March 29, 2019, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyrick

People have been ghosting ARs since before I even knew it was a thing. Ain’t no telling how many uppers there is out there. My ARs have extra uppers for each lower.

Most of us don’t give two hoots about bump-stocks, but... the ease of which they we’re banned is troubling. It’s only just a plastic accessory. What other “accessories” are they going to ban with a swoop of the pen?
I was reading the ruling, a little bit ago... and they made it work by saying that “single function of the trigger” really means “single pull of the trigger” of course it includes “harnessing the energy of the recoil blah, blah , blah” but it all hinges on being able to refine what a single function of the trigger meant. They were able to put a little extra icing on the cake because apparently there’s a spring involved.

So by saying they had been interpreting “single function of the trigger” incorrectly for a good chunk of a century they can now say “by golly, it’s a machine gun!” Sounds a lot like it depends on what the definition of is is.

I expect AR pistols to go next lol.

I'm actually more worried realistically of them trying to re-classify to call auto loading guns an NFA item some day. It might spare the government involved a fight over 2A by stating it's only a tax. Obviously itd be much more but seems feasible to more easily pass than any type of confiscation.

March 25, 2019, 06:25 PM	#1
imagunnut Member Join Date: January 27, 2015 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 63	Bumpstock/mod trigger sales records. Has anyone inquired with any company who sold a bumpstock/mod triggers with regards to their sales records? I don't want to name any companies, but I have tried numerous times to find out if my personal information has been shared, or had their records subpoena'd by any gov't agencies. To date, I have not received any responses. My hope is that they will do all they can to protect my privacy, but the lack of responses is concerning to me.

March 25, 2019, 07:43 PM	#2
jrinne0430 Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 298	Is it tomorrow that bump stick owners become “felons”? Absolutely shameful! How will it be enforced if records were not kept or knowing who is the current owner? Either way, being a felon for possession is unbelievable. Last edited by jrinne0430; March 25, 2019 at 08:29 PM.

March 25, 2019, 08:05 PM	#3
jrinne0430 Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 298	ATF has put out instructions on how to destroy them. Maybe 30rd mags will be next? Like the bump stocks, no grandfather clause offered. Also, Red flag laws either preceding or post. As for records of who they were sold to, hard to tell since it was not a mandatory record requirement. If the company’s records are demanded or subpoena, I’m sure they will have many of the original purchasers’ info. https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...how-to-destroy Last edited by jrinne0430; March 25, 2019 at 08:26 PM.

March 26, 2019, 01:19 PM	#8
Glenn E. Meyer Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2000 Posts: 20,064	Roberts didn't grant a temporary save: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sup...bump-stock-ban __________________ NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc. - Aux Armes, Citoyens

March 26, 2019, 11:52 AM	#4
imagunnut Member Join Date: January 27, 2015 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 63	Last I heard, the issue is headed to SCOTUS.

March 26, 2019, 12:32 PM	#7
imagunnut Member Join Date: January 27, 2015 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 63	I have no intention of violating law, (just or unjust), whether or not people comply is not my concern. My concern is the lack of communication by some manufacturers. Should these bans be defeated, I will think twice about buying product from companies who do not communicate with their customers, or have no interest in protecting personal information, even to the extent of going to court to fight a subpoena. The fact I am not receiving a response from companies speaks volumes to this issue.

March 26, 2019, 03:40 PM	#10
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,242	Washington state patrol was buying them at 150$ a pop with a limited budget and a limit of five per person. I heard rumors that people were 3D printing them and had ordered cheap Chinese stocks and pocketing some cash. Seen a guy online offering to print them for material cost. People on the news that were interviewed at the buyback admitted to buying them brand new just weeks ago. So I’m not sure if the streets are safer I think the Intent was to buy back 1000 and that goal was reached. Believe the budget was $150000, so the math works out.

March 26, 2019, 06:51 PM	#12
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,537	If the State of Washington conducted a buyback of a newly banned item but limited it to the first 1,000 examples of the banned item that walked in the door ... wouldn't (and shouldn't) that open the State of Washington up to a huge lawsuit for unequal treatment under the law? I can see nothing fair, just, or reasonable about paying 1,000 people the full price (or more) that they paid for an "evil" item while leaving thousands or tens of thousands of other people to suck it up and dispose of their identical "evil" items at the loss of their purchase price. Thet thar just ain't raht.

March 29, 2019, 11:20 AM	#13
riffraff Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2016 Posts: 629	I think it's good and bad that there aren't reporting requirements (ie not saying by owners just by what firearms/products make it into circulation). I fill out a 4473, says someone bought a gun, well in actuality I bought a pistol, 2 complete lowers, and 2 rifles, all semi auto stuff.. Someobe later using NICS stats then estimates 5x low on that gun sale stat then applies a figure to it assuming only a fraction of gun sales are semi autos.. When it comes to > 10 round magazines we probably have billions in the US but no way to prove it.. semi auto rifles and handguns, specific models like an AR15 are likely waaaaay under estimated since they base it on background checks and likely miss masses of lowers people buy a half dozen at a time that eventually become rifles. These stats would help us if they were available.

March 29, 2019, 02:32 PM	#14
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,242	People have been ghosting ARs since before I even knew it was a thing. Ain’t no telling how many uppers there is out there. My ARs have extra uppers for each lower. Most of us don’t give two hoots about bump-stocks, but... the ease of which they we’re banned is troubling. It’s only just a plastic accessory. What other “accessories” are they going to ban with a swoop of the pen? I was reading the ruling, a little bit ago... and they made it work by saying that “single function of the trigger” really means “single pull of the trigger” of course it includes “harnessing the energy of the recoil blah, blah , blah” but it all hinges on being able to refine what a single function of the trigger meant. They were able to put a little extra icing on the cake because apparently there’s a spring involved. So by saying they had been interpreting “single function of the trigger” incorrectly for a good chunk of a century they can now say “by golly, it’s a machine gun!” Sounds a lot like it depends on what the definition of is is. I expect AR pistols to go next lol.