varminter caliber? 6mm, 243, 25-06, 22-250

[camaroman]

I'm looking into getting a varmint rifle. Is there much diference between the 6mm and the .243? What about the 25-06 and the 22-250. Just looking for all around caliber with variety loads that can handle long distance. And I would prefer nice clean kills, no exploding squirrels or groundhogs



thanks

[gunhog]

Oh boy, you mentioned two of my favorite calibers for varminting in the 250 and 25-06. I love them both.

The main difference between two, for me anyway, is range for bullet. I love my 250's but only out to 300-350 ocasionally on a calm day 400 yds. Use 55 grain BT bullet which is very kind to the hide, if worried about that sort of thing.

Now strap on a nightforce to that 25-06 and you can really reach out and touch some varmints. The downside is there isn't a bunch left for the furbuyer. I typically use 120 grain for stability but it will rip 'em up.

Don't forget about the 223. I have been experimenting with a new CAR and Black Hills 55 grain ballistic tips and have been quite pleased thus far out to 300 yards or so.

There is my .02 worth. If I was you I would get one or two of each, if that won't work buy a 22-250.

[kudu]

My first rifle was a .243. It does a wonderful job on groundhogs and depending on which bullet you load in it it will blow them up or just kill them without the splat. I killed about 130 hogs the first year I had it, some out to 400 yds. Just remember that a bullet that blows up on impact won't travel on down the road and one that punches a hole in and out may go another mile before it hits something else. I also have .223's and a .17HMR to play with and a bunch of other guns that occasionaly take a woodchuck.

Any of the bullets you mentioned will do great for groundhogs but the .6mm/.243 and .25-06 have the advantage of bigger bullets if you want to hunt big game animals later on.

[camaroman]

gun hog, The 25-06 and the 250 sound awesome. I have shot a 22-250 and was damned impressed. I have pondered the .223, especialy since that gives me another reason to get an AR. descisions descision

[Vic303]

Let's see, I'm a 243 fan. Easier to find brass for/commercial loadings for than 6mm REm. You can always neck down .308... Good selection of bullets too. I don't have a 250 or 25-06, but seems to me the 25-06 would not be really 'cost effective' on powder, if you're going to shoot a lot of rodentia. Don't know about the 250...

[gunhog]

Camaroman, please remember if you can't decide what to get, at the very least, get one of each.

Seriously, If you you need a varmint rifle only look at the 223 or 250 some may say 220 swift or 223 wssm or oodles of others but I would agree with Kudu in that a 243 or 25-06 or even a 270 could be more of an all purpose gun.

I think I'm up to .04 cents worth.

Regards

[camaroman]

vic and kudu, good points. I wonder what range I could expect out of a .223???

Kudu, tell me more about these loads you mentioned

gunhog, I am truly looking for a dedicated varmint gun. Being in Texas I probabaly dont need anything to reach out past 400 yds, but its fun to think about :)

[P95Carry]

.223 can IMO be ''stretched'' to 400 yds .... but ..... not with a windy day. Wind drift is I reckon the biggest drag with this cal ... after 100 yds or so it gets real irksome.

The 22-250 is a great round but again I'd not want windage problems.

My .243 can be a broad spectrum shooter. I do load with heavy bullets .. 105 Grain Speer flat base JSP's. They will suffice for deer if required but are good too for long range groundhogs .. they are tho a tad ''disruptive''! :p

I load these over 33.9 Vhit N-140 .. and get excellent grouping thru my Savage 99C. That load is not a recommendation BTW .... just a FYI. :)

[kudu]

Cameroman,

There is so many different bullets to choose from in the .243. When I started 20 years ago I had bought the bulk pack of 80gr rem soft points to load with because they were cheap. They did well, and I killed dozens of varmints with them allways knowing what was downrange . One day I shot a groundhog sitting at it's hole at about 250yds, behind it was an old railroad iron fencepost. Bullet went through the hog and through the 5/8 web of steel of the iron. Change bullets. I started using IIRC 75gr Hornady SXSP's. When I worked up the load on htese it warns not to exceed the velocity on the box. At first I couldn't hit paper with them. As i moved closer to my test target I realized that I was blowing the bullets up in flight, little pices of jacket material were pepering the target. Loaded slower they were devastating on varmints. They would turn them into a bag of jelly without exit wound most of the time.

Now I am loading 70gr nosler ballistic tips, but there is such an array of good varmint bullets now that it should be easy to come up with a good round that your rifle would like to shoot. I also keep some 95gr ballistic tips loaded for out to 400+ yrds just in case.

Hope this helps,

[camaroman]

I found a copy of Ammo & Ballistics by Bob Forker. I found it at the library of all places, a public library... having books about bullets!!! Go figure!

Anyway, I thought I would share this.

.223
Barrels with 1 in 14 twist are good up to the 55 gr. The heavier loads do better in the faster twists. "If you have one of the fast-twist barrels, you may have problems with the very light varmint loads. The high velocities attained and the quick twist combine to produce a bullet spin rate that can literally rip thin jacketed bullets apart." Hence what Kudu was talking about with the .243 loads.


You guys have way too much fun with reloading, I gotta get one of those toys too!

[Spectre]

There is a different difference in potential between the .243 and the 6mm, but you won't see it unless you reload.

If you reload, get the 6mm. If you don't, get the .243.

John

[camaroman]

P95Carry - Since you have a Savage model I was curious as to your opinions on the Savage rifles. I have always been a Remington fan myself. I have been tempted to look into Savage but I keep hearing bad things about stocks etc..

[P95Carry]

camaroman ....... I was real lucky gettin this rifle. Local Firehall raffle .. danged if my number didn't come up! Three years ago now it must be.

Up till then I was sorta ambivalent about Savage - tho in fairness had always heard quite good things .. good value etc. Triggers were sometimes mentioned tho as not being good enough. Now of course I am led to believe the ''accutrigger'' .... is pretty good.

This 99C has an OK std trigger ... not great but far from worst ever used .. it'll serve for me just fine ... I know it now. Perfectly adequate. The woodwork as you can see is very nice .. slightly enhanced here for saturation but that's all. It shoots excellent .. really pleasing piece for me.

I am now a Savage fan ... and could well get another sometime .... if that is I can justify YET another long arm! :p


http://www.bedford.net/design/cb_gun2/99c_s.jpg

[Cowdogpete]

Coyotes sized animals and smaller consider a .17 Remington.

Cowdogpete

[camaroman]

"Coyotes sized animals and smaller consider a .17 Remington."
-Cowdogpete

I had thought about the .17, Could you give me some more detail of your hunting results with it?


P95Carry: Awesome rifle!! They dont make the lever actions anymore do they?

[C. D. Beaver]

You people all are using wonderful varmint calibers. I started out (many years ago) with the .244 Remington, went from there to the .243, added the really great .22-250. Never did own a .25-06, but sure wanted one.

Somewhere along the line I acquired a triple deuce, and it became my caliber of choice along with the .22-250. The .222 simply was unbeatable out to 225 or 250 yards; but then the .22-250 took over from there.

Recently I've gone to the .22 Hornet. Love it, but recognize its wind and distance limitations.

Shucks, when I first started shooting centerfire stuff, I reloaded government brass in my .30-06 with Hornady 110-grain stuff and clobbered crows so far away that they spoiled before I could walk to them.

[P95Carry]

I guess with good shot placement the lil' .17 could deal with coyote size but ... have my reservations. I think squirrels, groundgogs etc are what I imagine a useful limit. Yet to experiment tho so could be talkin outa my butt! :p

camaroman .... it is a nice piece yeah ... and AFAIK .. production of the 99's has ceased now a little while. Many say that only the early 99's are worth a look .... and they are quite collectible, but this to me is still a fine rifle. Not one I would wish to sell on too quickly.

[agalb]

If you are only going to get ONE varmint rifle- get a .243. It is the best and most versatile varmint cartridge available. If you will get 2, then add a .223 to the .243. With a .223 and a .243, the .22-250 becomes a useless cartridge. If you are going to be shooting Prairie Dogs, get the .223 before the .243.

[Art Eatman]

I've run handloads for varmints through the .223, 22-250, Swift, .243 and '06.

The .243 easily doubles as a deer rifle, staying mostly with neck shots. The 85-grain Sierra HPBT also works as a varmint bullet, being seriously ruinacious on coyotes. I like the 70-grain Hornady. Haven't yet tried the 55-grain bullets I recently bought.

I like the .22-250, but for me there's a sort of Zen thing about the old Swift. I got great results on feral cats with the old Sierra 52-grain HPBT, out to 350 yards or so...

While the 110-grain bullets are excellent in an '06 on most any varmint you go for, true red mist comes from using an 80-grain pistol bullet or the old flat-nose .32-20 bullets with a bunch of 3031. (Swage as necessary.) You're right at 4,000 ft/sec with these light bullets. :)

Art

[12-34hom]

243 or 6mm AI is an excellent overall choice.

12-34hom.

[SeanB]

:D All excellent calibres in their own field. You cant beat the 243 for
flexibility. Great in wind compared to 222/223/22.250 This works for me > Winchester trimmed cases. 70 grain ballistic tips. 39grain ADI ar2208 (called varget for US market) but fire form your cases at 36 grain. Federal match primers. Then just play with your seating depth.
When your confident in pursuing medium game, start all over again.
Make every purchase count and don't buy crap.
P95Carry's comments on Savage hit the nail on the head. Very underated rifle

Hope this helps. Good luck

[camaroman]

OK I have made my mind up to get a .243 and a .223..... maybe on down the road get a 22-250 if I find a good deal. :D For the .243 I am seriously thinking a Savage Model 11FL or Remington 740. I don't know what platform to go with for the .223 though. Maybe an AR15 type, or Savage Model 12FLV, maybe a Mini 14.??? What do you guys think?


Thanks for all the input!

[P95Carry]

Camaroman ..... looks like you are seeking a semi for the .223 option .... but will say that, whilst I play ''Mini-14'' games .. and enjoy!! ...... I got a very good condition Ruger M77 MkII in .223 ..... and love shooting that ... very compact and light rifle. (Oh - and .223 is just great to shoot in a Contender!!)

http://www.bedford.net/design/cb_gun2/m77-II_s.jpg

[kudu]

camaroman,

You may want to look into a heavier gun for the .243 if you primarily are gonna varmint hunt. A light contour barrel is great for carrying around and is usualy accurate, but a varmint contour will really help when your trying to steady yourself for a 400yd shot. Also after a lot of shots it's barrel will not get hot as fast as a slim barrel and the extra weight will cut down on recoil.

[camaroman]

Kudu: good point I am glad you brought that up! Any suggestions for a lefty friendly .243? What rifles do you have?



P95Carry: Great looking Ruger! How accurate would you say your Mini 14 is? What else do you have in your asenal?

[Browny]

220 Swift for me boys.I just love this rifle with 55 gr.nosler b.tips.

[FirstFreedom]

I ainno expert by any stretch, but, if I was going to get a dedicated varminter gun, for long range (200-400 yds, let's say), then I'd get something in .243 Win. (and I plan to at some point). Then I'd use the .17 HMR for short-ranges/smallish critters, out to 175-200, let's say. These are cheap - I got my Marlin in .17 HMR for 179 plus tax new. I have a .270 I can load up for long range varmints in the meantime, til I get my .243. The .204 ruger looks interesting, but 'round here it's so windy that I don't see much use for it (by the time the flat trajectory of the .204 pays off, the wind has drifted it significantly). The .25-06 is a great cartridge, and would and does certainly work for a long-range varminter, but being a big case with lots of powder, it beats up your shoulder more and uses more powder, etc. The .22-250 or .22 WSM are also good choices, too, but as some have said, the bullet from these is also blown further off due to wind past 250-300 yards than you'd like (more than you can *easily* adequately correct for using kentucky windage, especially in shifting winds), so the .243 seems about perfect for a dedicated longrange varminter. You're also gonna get longer barrel life from a .243 than a .22-250, IINM. .223 Rem great choice for short to intermediate range, but maybe notsomuch for long-range - same reason - wind drift.