Ragged not clean holes with 45 SWC

StrawDog · April 9, 2010, 10:57 AM

I'd expected to get cleaner holes than I do. I'm loading Rainier 200g plated SWC with several different amounts of Bullseye, 4.0, 4.2, and 4.4. The length was constant 1.25". I could increase this roughly 0.10 to 0.15" and still chamber ok. Might be a gun issue but the same gun with 185g JHP with 4.2g of Bullseye produces clean holes. The gun is a stock Ed Brown except I've changed the fire-pin-retaining-plate for a squared one to delay opening and improve recoil. Any ideas? Thanks

**Unclenick** · April 9, 2010, 11:17 AM

In the 25 yard test targets below, fired right after my Goldcup fit up in '85 (the '86 note is just about bullet weight deviation). The ragged holes are cut by a Hornady 200 grain jacketed SWC over 4.2 grains of Bullseye, while the sharp holes are made by 200 grain hard cast SWC's over just 3.8 grains of Bullseye. The difference in the holes is partly due to how sharp the leading edge of the bullet bearing surface is. The jacket forming dies have to be radiused at the edges a little to get the bullets out of the forming die cleanly. I am guessing the copper plating has left the leading edges of the Ranier bullets may be less than sharp.

The other factor is the tagboard the target is printed on. Some grades of target paper break more easily than others.

zippy13 · April 9, 2010, 11:39 AM

I suspect it's a velocity issue: Your 185 gr JHPs are going to be at around 700 fps with 4.2 gr of Bullseye(BE) while you're running the 200 gr Rainiers around 800. The lighter 185's don't burn BE as efficiently as the 200's do. You're getting cleaner holes with your 185s because they are going a lot slower. An old Lyman recipe recommends a light load of 3.5 gr of BE for 200 gr LSWC's. You could try loading a few 200's with 3.5 and some with 3.7 gr.

FYI: I run 3.5 gr under my home cast 200's and get good accuracy at 15-25 yards and clean(er) holes. (They aren't much at 50 yards and may not cycle all 1911-type pistols.) And, you can load 2,000 per pound of BE.

Aldadentist · April 9, 2010, 02:19 PM

Unclenick has it right on. I shoot many different types of 200 gr SWC through my 45, including the plated bullets. The plated bullets have a more rounded shoulder and will not give as clean a hole as other types. Also if you use tag paper targets with a wood backer with a hole cut for the 7-10 ring that will give more rigidity to the target and you will get cleaner hole.

April 9, 2010, 10:57 AM	#1
StrawDog Senior Member Join Date: June 27, 2005 Posts: 168	Ragged not clean holes with 45 SWC I'd expected to get cleaner holes than I do. I'm loading Rainier 200g plated SWC with several different amounts of Bullseye, 4.0, 4.2, and 4.4. The length was constant 1.25". I could increase this roughly 0.10 to 0.15" and still chamber ok. Might be a gun issue but the same gun with 185g JHP with 4.2g of Bullseye produces clean holes. The gun is a stock Ed Brown except I've changed the fire-pin-retaining-plate for a squared one to delay opening and improve recoil. Any ideas? Thanks

April 9, 2010, 11:17 AM	#2
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,131	In the 25 yard test targets below, fired right after my Goldcup fit up in '85 (the '86 note is just about bullet weight deviation). The ragged holes are cut by a Hornady 200 grain jacketed SWC over 4.2 grains of Bullseye, while the sharp holes are made by 200 grain hard cast SWC's over just 3.8 grains of Bullseye. The difference in the holes is partly due to how sharp the leading edge of the bullet bearing surface is. The jacket forming dies have to be radiused at the edges a little to get the bullets out of the forming die cleanly. I am guessing the copper plating has left the leading edges of the Ranier bullets may be less than sharp. The other factor is the tagboard the target is printed on. Some grades of target paper break more easily than others. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

April 9, 2010, 11:39 AM	#3
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	I suspect it's a velocity issue: Your 185 gr JHPs are going to be at around 700 fps with 4.2 gr of Bullseye(BE) while you're running the 200 gr Rainiers around 800. The lighter 185's don't burn BE as efficiently as the 200's do. You're getting cleaner holes with your 185s because they are going a lot slower. An old Lyman recipe recommends a light load of 3.5 gr of BE for 200 gr LSWC's. You could try loading a few 200's with 3.5 and some with 3.7 gr. FYI: I run 3.5 gr under my home cast 200's and get good accuracy at 15-25 yards and clean(er) holes. (They aren't much at 50 yards and may not cycle all 1911-type pistols.) And, you can load 2,000 per pound of BE.

April 9, 2010, 02:19 PM	#4
Aldadentist Member Join Date: February 18, 2009 Location: Seattle Posts: 58	Unclenick has it right on. I shoot many different types of 200 gr SWC through my 45, including the plated bullets. The plated bullets have a more rounded shoulder and will not give as clean a hole as other types. Also if you use tag paper targets with a wood backer with a hole cut for the 7-10 ring that will give more rigidity to the target and you will get cleaner hole.