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Old December 23, 2016, 01:51 PM   #1
Wendyj
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Hunting Predators information needed.

I've had some deer cams out in some woody area and starting to see coyote and bobcat. I've only shot one coyote in my life that run a bunch of deer off that had a nice buck coming behind them. This was all open field hunting.
I would like to do some predator hunting just for fun and fur. Would anyone be able to help with a cheap electronic caller that isn't junk. What kind of decoy. Ect. I am sure that the 22 I have would probably work in the woods due to shots no more than 50-60 yards and I know every mark in my scope out to 200 yards. I've got an AR but would buy a cheaper bolt action 223 if I like the hunting. Mine would have to be day or late evenings or mornings. I'm seeing coyotes from 4 am to around 7am and again at 5 pm to 8pm in the evening. The bobcats only at late nights around 3 am. Have never hunted the cats so not sure if calls and decoys would pull one out in the day. Anyone got advice for a new predator Hunter.
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Old December 23, 2016, 03:14 PM   #2
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Back 30 years ago I earned about 40% of my living shooting fur. in a 5 month period I killed enough fur to pay in full, cash money for a Toyota Land Cruiser.

In my opinion if you shoot for money and if you are shooting at 125 yards and closer, the old 22 LR is the best bet. It does almost no hide damage at all, and it kills coyotes fine with 40 grain solids. At longer rangers I used a 22-250 (gave it up because it was too hard on fur) and a 222 Remington.

My 222 Rem has a 22" barrel. I now use an AR15 with a 16" barrel with a 1-9 twist. Shooting 55 grain bullets from the 22" 222 and from the 16" 223 you have exactly the same thing on coyotes. Both bullet come from the barrels at about 3000 to 3100.

Bullet selection is critical for fur hunting. I used the Winchester 50 grain Power point soft point a lot. It can be shot at 3200 FPS from a 22" 222, but I got my best groups shooting it at about 3020FPS with H4198 and also H322. It was a bullet that balled up and always went clear through, but didn't blow a big exit hole.

I don't know what is available today. The 50 gr PP may still be.

Don't go for top speed. You don't have any need for it. Go for the best accuracy.

If you have an AR I'd advise putting a good trigger in it and mount s clear scope, and you may just have the best coyote gun ever made right now.

Gun store owners will hate me for what I just wrote, but it's the truth. You have what you should use already.

If you don't intend to use the fur or sell it, use your hunting rifle and get off-season practice.
Kill them with your deer rifle and deer ammo.
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Old December 23, 2016, 03:28 PM   #3
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Gun store owners will hate me for what I just wrote, but it's the truth. You have what you should use already.

If you don't intend to use the fur or sell it, use your hunting rifle and get off-season practice.
Kill them with your deer rifle and deer ammo.
"The best rifle is the one you have. Endeavor to shoot up to it."

I've had no problem selling coyotes I shot with my .270 ...... and most are taken at very short range. I try to hit them low in the chest.
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Old December 23, 2016, 03:52 PM   #4
Wendyj
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Where I'm seeing all action on trail cameras I couldn't shoot over a 100 yards with no leaves on the trees. In summer 55-60 at best. I've got a new trigger in my AR and a Vortex Strike Eagle 1x6 on it. I've got the 22 LR scoped with a 3x9x 44 Crossfire. Neither of them fancy but I may need the 1-2 lower powers to use the optics depending on distance. I use 40 copper plated mag tech bullets in the 22 and I reload 55 grain Hornady V Max for the AR. I rarely pull AR out of the safe but I do practice a lot of long range shooting with the 22 on good days with no wind or maybe 5 mph gusts just to keep up to par on shooting skills.
Will predators be likely to come in within 60-75 yards of me in a shooting blind? It's a horse farm so the pastures are out of the question with no backstops for bullets but wooded area is a hollow with high mountain ridges on both sides. A creek right through the middle and enough squirrels to drive you nuts. Good acorn year and they are everywhere. Fair amount of turkeys also. I've yet to see any bucks on camera yet but lots of younger does and fawns. I just got permission to hunt it a month ago.
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Old December 23, 2016, 04:49 PM   #5
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If you don't thin out the coyotes, fawn mortality will be high.
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Old December 23, 2016, 05:02 PM   #6
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Deer season over here Jan 1st. Going to be shooting critters.
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Old December 23, 2016, 06:51 PM   #7
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I've used an el cheapo WalMart "baby" boom box. Wounded rabbit cassette tape. Picked a place to sit where coyotes were pretty much pushed to come in from in front of me. Crosswind location.

First few seconds, a bit loud, then lower the volume to about what rabbit reality would be. I call for maybe half a minute, progressively getting weaker as though the rabbit is weakening. (Just guessing. : )) If no action, repeat.

In daylight and open country, I've seen coyotes head toward me from a half-mile away, responding to my Olk mouth call.

Used a mouth-blown call a lot. Imitate the cassette tape call.

Mostly called in late afternoon, in the last half-hour before sunset, as well as at night.

At night: When the light picks up eyes, don't keep the light shining directly on the critter. Use just enough of the edge of the beam for the eyes to show. I've used a red lens cover on a Q-Beam. Also, a wrap-around tube of cardboard so no backscatter of light gets into the scope when holding the light in front of it.

If Burnham Brothers tapes are still made, they're good.

Critters are fun. I was out deer hunting and was sitting on the ground, leaning against a tree. Saw movement at maybe twenty feet. Fox. I lip-squeaked like a mouse. He'd do the dart-stop routine as I squeaked. He finally got so close I boinked him in the nose with my boot toe. Amazing how his hair instantly turned him into a four-legged bottle brush. Tail hair stuck out liked he'd cold-nosed a light socket.
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Old December 23, 2016, 11:43 PM   #8
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Wendy the V-max is supposed to break up on impact. Any bullet that breaks up so well as to not exit is wonderful on hides, but if they do exit coyotes and foxes look like they were hit with anti-aircraft fire.

When I was shooting for money there were no V-max bullets. So I can't say how well they will work.
One bullet that is expensive but works very well without excessively large exits is the Barnes TSX in 70 grain weight, and also the 69 grain Sierra HP. Not the plastic tipped 69 grain but the HP. The Sierra is actually a target bullet, but I have had very good luck with them on fur bearers so far.

It's worth it to buy the higher end bullets if the fur is to be sold. And both those bullets will shoot well under MOA if you don't have a real bummer of a rifle, which is usually not the case.

I must admit, what experience I have with the 69 Gr Sierra is now 7 coyotes so far, (not lots) and I have only killed 2 with the Barnes when I was hunting with a friend and using those loads but he also killed 2 so that makes 4. (Also not lots) Of those 4 I have seen killed with them and I was impressed at how well they worked and yet didn't leave fist size exits like many of the standard SP and HP bullet do from the 223.

I have killed more coyotes than I can count with 22 lrs, 222 Remington and 22-250 as well as a few with 223s, but most of my coyote shooting was almost 30 years ago now, so many of the new bullets sold now I can not give 1st hand advise on.

The 70 Gr Barnes and the 69 Sierra I can give some. Not lots, but enough to feel that the recommendations are ok.
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Old December 24, 2016, 09:17 AM   #9
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You can get electronic calls for under $100 such as Foxpro or Icotec. They will come with some calls that will work for your needs. You can get a hand caller to supplement the electronic caller and do rabbit or fawn squeals with it. I find the hand callers to be really annoying and often best used with hearing protection being worn, LOL, but they work.

I like to set my electronic caller out about 50-75 yards. Some people run them much closer.

Not hunting from the same location all the time will be a benefit to you as well as changing positions. If you only have a small area to hunt and you do a lot of calling from the same spot (your blind), you are apt to get a few and then nothing as the coyotes figure out what is going on and that you have a kill site dangerous to them. In other words, you can overhunt your location for coyotes, not that you have killed too many, but that you are there trying to kill them too often.

A buddy of mine who competes in coyote kill contests says that they spend no more than about 10-15 minutes in a given location before moving to a new spot, sometimes only 80-100 yards away and trying again. That is more productive than staying in a single location.

Wigglers are surprisingly expensive for what they are. I don't have any good suggestions for you for the wiggler itself. Whatever you decide, you may need to be sure you can brace it in the field so that it doesn't fall over. Ground conditions, brush, etc. are such that sometimes it isn't a perfect setup for a wiggler to remains standing while functioning and a rock or tree branch to hold down the base may be necessary. This is a problem for some more than others.

Down here, a lot of guys hunt over previous kills, gut piles, etc. So if you kill a yote, coon, etc. or some pest species, use it for bait. Check your state and federal game laws (check with a game warden) to see if you can use roadkill for bait, such as opossums and such. Don't expect that they will let you collect deer for this purpose and they may tell you NO if you don't have a particular permit for the job.

I will say this, if you are going to being doing this often, then rechargeable batteries will save you money in the long run.

Play the wind appropriately. Note that many predators will circle around a wiggler or dead carcass, assessing the situation. If you are within the circle, you are apt to get busted when the coyote eventually becomes down wind of you. That is why I like my caller to be farther out and even then it isn't always enough. If you spot one and it is circling around, a quick lip squeak or two will usually get it to stop and you can take him then. Of course, that goes for if he is circling you or just coming in to the caller.

Of the bobcats I have called, all have really liked the distressed rabbit sounds best.
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Old December 24, 2016, 11:59 AM   #10
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The gun is the easy part. Either the AR (probably best choice) or the 22 (shot placement is more critical if you want to find them). The hard part is getting on them. There is a reason he was called Wylee, they are smart, they can smell you from miles away and they heard yoir truck shut off and you slam the door. Scent blocker is your friend being coyotes come in on the wind if they suspect something is up, like the smell of a human or a new wounded animal sound. They learn quick too, dont expect to go out and call one day, bag one then go out a few days later with the same spot with the same call. Mix it up. DO look for patterns as you have already done.

As far as calls Ive had far better luck with $10 reeds than I have with a $150 electronic call. I even got one to within 20' of me by making kissy noises, he made me and bolted though.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.
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Old December 24, 2016, 12:48 PM   #11
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All of it depends a great deal on Georgia's hunting regs. Electronic calls aren't legal everywhere. A .22 LR, while it'll do, might just wound if the shot placement is a tick off. Depends on Wiley's size too though. 40 pounds or so is typical up here. Dunno what he'd be there.
Full camouflage, face included, is the dress of the day too.
"...the V-max is..." It's a Varmint bullet that's designed to rapidly expand upon impact with no regard at all for the hide. An A-Max would be better.
"...liked the distressed rabbit sounds best..." Everything who feeds on 'em does. Wiley and everything else that feeds opportunistically will come to the sound of anything distressed.
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Old December 24, 2016, 01:29 PM   #12
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I use a mojo decoy and a flextone hand held call. Last time I had a chance to go, I used my .243. Now I have a .223 and will probably use that. Not finicky about ammo. Could care less about the fur.
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Old December 24, 2016, 06:33 PM   #13
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Double Naught Spy is dead on with his advice. 30 years ago I hunted for pelts. I had a blast, killed several hundred coyotes over a 3-4 year period, but I am sure I educated even more of them. What I learned is that they are extremely smart and adaptable, and won't fall for the simplistic tricks you often read about.

* Set up a wiggler using a large feather or a scrap of rabbit fur tied to a bush and let the wind move it for you. Too much movement is just as bad as not enough. It's not there to lure them in, it's just there to distract them from your movement

* Set up where there is a natural obstacle that will keep most of the coyotes from getting downwind from you. Back up against a cliff, river, or get farther away from your shooting area. Getting farther away is easier these days with remote controlled callers, you can set up 100 yds away and still call.

* Get an electronic call, but learn how to use it by watching actual kills in the field and understanding that rabbits don't squeal for 15 minutes, and they do not produce 130 decibels of volume. I used to use a mouth call, no more than 10 seconds of cottontail squeal, then shut up and sit still. As above, too much is worse than not enough. Trust me, coyotes can hear a mouse under a foot of snow, they can hear you calling.

* And learn to shoot! I saw more coyotes educated by poor shooting than anything else. I know, I know, your rifle shoots sub-MOA all the way out to 1000 yds. But can you? Your shots will not be off a bench at a stationary, unobstructed target. You will be laying or sitting in the snow taking the shot from field positions, and a lot of self-proclaimed expert shooters miss fairly easy shots under field conditions.

Oh, and have fun!
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Old December 26, 2016, 09:01 AM   #14
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If you have an AR I'd advise putting a good trigger in it and mount s clear scope, and you may just have the best coyote gun ever made right now.
I agree with the above.

I've been coyote calling a lot of years, I've use several different types of electronic calls with success, however lately around hear everybody and their brother has one and the coyotes are getting very educated to them, so I now rely more on mouth blown calls.

The electronic calls I have are, Johnny Stewart record player ( as I said I've been calling a lot of years), Johnny Stewart cassette player, Fox-Pro and Primos Turbo Dawg.
As for electronic calls goes the Johnny Stewart cassette got me the most coyotes but in all fairness I used it the longest amount of time.

I have several different calibers of rifles I use for coyote calling but I rely on my AR in 223 the most.
I load Sierra Blitz King 55 gr bullets around 3100 FPS so far I've not had any exit wounds but I've not shot any coyotes closer the 100yards, I get good one shot kills with this bullet.

I hunt daytime hours because in Missouri you can't use a light to hunt them at night, I hunt early morning to about 10:00am, evening 3:30pm till to dark to see good.

Good Luck in your coyote calling endeavors.

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