223 loads

azreloader · February 23, 2011, 04:13 PM

So I'm finally getting an AR15 and was looking for some good recipes in regards to what's the best powder, primer and rounds to get for reloading for a .223

DiscoRacing · February 23, 2011, 04:14 PM

Ramshot TAC@25grains with a 55grain bullet

Incognito · February 23, 2011, 04:23 PM

55g FMJBT (Berry's Bullets)
24.5g A2230
CCI 400 or 450 primers
Lake City, Winchester, FC brass
Seated to mid cannelure

jeepster11 · February 23, 2011, 04:38 PM

i loaded 55 grain fmj with
varget and cci400 primers
and 60 grain vmax
varget and cci 400 primers and they work great good luck

azreloader · February 23, 2011, 04:52 PM

great, thanks for the info, I'll be picking up some supplies later this week and hopfully do some reloading this weekend.

azreloader · February 23, 2011, 04:59 PM

what is the proper case length?

**Unclenick** · February 23, 2011, 05:28 PM

Maximum case length (ready to load; i.e., after sizing) is 1.760". Minimum for SAAMI spec is 1.740". Most aim right inbetween at 1.750".

Bear in mind that only the maximum is critical for avoiding high pressure by jamming the case mouth into the throat. The minimum is just there to give bullet makers a range for locating crimp cannelures for where they think their bullet is best seated. Gas gun match shooters sometimes trim 15 or 20 thousandths shorter just so they won't have to trim again in the lifetime of the cases, which are often retired after half a dozen reloads in gas guns. That's OK if you don't use a crimp.

Bottom line: The maximum length is a critical dimension limit, while minimum is a soft dimension limit you can flex some to suit your own needs. Use 1.750" if you want to stay factory spec or to crimp.

flashhole · February 23, 2011, 05:29 PM

Do you have a reloading manual?

mikejonestkd · February 23, 2011, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Do you have a reloading manual?

Ditto!!! Get a few manuals to cross reference suggested loads for the .223.

I suggest getting Lee Modern Reloading, Lyman 49th, as well as the ABCs of reloading to get started.

Personally, I like H335 and H4895 behind a 55 gr FMJ for plinking loads for an AR

flashhole · February 23, 2011, 06:48 PM

I wasn't thinking about load development when I posted the question. I have never seen a manual (not the booklets) that didn't provide case data. Not trying to poke at the OP but his question indicated to me that he hadn't read a manual. It's much better (read safer) to do some reading prior to starting loading.

Jim243 · February 23, 2011, 09:48 PM

It doesn't hurt and often helps to have the manuals.

Bullets = Hornady V-Max 55 grain #22271
Powder = Hodgdon 335 or H4895 or IMR 8208 XBR (hot)
Primers = Winchester Small Rifle or CCI Small Rifle
Cases = ?????? I like Winchester others don't. Your choice.

That'll Do · February 24, 2011, 11:17 AM

I'm new to ARs (just bought my first one a month ago, a Colt LE6920), but I can safely say that there are a lot of loads that will work well.

So far, I've tried a 55gr FMJ over 25.0gr of H-335, with a Remington 7 1/2 SR Benchrest primer. I'm using that load just to get familiar with my weapon.

I intend to shoot heavier bullets (68/69gr and 75/77gr) primarily, as they offer more stability at greater distances.

Some powders I've seen mentioned frequently are Varget, Ramshot TAC, Accurate 2230, H-335, H-4895 and W-748.

**Unclenick** · February 24, 2011, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That'll Do

I intend to shoot heavier bullets (68/69gr and 75/77gr) primarily, as they offer more stability at greater distances.

Actually, for a given nose and base shape, construction type and velocity, heavier bullets are less stable. This is mainly because they are longer. That gives air resistance a longer lever arm for trying to overturn them in flight. What they do have that's more desirable are higher ballistic coefficients (BC's) than their lighter, same-shape counterparts. A higher BC means, at a given velocity, a bullet will be less affected by the influence of wind and other atmospheric irregularities at long ranges. Provided you have enough twist to stabilize a longer, higher BC bullet, they will normally be easier to stay on target with at long range. Just don't count on them necessarily being more accurate at short range. They can be, but don't have to.

That'll Do · March 2, 2011, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UncleNick

Actually, for a given nose and base shape, construction type and velocity, heavier bullets are less stable. This is mainly because they are longer. That gives air resistance a longer lever arm for trying to overturn them in flight. What they do have that's more desirable are higher ballistic coefficients (BC's) than their lighter, same-shape counterparts. A higher BC means, at a given velocity, a bullet will be less affected by the influence of wind and other atmospheric irregularities at long ranges. Provided you have enough twist to stabilize a longer, higher BC bullet, they will normally be easier to stay on target with at long range. Just don't count on them necessarily being more accurate at short range. They can be, but don't have to.

My reasoning for using heavy bullets was poorly worded. By "more stable", I was referring to the heavier bullets' "wind-bucking" ability. Sorry for the confusion.

**Unclenick** · March 3, 2011, 11:52 AM

Gotcha.

FYI, for any given nose and base shape (the length of the cylindrical bearing surface between the nose and base don't affect the aerodynamic form factor much), the higher the sectional density, the more work atmospheric drag has to do to slow the bullet down or push it to the side. That's why higher sectional density is related directly to higher BC (by that aerodynamic form factor). A number that is proportional to the effect of drag on a bullet is the difference between the time the bullet would take to get to the target if it stayed at muzzle velocity (as it would in a vacuum; hence, zero drag) and the time it takes to get to the target flying through air. Most ballistics programs will give you that number. Of course, they mostly will also just give you the windage and drop directly.

billnourse · March 3, 2011, 10:50 PM

I am using Benchmark for all bullet weights.

40 grn V-Max 27.3 grns.
55 grn Nosler BT 25.5 grns.
68/69 grn Sierra/Hornady 23.3 grns.

These loads are at or near max. and should be approached as such, but all loads shoot into 1/2" at 100 yards out of a RRA Predator Persuit with a 1:8 twist.

Bill

Dave R · March 5, 2011, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Ramshot TAC@25grains with a 55grain bullet

Over at AR15.com, that's a popular load. So's 25 gr. of H335 under a 55gr. bullet.

chris in va · March 5, 2011, 01:33 AM

What do you guys think about IMR 4895? Would be nice to load both 223 and Garand 30-06 with the same powder.

m&p45acp10+1 · March 5, 2011, 08:36 AM

I have realy good results with H-335 for 55 grain bullets. For the 68/69 grain loads Acurate Arms 2015, and Varget have performed well with Hornady 68 grain HPBT Match, and Siera 69 grain HPBT Match Kings. Though at 100 yards the differance in bullets is unnoticable with my shooting. So I stick to the Hornady's due to them being cheaper. Note the Hornady bullets are a bit longer than the Siera Match Kings.

Working up loads with Reloader 15 today if I have good results with them I will post them.

PawPaw · March 5, 2011, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris in va

What do you guys think about IMR 4895? Would be nice to load both 223 and Garand 30-06 with the same powder.

My current .223 varmint load uses IMR4895 and the 55 grain Hornady V-Max. It gives great accuracy from my rifle. I haven't tried this load in an AR platform but I see no reason why it wouldn't work.

CrustyFN · March 5, 2011, 09:29 AM

Quote:

I intend to shoot heavier bullets (68/69gr and 75/77gr) primarily, as they offer more stability at greater distances.

Providing you have enough twist to stabilize the bullet. A 1:9 twist barrel won't do as well with bullets over 69 grains as a 1:7 twist barrel.

**Unclenick** · March 5, 2011, 11:05 AM

IMR 4895 does quite well with heavier bullets, like the 80 grain match bullets, but is inefficient with light ones. With a 55 grain bullet you can get the same velocity at only 5% higher peak pressure using almost 20% less IMR 4198 by weight. That translates to less muzzle blast, which is usually helpful to accuracy. 4895 is well known for shooting better at lower pressures than most rifle powders can, though, so YMMV if you don't mind the waste. IMR 4198 is a very good accuracy powder in both .222 and .223 Remington.

Believe it or not, a 1:9 twist is actually close to ideal for the 0.9" long 69 grain Sierra MatchKings, producing a calculated (Don Miller's formula) gyroscopic stability factor of 1.6 at 2500 fps MV. That's right in the range of 1.4 to 1.7 usually cited as optimal for highest accuracy. This is under Army standard meteorological conditions, and in very cold weather, the stability will be decreased by the more dense air.

Clark · March 6, 2011, 01:54 PM

If I were to load up ammo for my AR15s, I would use 55 gr Vmax and H335 or IMR4895.

Those have given me the best groups.

m&p45acp10+1 · March 6, 2011, 10:34 PM

Did some confirmation testing with 68 grain Hornady Match using Reloader 15 today. 23.3 ti 23.9 grains in mixed headstamp brass. Shot well into the sub quarter MOA shootin with a front bipod and a sand bag under the rear of the stock. I have also had real good results with Varget, and AA2015 with the heavier bullets.

For the 55 grainers I heavily reomend H-335. I run a harge of 25.0 grains with both FMJBT and V-Max. The load is way more acurate than I can hold.

grumpa72 · March 7, 2011, 06:18 AM

The one common comment that I read when anyone asks for reload data on 9mm, .45 acp, 30.06 Garand, .223 etc is to take the recipes and load data with a cautious eye until it has been verified with a printed manual. In two case on the Garand forums, recipes were provided that grossly exceeded manufacturers recommendations.

February 23, 2011, 04:13 PM	#1
azreloader Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2010 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 5	223 loads So I'm finally getting an AR15 and was looking for some good recipes in regards to what's the best powder, primer and rounds to get for reloading for a .223

February 23, 2011, 04:23 PM	#3
Incognito Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2008 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 366	Don't know about it being the best, but it works good. 55g FMJBT (Berry's Bullets) 24.5g A2230 CCI 400 or 450 primers Lake City, Winchester, FC brass Seated to mid cannelure

February 23, 2011, 04:38 PM	#4
jeepster11 Senior Member Join Date: July 3, 2008 Location: fairborn ohio Posts: 175	223 i loaded 55 grain fmj with varget and cci400 primers and 60 grain vmax varget and cci 400 primers and they work great good luck

February 23, 2011, 04:59 PM	#6
azreloader Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2010 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 5	.223 case what is the proper case length?

February 23, 2011, 05:28 PM	#7
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 10,178	Maximum case length (ready to load; i.e., after sizing) is 1.760". Minimum for SAAMI spec is 1.740". Most aim right inbetween at 1.750". Bear in mind that only the maximum is critical for avoiding high pressure by jamming the case mouth into the throat. The minimum is just there to give bullet makers a range for locating crimp cannelures for where they think their bullet is best seated. Gas gun match shooters sometimes trim 15 or 20 thousandths shorter just so they won't have to trim again in the lifetime of the cases, which are often retired after half a dozen reloads in gas guns. That's OK if you don't use a crimp. Bottom line: The maximum length is a critical dimension limit, while minimum is a soft dimension limit you can flex some to suit your own needs. Use 1.750" if you want to stay factory spec or to crimp. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Patron Member

February 23, 2011, 04:14 PM	#2
DiscoRacing Senior Member Join Date: December 19, 2008 Location: milton, wv Posts: 3,640	Ramshot TAC@25grains with a 55grain bullet __________________ Desert Eagle Alliance Group Launcher Extraordinaire ______ ----Get Busy Live'n.....Or....Get Busy Die'n......Red -------They call me Dr. Bob,,,, I have a PhD in S&W

February 23, 2011, 04:52 PM	#5
azreloader Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2010 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 5	great, thanks for the info, I'll be picking up some supplies later this week and hopfully do some reloading this weekend.

February 23, 2011, 05:29 PM	#8
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 1,286	Do you have a reloading manual? __________________ Gun control is hitting what you aim at..

February 23, 2011, 06:48 PM	#10
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 1,286	I wasn't thinking about load development when I posted the question. I have never seen a manual (not the booklets) that didn't provide case data. Not trying to poke at the OP but his question indicated to me that he hadn't read a manual. It's much better (read safer) to do some reading prior to starting loading. __________________ Gun control is hitting what you aim at..

February 23, 2011, 09:48 PM	#11
Jim243 Senior Member Join Date: January 5, 2009 Posts: 4,307	It doesn't hurt and often helps to have the manuals. Bullets = Hornady V-Max 55 grain #22271 Powder = Hodgdon 335 or H4895 or IMR 8208 XBR (hot) Primers = Winchester Small Rifle or CCI Small Rifle Cases = ?????? I like Winchester others don't. Your choice. __________________ Si vis pacem, para bellum

February 24, 2011, 11:17 AM	#12
That'll Do Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2008 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 547	I'm new to ARs (just bought my first one a month ago, a Colt LE6920), but I can safely say that there are a lot of loads that will work well. So far, I've tried a 55gr FMJ over 25.0gr of H-335, with a Remington 7 1/2 SR Benchrest primer. I'm using that load just to get familiar with my weapon. I intend to shoot heavier bullets (68/69gr and 75/77gr) primarily, as they offer more stability at greater distances. Some powders I've seen mentioned frequently are Varget, Ramshot TAC, Accurate 2230, H-335, H-4895 and W-748.

March 3, 2011, 11:52 AM	#15
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 10,178	Gotcha. FYI, for any given nose and base shape (the length of the cylindrical bearing surface between the nose and base don't affect the aerodynamic form factor much), the higher the sectional density, the more work atmospheric drag has to do to slow the bullet down or push it to the side. That's why higher sectional density is related directly to higher BC (by that aerodynamic form factor). A number that is proportional to the effect of drag on a bullet is the difference between the time the bullet would take to get to the target if it stayed at muzzle velocity (as it would in a vacuum; hence, zero drag) and the time it takes to get to the target flying through air. Most ballistics programs will give you that number. Of course, they mostly will also just give you the windage and drop directly. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Patron Member

March 3, 2011, 10:50 PM	#16
billnourse Senior Member Join Date: September 16, 2010 Location: Bloomfield, NM Posts: 366	I am using Benchmark for all bullet weights. 40 grn V-Max 27.3 grns. 55 grn Nosler BT 25.5 grns. 68/69 grn Sierra/Hornady 23.3 grns. These loads are at or near max. and should be approached as such, but all loads shoot into 1/2" at 100 yards out of a RRA Predator Persuit with a 1:8 twist. Bill __________________ Cooper 52 25/06, Cooper 52 30/06, Cooper 52 338/06Cooper 57 .17HMR, Remington VS .22/250 all left handed. Rock River Predator Persuit AR-15, 1952 Marlin 336 in 30/30. 2 Kimber 1911, Colt 1911, S&W .357 Mag, Kahr .40 and .380

March 5, 2011, 01:33 AM	#18
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 12,482	What do you guys think about IMR 4895? Would be nice to load both 223 and Garand 30-06 with the same powder.

March 5, 2011, 08:36 AM	#19
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,307	I have realy good results with H-335 for 55 grain bullets. For the 68/69 grain loads Acurate Arms 2015, and Varget have performed well with Hornady 68 grain HPBT Match, and Siera 69 grain HPBT Match Kings. Though at 100 yards the differance in bullets is unnoticable with my shooting. So I stick to the Hornady's due to them being cheaper. Note the Hornady bullets are a bit longer than the Siera Match Kings. Working up loads with Reloader 15 today if I have good results with them I will post them. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

March 5, 2011, 11:05 AM	#22
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 10,178	IMR 4895 does quite well with heavier bullets, like the 80 grain match bullets, but is inefficient with light ones. With a 55 grain bullet you can get the same velocity at only 5% higher peak pressure using almost 20% less IMR 4198 by weight. That translates to less muzzle blast, which is usually helpful to accuracy. 4895 is well known for shooting better at lower pressures than most rifle powders can, though, so YMMV if you don't mind the waste. IMR 4198 is a very good accuracy powder in both .222 and .223 Remington. Believe it or not, a 1:9 twist is actually close to ideal for the 0.9" long 69 grain Sierra MatchKings, producing a calculated (Don Miller's formula) gyroscopic stability factor of 1.6 at 2500 fps MV. That's right in the range of 1.4 to 1.7 usually cited as optimal for highest accuracy. This is under Army standard meteorological conditions, and in very cold weather, the stability will be decreased by the more dense air. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Patron Member Last edited by Unclenick; March 8, 2011 at 12:26 PM.

March 6, 2011, 01:54 PM	#23
Clark Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 1999 Location: WA, the ever blue state Posts: 2,780	If I were to load up ammo for my AR15s, I would use 55 gr Vmax and H335 or IMR4895. Those have given me the best groups.

March 6, 2011, 10:34 PM	#24
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,307	Did some confirmation testing with 68 grain Hornady Match using Reloader 15 today. 23.3 ti 23.9 grains in mixed headstamp brass. Shot well into the sub quarter MOA shootin with a front bipod and a sand bag under the rear of the stock. I have also had real good results with Varget, and AA2015 with the heavier bullets. For the 55 grainers I heavily reomend H-335. I run a harge of 25.0 grains with both FMJBT and V-Max. The load is way more acurate than I can hold. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

March 7, 2011, 06:18 AM	#25
grumpa72 Senior Member Join Date: April 5, 2009 Posts: 459	The one common comment that I read when anyone asks for reload data on 9mm, .45 acp, 30.06 Garand, .223 etc is to take the recipes and load data with a cautious eye until it has been verified with a printed manual. In two case on the Garand forums, recipes were provided that grossly exceeded manufacturers recommendations.