You're gonna laugh... mixed some powder.

SamNavy · March 25, 2015, 10:34 PM

So... pictures speak for themselves. I broke a cardinal rule when a buddy came over and I got busy talking... brought out a bottle Benchmark to look at the label and then set it down next to the scale where I'm weighing out H355. When I got done and emptied the dispenser, dumped about 1/2lb of H335 into a FULL bottle of Benchmark.

Lesson learned... ONLY ONE BOTTLE OF POWDER ON THE TABLE AT A TIME!

I know it's only about $40, and I could just do a spoonful every night with a pair of tweezers and be done in a year... my pennance. But these 2 powders are so completely different in size, shape, and color, that I think there's gotta be an easier way to mechanically separate them. Sifting, sieve, sluice box, filter...??? I'm all ears if you have any ideas.

nemesiss45 · March 25, 2015, 10:47 PM

Well, if you get a screen just the right size you could separate them..... but ill bet you time and money into it would be worth more than the $40 can of powder.

Sevens · March 25, 2015, 10:50 PM

Absolutely the best idea to dump them in the yard. Maybe keep a small clear container of the mixed product at eye level for an every day reminder of what you did.

You failed on a big one when you did it, but you succeeded on a bigger one when you caught the error. Take the hit to the wallet and consider it a well-learned lesson.

jdscholer · March 25, 2015, 10:58 PM

That blows man. I'm about as bad a tight-wad as you'll find, but I'd probably just cut my losses on that one. Two of my favorite powders too.

jd

McCarthy · March 25, 2015, 11:00 PM

If I'd be around I'd pick it up and do some testing.. just for funsies.

snakeye · March 25, 2015, 11:05 PM

Buy tomato plants....plant tomatoes.....sprinkle gunpowder a little bit each each week....harvest tomatoes grill hamburgers.....put tomatoes on hamburgers...grab beer....eat hamburger....save money by not buying takeout....gets some of your money back...

Lost Sheep · March 25, 2015, 11:29 PM

Are the lesser chemicals in gunpowder safe to eat? The nitrogen is GREAT for pushing plant growth, but I would be inclined to fertilize decorative plants, give the flowers to a sweetheart to induce a free meal.

Depending on your S.O., gastrically safer.

Lost Sheep

FrankenMauser · March 26, 2015, 07:45 AM

Do NOT dump it in your yard, or dispose of it in any way other than a controlled burn. Smokeless powder are considered hazardous waste, when it comes to disposal.

Nitrocellulose powders have several chemicals in them that are very harmful to aquatic species, and aren't too great for humans.
Whether the chemicals end up as runoff that makes its way into a stream, lake, or river; or leech into the groundwater; or end up in your food; the outcome is not ideal.

To dispose of it, burn it. If you don't want to do it yourself, contact your local fire department. They may even include the powder in a training burn, so that the firefighters will have some experience with what it's like when a can of smokeless powder melts and ignites.

The ONLY legal and environmentally friendly method for disposal of smokeless powder is through a controlled burn.
If you don't believe me and want to confirm for yourself, contact the EPA or consult Hodgdon's MSDSs for those powders.

SamNavy · March 26, 2015, 09:54 AM

Frank, I gotcha... controlled burn if I don't succeed.

On the way home today, I'm gonna stop by my local good-luck place of Zen and mystery... the Asian grocery store. It's actually an Asian grocery warehouse. In addition to food-stuffs, they often have random aisles of intriguing items and devices that I've never seen or heard of before. This place has served me well in the past when I needed to Macguyver a solution to an unsolvable problem.

Plus I always buy a couple pounds of fresh shrimp.

Jim Watson · March 26, 2015, 10:08 AM

It can be done.
A friend mixed Varget extruded and AA2520 ball.
I still had connections at my old agency and was able to borrow some testing sieves. We found a mesh size that gave a clean separation and saved the powder. This was a lot more than a $40 oops, it was a pound of one in most of 8 pounds of the other, so it was worth the trouble.

**Unclenick** · March 26, 2015, 10:23 AM

You might try something as simple as putting the powder in a bowl and holding it against the top of your vibratory tumbler while it runs for a bit. The finer powder should tend to find its way to the bottom of the bowl so you can spoon off the top layer of coarser powder without more than a grain or two of the finer powder left in it (that won't be enough to hurt anything). Another approach might be to put a small pile of the mixed powder on a flat board and gradually tilting it up until the one that rolls off more easily does exactly that.

Longshot4 · March 26, 2015, 10:44 AM

Be wise try dumping it.

polyphemus · March 26, 2015, 11:07 AM

SAAMI gun powder safety recommendations:

Quote:

Never salvage powder from old cartridges and do not attempt to
blend salvaged powder with new powder or attempt to blend two
types of powder to make a “custom” blend. Don’t accumulate old
powder stocks.

You can take from there.

condor bravo · March 26, 2015, 12:17 PM

Check out the current thread "powder problem" for a safety issue before just lighting a quantity of powder if you intend to burn it. But if you haven't thoroughly mixed the powder, it seems to me you could first try salvaging most of the Benchmark by separating the H335 along with a cushion layer of Benchmark from the bulk of the Benchmark. You indicate you poured H335 into a 'full' can of Benchmark.

Road_Clam · March 26, 2015, 12:30 PM

Kudos to the o/p for quickly identifying this issue. I have learned to label the current powder in my powder dispenser with a piece of masking tape. I also do the same for my powder trickler . A couple occasions that I could not remember what kind of powder was in my trickler so I had to dump it for safety's sake. I work about 9 different powders so it's a chore keeping track.

mikld · March 26, 2015, 12:32 PM

My Daddy said he fed gunpowder to Ol' General, his yard dog he kept in his junk yard. He mixed it in with his canned food to make General mean...

SamNavy · March 26, 2015, 02:10 PM

Condor- the H335 is so fine that as I was moving the bottle around, a bunch of it sifted down in between the larger grains of Benchmark and was thoroughly mixed very quickly. I thought about cutting the bottle in half and just letting the H335 fall out with the majority of the Benchmark still in the bottom. Unfortunately I thought about this way to late.

Road- I've been reloading for about 3 years now and this is my first major screwup with safety. I knew better than to set that bottle down instead of putting it back in the cabinet... and it bit me. I realized it only because the Benchmark bottle had a full pound in it, and the H335 filled it to the top. If that bottle of Benchmark had been 1/2 full, I might never have noticed. Hopefully I would have noticed the next time I went to use the stuff, but it highlights the need for being religious about the safety rules.

FrankenMauser · March 26, 2015, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Frank, I gotcha... controlled burn if I don't succeed.

Sorry, if I came across as giving you an ultimatum. That wasn't the intent.
The comment was directed at everyone.

The "dump it on your lawn" comments come up quite often, and it really irritates me. It's haz-mat, and needs to be treated as such.

We wouldn't advocate for people to break the law by making illegal machine guns, so why should we advocate for the illegal disposal of hazardous materials? - Smokeless powder in this case.

Sevens, you should know better! [finger wag]

Sevens · March 26, 2015, 03:07 PM

I suppose I should know better...?!
But until your post... truly, I did not.

(hangs head)
"You do that, you go to the box, y'know. Two minutes, by yourself... y'know and you feel shame... y'know.

And then you get free."

Nick_C_S · March 26, 2015, 03:52 PM

Yep. Only one bottle of powder at the load bench at a time.

My powder is in the house, upstairs. My load bench is in the garage. There has been a time or two when I brought down a second powder before I put away the first - the bottle was still on the bench and powder in the hopper. I take the second powder back upstairs; go back to the garage, unload the hopper, take the first powder upstairs; THEN bring the second powder back to the bench in the garage. I could just set down the second powder, but no. No exceptions - a second bottle of powder never touches the bench. Not a lecture. Just giving a feel for how adamant I am about this rule. It's important.

flashhole · March 26, 2015, 06:02 PM

Tweezers and a magnifying glass and a 6-pack.

Smoke & Recoil · March 26, 2015, 06:21 PM

SamNavy..........you qualify here

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=559475

mikld · March 27, 2015, 11:44 AM

I've been doing this lately. Dump powder when starting, leave bottle in place, refill bottle when I'm done. Can't remember when or why I started, but there's no way I'm gonna mix up my powders...

849ACSO · March 27, 2015, 12:09 PM

I just did this last week with BLC-2 and Varget (see a few threads back "powder problem"). First time I have EVER done this. I still have not thrown it in the garden, as I'm looking at the can trying to decide whether or not I want to venture off into the task of trying to separate it. BLC-2 is fine ball and Varget is stick so I think it COULD be done, just not totally convinced it I should be the one trying it. Post what you decide to do. Maybe I will follow the "mob mentality" if you try it and your gun still works after..........

SamNavy · March 27, 2015, 12:19 PM

Sat down last night and did some experimenting with vibration and shaking on various surfaces.

I have noticed that the H335 (small flake) is so light that it "sticks" to just about everything. The Benchmark (stick) is larger and heavier and tumbles or rolls pretty easy.

In 2 hours I think I managed to separate about 40gr's of Benchmark out of the mix. 6960 grains to go.

March 25, 2015, 10:50 PM	#3
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,775	Absolutely the best idea to dump them in the yard. Maybe keep a small clear container of the mixed product at eye level for an every day reminder of what you did. You failed on a big one when you did it, but you succeeded on a bigger one when you caught the error. Take the hit to the wallet and consider it a well-learned lesson. __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

March 25, 2015, 10:58 PM	#4
jdscholer Senior Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Location: Jefferson State Posts: 1,197	That blows man. I'm about as bad a tight-wad as you'll find, but I'd probably just cut my losses on that one. Two of my favorite powders too. jd __________________ "We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher

March 26, 2015, 07:45 AM	#8
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 26, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,774	Do NOT dump it in your yard, or dispose of it in any way other than a controlled burn. Smokeless powder are considered hazardous waste, when it comes to disposal. Nitrocellulose powders have several chemicals in them that are very harmful to aquatic species, and aren't too great for humans. Whether the chemicals end up as runoff that makes its way into a stream, lake, or river; or leech into the groundwater; or end up in your food; the outcome is not ideal. To dispose of it, burn it. If you don't want to do it yourself, contact your local fire department. They may even include the powder in a training burn, so that the firefighters will have some experience with what it's like when a can of smokeless powder melts and ignites. The ONLY legal and environmentally friendly method for disposal of smokeless powder is through a controlled burn. If you don't believe me and want to confirm for yourself, contact the EPA or consult Hodgdon's MSDSs for those powders. __________________ -Unwilling Range Officer -Unwilling Match Designer -NRL22/PRS22/PRO -Something about broccoli and carrots

March 26, 2015, 10:23 AM	#11
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,742	You might try something as simple as putting the powder in a bowl and holding it against the top of your vibratory tumbler while it runs for a bit. The finer powder should tend to find its way to the bottom of the bowl so you can spoon off the top layer of coarser powder without more than a grain or two of the finer powder left in it (that won't be enough to hurt anything). Another approach might be to put a small pile of the mixed powder on a flat board and gradually tilting it up until the one that rolls off more easily does exactly that. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

March 26, 2015, 12:17 PM	#14
condor bravo Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2014 Location: Nevada/Ariz/CA Posts: 1,753	Check out the current thread "powder problem" for a safety issue before just lighting a quantity of powder if you intend to burn it. But if you haven't thoroughly mixed the powder, it seems to me you could first try salvaging most of the Benchmark by separating the H335 along with a cushion layer of Benchmark from the bulk of the Benchmark. You indicate you poured H335 into a 'full' can of Benchmark. Last edited by condor bravo; March 26, 2015 at 12:26 PM.

March 25, 2015, 10:47 PM	#2
nemesiss45 Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2014 Posts: 526	Well, if you get a screen just the right size you could separate them..... but ill bet you time and money into it would be worth more than the $40 can of powder.

March 25, 2015, 11:00 PM	#5
McCarthy Junior member Join Date: January 1, 2015 Posts: 312	If I'd be around I'd pick it up and do some testing.. just for funsies.

March 25, 2015, 11:05 PM	#6
snakeye Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 2013 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 127	Buy tomato plants....plant tomatoes.....sprinkle gunpowder a little bit each each week....harvest tomatoes grill hamburgers.....put tomatoes on hamburgers...grab beer....eat hamburger....save money by not buying takeout....gets some of your money back...

March 25, 2015, 11:29 PM	#7
Lost Sheep Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2009 Location: Anchorage Alaska Posts: 3,341	Are the lesser chemicals in gunpowder safe to eat? The nitrogen is GREAT for pushing plant growth, but I would be inclined to fertilize decorative plants, give the flowers to a sweetheart to induce a free meal. Depending on your S.O., gastrically safer. Lost Sheep

March 26, 2015, 09:54 AM	#9
SamNavy Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2011 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 435	Frank, I gotcha... controlled burn if I don't succeed. On the way home today, I'm gonna stop by my local good-luck place of Zen and mystery... the Asian grocery store. It's actually an Asian grocery warehouse. In addition to food-stuffs, they often have random aisles of intriguing items and devices that I've never seen or heard of before. This place has served me well in the past when I needed to Macguyver a solution to an unsolvable problem. Plus I always buy a couple pounds of fresh shrimp.

March 26, 2015, 10:08 AM	#10
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 19,178	It can be done. A friend mixed Varget extruded and AA2520 ball. I still had connections at my old agency and was able to borrow some testing sieves. We found a mesh size that gave a clean separation and saved the powder. This was a lot more than a $40 oops, it was a pound of one in most of 8 pounds of the other, so it was worth the trouble.

March 26, 2015, 10:44 AM	#12
Longshot4 Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2014 Posts: 868	Be wise try dumping it.

March 26, 2015, 12:30 PM	#15
Road_Clam Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2013 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 1,719	Kudos to the o/p for quickly identifying this issue. I have learned to label the current powder in my powder dispenser with a piece of masking tape. I also do the same for my powder trickler . A couple occasions that I could not remember what kind of powder was in my trickler so I had to dump it for safety's sake. I work about 9 different powders so it's a chore keeping track. __________________ "To be old an wise you must have been young and stupid"

March 26, 2015, 12:32 PM	#16
mikld Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2009 Location: Southern Oregon! Posts: 2,891	My Daddy said he fed gunpowder to Ol' General, his yard dog he kept in his junk yard. He mixed it in with his canned food to make General mean...

March 26, 2015, 02:10 PM	#17
SamNavy Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2011 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 435	Condor- the H335 is so fine that as I was moving the bottle around, a bunch of it sifted down in between the larger grains of Benchmark and was thoroughly mixed very quickly. I thought about cutting the bottle in half and just letting the H335 fall out with the majority of the Benchmark still in the bottom. Unfortunately I thought about this way to late. Road- I've been reloading for about 3 years now and this is my first major screwup with safety. I knew better than to set that bottle down instead of putting it back in the cabinet... and it bit me. I realized it only because the Benchmark bottle had a full pound in it, and the H335 filled it to the top. If that bottle of Benchmark had been 1/2 full, I might never have noticed. Hopefully I would have noticed the next time I went to use the stuff, but it highlights the need for being religious about the safety rules.

March 26, 2015, 03:07 PM	#19
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,775	I suppose I should know better...?! But until your post... truly, I did not. (hangs head) "You do that, you go to the box, y'know. Two minutes, by yourself... y'know and you feel shame... y'know. And then you get free." __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

March 26, 2015, 03:52 PM	#20
Nick_C_S Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2013 Location: Idaho Posts: 5,618	Yep. Only one bottle of powder at the load bench at a time. My powder is in the house, upstairs. My load bench is in the garage. There has been a time or two when I brought down a second powder before I put away the first - the bottle was still on the bench and powder in the hopper. I take the second powder back upstairs; go back to the garage, unload the hopper, take the first powder upstairs; THEN bring the second powder back to the bench in the garage. I could just set down the second powder, but no. No exceptions - a second bottle of powder never touches the bench. Not a lecture. Just giving a feel for how adamant I am about this rule. It's important. __________________ Gun control laws benefit only criminals and politicians - but then, I repeat myself. Life Member, National Rifle Association

March 26, 2015, 06:02 PM	#21
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 2,000	Tweezers and a magnifying glass and a 6-pack. __________________ ,,, stupidity comes to some people very easily. 8/22/2017 my wife in a discussion about Liberals. Are you ready for civil war?

March 26, 2015, 06:21 PM	#22
Smoke & Recoil Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: East shore of Lake Michigan. Posts: 731	SamNavy..........you qualify here http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=559475 __________________ Sent from my Tandy 1000

March 27, 2015, 11:44 AM	#23
mikld Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2009 Location: Southern Oregon! Posts: 2,891	I've been doing this lately. Dump powder when starting, leave bottle in place, refill bottle when I'm done. Can't remember when or why I started, but there's no way I'm gonna mix up my powders... Last edited by mikld; July 27, 2016 at 01:23 PM.

March 27, 2015, 12:09 PM	#24
849ACSO Senior Member Join Date: September 21, 2014 Location: Somewhere in the middle Posts: 631	I just did this last week with BLC-2 and Varget (see a few threads back "powder problem"). First time I have EVER done this. I still have not thrown it in the garden, as I'm looking at the can trying to decide whether or not I want to venture off into the task of trying to separate it. BLC-2 is fine ball and Varget is stick so I think it COULD be done, just not totally convinced it I should be the one trying it. Post what you decide to do. Maybe I will follow the "mob mentality" if you try it and your gun still works after.......... __________________ "The day you stop learning SHOULD directly coincide with the day you stop breathing."

March 27, 2015, 12:19 PM	#25
SamNavy Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2011 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 435	Sat down last night and did some experimenting with vibration and shaking on various surfaces. I have noticed that the H335 (small flake) is so light that it "sticks" to just about everything. The Benchmark (stick) is larger and heavier and tumbles or rolls pretty easy. In 2 hours I think I managed to separate about 40gr's of Benchmark out of the mix. 6960 grains to go.