First revolver Bought! Colt Bill Davis 357 ??

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 03:19 PM

Okay so I have a few pistols but I wanted something different and unique and IMHO beautiful

I found a 6 inch 357 colt custom by Bill Davis . . . The tag said Colt Python on it

I picked it up and the trigger was like butter smooth and light with no hammer, Was a DAO type trigger the dealer said.

I dont know much about it but I can't wait to get the to range with it!

can anyone tell me some more about it ?
6 inch bull barrel
colt python ?
hammerless
SN# 662##

Thx

full
http://i44.tinypic.com/346ujnk.jpg

close up pony :
http://i42.tinypic.com/18kuur.jpg

full again :
http://i42.tinypic.com/34qw6eu.jpg

bull barrel
http://i40.tinypic.com/29nz607.jpg

Venom1956 · March 18, 2012, 03:29 PM

Could be a Python, Trooper or target match? There are several guns build on that frame. and after custom work like that someone who knows more can probably tell you.

Gdawgs · March 18, 2012, 03:34 PM

I don't know anything about it, but it looks pretty sweet. That's quite the barrel on that thing. And that front sight looks pretty interesting.

WC145 · March 18, 2012, 03:49 PM

It's a PPC gun and it does have a hammer, it's just been bobbed. If you call Colt with the serial number they can tell you what it was originally and the year it was made.

NoSecondBest · March 18, 2012, 04:39 PM

I had Bill Davis build two revolvers for me back in the 80's. He was/is probably the best revolversmith I've ever encountered. He did a Smith 27 and a Ruger Security Six for me at the same time. Each gun would shoot an inch at 50 yds off a rest with max loads. His trigger work was unequaled. I don't know if he's still active. Frank Pachmayr reccommended him to me and it was probably the best reccommendation I've ever gotten for gunsmith customization work.

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 04:46 PM

oops yea I meant to say bobbed or trimmed no thumb part.

I really hope its a python as I've always wanted one but this was the first that was in my price range.

the sights are an Aristocrat "rib"

MrBorland · March 18, 2012, 04:49 PM

Nice gun. I have a Bill Davis S&W, also with the 6" heavy barrel & sight rib.

As WC145 mentioned, it's a PPC gun, and Davis was the PPC builder when PPC was the game. It ought to lock up like a bank vault and be a sweet shooter.

Note, though, that this is not a general-purpose gun, but specifically built as a target gun tuned for (148gr wadcutter) .38spl target loads, so it's unnecessary, perhaps unwise to shoot .357mags through it. If it started life as a .38spl, and you may not be able to even load the longer .357s.

theyallhurt · March 18, 2012, 04:53 PM

WOW...Experiencing a little jealousy here!

MrBorland · March 18, 2012, 04:55 PM

Quote:

I really hope its a python as I've always wanted one

It's unlikely to be a Python. The base guns for these builds seem to be basic fixed-sighted .38spls, as there was little need for anything more. Mine was built on a very basic S&W model 10, for instance. Still, they were built for customers, so it's possible someone started with a Python donor.

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 05:01 PM

the dealer listed it as a 357 colt python

any way to check if its a 38 special or a 357 mag ?

as for ammo: Crap I just had it loaded with 357 Mag 125 gr FTX® Critical Defense in my night stand (locked of course)

MrBorland · March 18, 2012, 06:06 PM

Quote:

the dealer listed it as a 357 colt python

As stated, it could have started as a Python. But it's value is as a Bill Davis PPC revolver, not as a Python. I'd have bought it if I were looking for a PPC revolver, but wouldn't have paid any extra for it if it were based on a Python.

Quote:

any way to check if its a 38 special or a 357 mag ?

as for ammo: Crap I just had it loaded with 357 Mag 125 gr FTX® Critical Defense in my night stand (locked of course)

If the .357mags seated completely and the cylinder closed, it's technically a .357mag. Still, I'd recommend sticking with .38spls with this gun, even for HD duty. The barrel is likely an Apex barrel, and has a faster twist rate than stock, designed for lead (not jacketed) wadcutter bullets shot at lower velocities.

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 06:37 PM

ah okay, I guess I will start shopping for some 38's.

Will the 357mags hurt the barrel or rifling?

and as a Davis how much is it worth ?

I got it used for 600$

(I apologize for my ignorance in revolvers and etc haha)

WC145 · March 18, 2012, 07:15 PM

.357s won't hurt the barrel or rifling. However, consider the gun "optimized" for .38spl wadcutters, it is a specialized piece built for a specific purpose, it is not a general use Colt Python with a heavy barrel.

At $600 I'd say you got a good deal for a Davis gun that is based on a Colt Python if you intend to use it as a range toy. It will be very accurate, it will have a terrific action, but it will not show it's best loaded with SD ammo and perched on your nightstand.

You've got yourself a great gun but not necessarily built for the general use that you envisioned. Of course, there's worse self defense loads than a .38spl wadcutter so all may not be lost.

MrBorland · March 18, 2012, 07:38 PM

I agree with WC145 on all points.

I don't think .357s will hurt the barrel per se, but Apex barrels had shallow lands & grooves and are a bit oversized (and have a fast twist), so .357s may not be very accurate (and you may see some copper fouling to boot).

$600 sounds good, even for a used gun bought in your LGS. If it's in in pristine condition, and/or came with documentation, I could see one selling for $1k.

As far as target ammo, most load their own, but if you don't reload, you can buy factory target ammo on-line:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/235...tter-box-of-50

One thing I noticed about mine is that it seemed to shoot low. But then, I realized PPC shooters typically aim at the neck for a 50 yard CoM hit, so it'll hits low with the typical bullseye-type target.

Jim Watson · March 18, 2012, 09:06 PM

I think the base gun was a Trooper or 357.
The top strap falls away at the front to blend with a round barrel, not the flat top and mild bevel to the rib of a Python.

I had a similar one on an Official Police and a friend built one up on a Python.

AT THE TIME (1970s) you could get a lighter DA on a Colt than a S&W.
But Colts are out of production and the Smith smiths have 30 years more experience. Not many Colt target revolvers being set up any more. Not that the existing ones aren't smooth, accurate guns.

Venom1956 · March 18, 2012, 10:04 PM

It really doesn't matter if it started as a python or not. Pythons were simply the trooper that had custom work, fitting and polishing done to the action.

Since this is a custom gun now it wouldn't matter if because all of the above would've been done to the gun regardless.

I'm not sure how u ended up with a custom PPC revolver when you wanted to get a Colt Python? Just because someone claims it was a Python doesn't mean it still is...

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 10:14 PM

I was at a gun shop and It really caught my eye, I was looking for a new Taurus 608 357 6inch barrel (8 rounds and big for SD)
they were sold out everywhere and at 500$ for one of those or this for 600(after I talked him down green back a dollar)

Anyway, this caught my eye and when I saw Colt, Python (I'm limited in education on revolvers but those two names meant alot to me)
I was pretty sold, the smooth light trigger was soo nice and it was DAO which I like So i bought it.

Now I saw that the top sights have Bill Davis custom engraved on them but the gun it self doesn't say anything on it so how can I tell if it is actually a Bill Davis custom and not just a stock colt with the sights bolted on.

I'm going to the range tomorrow, Hopefully I can find some .38 spc

Thanks

jaybkorn · March 18, 2012, 11:17 PM

Wait Crap I just tried to put in the 357 and it wouldnt fit all the way wow this place screwed me . . it must be a 38

Venom1956 · March 19, 2012, 12:07 AM

sorry to hear about it not being a .357 you still have a very fine custom revolver using it and a taurus in the same sentence isn't even fair.

jaybkorn · March 19, 2012, 01:06 AM

I need to get some money back imo . . . now I'm not even sure its a Bill Davis It could be just the top sight rail wow I feel screwed

Auto426 · March 19, 2012, 01:31 AM

Since it's a .38 Special it was probably built up off of an older Colt Officer's Match frame. The work was probably done by Bill Davis and it's probably a very nice shooter with a nice trigger. The price wasn't too bad considering how the gun should perform, but heavily modified guns like these tend to not be worth much on the used market.

If the dealer mismarked the gun there is a chance that they might refund it for you, but my guess is that's a small chance. Most dealers could care less about you once you buy a used gun from them.

jaybkorn · March 19, 2012, 01:39 AM

I hope the shop will work something out

MrBorland · March 19, 2012, 05:57 AM

Quote:

And being in New Jersey I just burned one of my pistol purchasers permits that took me 6 months to get . . .

I am very disappointed that they didn't even take the time to see what kind of weapon they are selling, wrong model and wrong chamber . . . really screwed me

Well, on one hand, I can understand your position on the labeling issue. But as several of us have already pointed out, at the end of the day, even if the base gun started out as a Python .357, it's really neither once it was modified to a PPC gun.

The other issue is that it sounds like a bit of an impulse buy, which is surprising, given how difficult your purchase permits are to get. As such, you played a role in your own screwing by buying a gun before taking the time to do your own homework.

Hook686 · March 19, 2012, 08:34 AM

So true ... I am ultimately responsible for my actions, reactions and inactions. It seems like a bummer, but you do have a very nice range gun to practice with, and .38 Spl can be had cheaper than .357 magnum.

You said, 'One of your permits'. In which case you can still buy a Python if you are hot for a Python. Good luck and sweet shooting.

MrBorland · March 19, 2012, 08:56 AM

Quote:

you do have a very nice range gun to practice with, and .38 Spl can be had cheaper than .357 magnum.

+1. And I personally think .38spl is a better choice for HD than .357mag. Those wadcutter target loads can make pretty effective HD rounds, too.

I'd go easy asking for a further discount. At $600, it's a fair price for a nice gun, no matter how it was marked.

OTOH, if you can make a case that you only bought the gun because it was marked as a .357mag, you could try politely asking for a refund (money and permit) or store credit. They may not give it to you, but, as pointed out, you'd still have a nice gun with which to work on your revolver skills.

March 18, 2012, 03:19 PM	#1
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	First revolver Bought! Colt Bill Davis 357 ?? Okay so I have a few pistols but I wanted something different and unique and IMHO beautiful I found a 6 inch 357 colt custom by Bill Davis . . . The tag said Colt Python on it I picked it up and the trigger was like butter smooth and light with no hammer, Was a DAO type trigger the dealer said. I dont know much about it but I can't wait to get the to range with it! can anyone tell me some more about it ? 6 inch bull barrel colt python ? hammerless SN# 662## Thx full http://i44.tinypic.com/346ujnk.jpg close up pony : http://i42.tinypic.com/18kuur.jpg full again : http://i42.tinypic.com/34qw6eu.jpg bull barrel http://i40.tinypic.com/29nz607.jpg Last edited by jaybkorn; March 18, 2012 at 04:47 PM.

March 18, 2012, 03:29 PM	#2
Venom1956 Senior Member Join Date: October 4, 2008 Location: WI Posts: 3,656	Could be a Python, Trooper or target match? There are several guns build on that frame. and after custom work like that someone who knows more can probably tell you. __________________ E-Shock rounds are engineered to expend maximum energy into soft targets, turning the density mass into an expanding rotational cone of NyTrilium matrix particles, causing neurological collapse to the central nervous system.- Yeah I can do that. I guarantee you will know it if a bicyclist hits your house going 1000 mph. -Smaug

March 18, 2012, 03:49 PM	#4
WC145 Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2008 Location: Downeast Maine Posts: 1,836	It's a PPC gun and it does have a hammer, it's just been bobbed. If you call Colt with the serial number they can tell you what it was originally and the year it was made. __________________ "If violent crime is to be curbed, it is only the intended victim who can do it. The felon does not fear the police, and he fears neither judge or jury. Therefore what he must be taught to fear is his victim." - LtCol Jeff Cooper

March 18, 2012, 04:53 PM	#8
theyallhurt Member Join Date: December 28, 2011 Location: New England Posts: 62	WOW...Experiencing a little jealousy here! __________________ RETREAT HELL!

March 18, 2012, 05:01 PM	#10
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	the dealer listed it as a 357 colt python any way to check if its a 38 special or a 357 mag ? as for ammo: Crap I just had it loaded with 357 Mag 125 gr FTX® Critical Defense in my night stand (locked of course) Last edited by jaybkorn; March 18, 2012 at 05:07 PM.

March 18, 2012, 03:34 PM	#3
Gdawgs Senior Member Join Date: June 1, 2009 Location: MN Posts: 656	I don't know anything about it, but it looks pretty sweet. That's quite the barrel on that thing. And that front sight looks pretty interesting.

March 18, 2012, 04:39 PM	#5
NoSecondBest Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2009 Location: Western New York Posts: 2,736	I had Bill Davis build two revolvers for me back in the 80's. He was/is probably the best revolversmith I've ever encountered. He did a Smith 27 and a Ruger Security Six for me at the same time. Each gun would shoot an inch at 50 yds off a rest with max loads. His trigger work was unequaled. I don't know if he's still active. Frank Pachmayr reccommended him to me and it was probably the best reccommendation I've ever gotten for gunsmith customization work.

March 18, 2012, 04:46 PM	#6
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	oops yea I meant to say bobbed or trimmed no thumb part. I really hope its a python as I've always wanted one but this was the first that was in my price range. the sights are an Aristocrat "rib"

March 18, 2012, 04:49 PM	#7
MrBorland Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2007 Location: NC Posts: 2,614	Nice gun. I have a Bill Davis S&W, also with the 6" heavy barrel & sight rib. As WC145 mentioned, it's a PPC gun, and Davis was the PPC builder when PPC was the game. It ought to lock up like a bank vault and be a sweet shooter. Note, though, that this is not a general-purpose gun, but specifically built as a target gun tuned for (148gr wadcutter) .38spl target loads, so it's unnecessary, perhaps unwise to shoot .357mags through it. If it started life as a .38spl, and you may not be able to even load the longer .357s.

March 18, 2012, 06:37 PM	#12
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	ah okay, I guess I will start shopping for some 38's. Will the 357mags hurt the barrel or rifling? and as a Davis how much is it worth ? I got it used for 600$ (I apologize for my ignorance in revolvers and etc haha)

March 18, 2012, 07:15 PM	#13
WC145 Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2008 Location: Downeast Maine Posts: 1,836	.357s won't hurt the barrel or rifling. However, consider the gun "optimized" for .38spl wadcutters, it is a specialized piece built for a specific purpose, it is not a general use Colt Python with a heavy barrel. At $600 I'd say you got a good deal for a Davis gun that is based on a Colt Python if you intend to use it as a range toy. It will be very accurate, it will have a terrific action, but it will not show it's best loaded with SD ammo and perched on your nightstand. You've got yourself a great gun but not necessarily built for the general use that you envisioned. Of course, there's worse self defense loads than a .38spl wadcutter so all may not be lost. __________________ "If violent crime is to be curbed, it is only the intended victim who can do it. The felon does not fear the police, and he fears neither judge or jury. Therefore what he must be taught to fear is his victim." - LtCol Jeff Cooper

March 18, 2012, 07:38 PM	#14
MrBorland Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2007 Location: NC Posts: 2,614	I agree with WC145 on all points. I don't think .357s will hurt the barrel per se, but Apex barrels had shallow lands & grooves and are a bit oversized (and have a fast twist), so .357s may not be very accurate (and you may see some copper fouling to boot). $600 sounds good, even for a used gun bought in your LGS. If it's in in pristine condition, and/or came with documentation, I could see one selling for $1k. As far as target ammo, most load their own, but if you don't reload, you can buy factory target ammo on-line: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/235...tter-box-of-50 One thing I noticed about mine is that it seemed to shoot low. But then, I realized PPC shooters typically aim at the neck for a 50 yard CoM hit, so it'll hits low with the typical bullseye-type target.

March 18, 2012, 09:06 PM	#15
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	I think the base gun was a Trooper or 357. The top strap falls away at the front to blend with a round barrel, not the flat top and mild bevel to the rib of a Python. I had a similar one on an Official Police and a friend built one up on a Python. AT THE TIME (1970s) you could get a lighter DA on a Colt than a S&W. But Colts are out of production and the Smith smiths have 30 years more experience. Not many Colt target revolvers being set up any more. Not that the existing ones aren't smooth, accurate guns.

March 18, 2012, 10:04 PM	#16
Venom1956 Senior Member Join Date: October 4, 2008 Location: WI Posts: 3,656	It really doesn't matter if it started as a python or not. Pythons were simply the trooper that had custom work, fitting and polishing done to the action. Since this is a custom gun now it wouldn't matter if because all of the above would've been done to the gun regardless. I'm not sure how u ended up with a custom PPC revolver when you wanted to get a Colt Python? Just because someone claims it was a Python doesn't mean it still is... __________________ E-Shock rounds are engineered to expend maximum energy into soft targets, turning the density mass into an expanding rotational cone of NyTrilium matrix particles, causing neurological collapse to the central nervous system.- Yeah I can do that. I guarantee you will know it if a bicyclist hits your house going 1000 mph. -Smaug

March 18, 2012, 10:14 PM	#17
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	I was at a gun shop and It really caught my eye, I was looking for a new Taurus 608 357 6inch barrel (8 rounds and big for SD) they were sold out everywhere and at 500$ for one of those or this for 600(after I talked him down green back a dollar) Anyway, this caught my eye and when I saw Colt, Python (I'm limited in education on revolvers but those two names meant alot to me) I was pretty sold, the smooth light trigger was soo nice and it was DAO which I like So i bought it. Now I saw that the top sights have Bill Davis custom engraved on them but the gun it self doesn't say anything on it so how can I tell if it is actually a Bill Davis custom and not just a stock colt with the sights bolted on. I'm going to the range tomorrow, Hopefully I can find some .38 spc Thanks

March 18, 2012, 11:17 PM	#18
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	Wait Crap I just tried to put in the 357 and it wouldnt fit all the way wow this place screwed me . . it must be a 38

March 19, 2012, 12:07 AM	#19
Venom1956 Senior Member Join Date: October 4, 2008 Location: WI Posts: 3,656	sorry to hear about it not being a .357 you still have a very fine custom revolver using it and a taurus in the same sentence isn't even fair. __________________ E-Shock rounds are engineered to expend maximum energy into soft targets, turning the density mass into an expanding rotational cone of NyTrilium matrix particles, causing neurological collapse to the central nervous system.- Yeah I can do that. I guarantee you will know it if a bicyclist hits your house going 1000 mph. -Smaug

March 19, 2012, 01:06 AM	#20
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	I need to get some money back imo . . . now I'm not even sure its a Bill Davis It could be just the top sight rail wow I feel screwed

March 19, 2012, 01:31 AM	#21
Auto426 Senior Member Join Date: November 24, 2007 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 1,323	Since it's a .38 Special it was probably built up off of an older Colt Officer's Match frame. The work was probably done by Bill Davis and it's probably a very nice shooter with a nice trigger. The price wasn't too bad considering how the gun should perform, but heavily modified guns like these tend to not be worth much on the used market. If the dealer mismarked the gun there is a chance that they might refund it for you, but my guess is that's a small chance. Most dealers could care less about you once you buy a used gun from them. __________________ *"Si vis pacem, para bellum"* - If you want peace, prepare for war.

March 19, 2012, 01:39 AM	#22
jaybkorn Junior Member Join Date: March 18, 2012 Posts: 12	I hope the shop will work something out Last edited by jaybkorn; March 19, 2012 at 05:55 PM.

March 19, 2012, 08:34 AM	#24
Hook686 Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2005 Location: USA The Great State of California Posts: 2,090	So true ... I am ultimately responsible for my actions, reactions and inactions. It seems like a bummer, but you do have a very nice range gun to practice with, and .38 Spl can be had cheaper than .357 magnum. You said, 'One of your permits'. In which case you can still buy a Python if you are hot for a Python. Good luck and sweet shooting. __________________ Hook686 When the number of people in institutions reaches 51%, we change sides.