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Old May 19, 2011, 04:11 PM   #26
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Barry, I will also note that my Father, who was in the Air Force and did three tours in Vietnam, being an Air Commando before anyone though about wearing a red beret and the aussie hat was actually worn in the field, has pictures of him with enough weapons and ammunition strapped on to make Rambo jealous.

He at one point time carried one or all of the following, a cut down Ithaca 37, a CAR-15, an M-1911A1, a S&W Airweight Air Crew, and a Ka-Bar.
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Old May 19, 2011, 04:50 PM   #27
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When I was a kid I spent time with my Uncle during the summer at Andrews Air Force Base. As you know this is the place where they maintain Air Force One for the president and an entire group of planes for other dignitaries. It is also where many heads of state land during visits. Needless to say the security is pretty tight.

So, one day my cousin and I are just riding our bikes around base we found a trail. We thought we were still in the housing area, but apparently stumbled into a secure are. Literally out of nowhere came two Air Force Security guys complete with barking dog. These guys were loaded for well whatever. They asked for our ID, my Uncles name and gave us a stern lecture before sending us on our way. Later my uncle told us who these guys were wish I could remember what he actually said the name of their unit was. He said these guys are equipped with loads of advanced gear and set up to handle any imaginable threat to the planes or the people on board. He said they were all through the wooded areas and most folks never knew they were there.
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Old May 19, 2011, 05:01 PM   #28
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i was in korea for 9/11, we were issued our weapons and empty mags. we carried empty mags for 2 months before we were issued 1 loaded mag to carry in a taped pouch, the gun was carried with an empty loaded.

upon draw and before turning in the mag each round had to be counted.
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Old May 19, 2011, 05:19 PM   #29
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In the early 80's i was in Honduras,someone came up with the great idea of 6 rounds of .45 in the 1911,10 rounds in the 16.I got to be friends fast with the arms room E-6,two extra mags for the .45,six extra 30 rounders for the 16,all fully loaded.It was before Ollie North got caught so no one really knew we were training in Central America,i think Uncle Sammy was trying to keep unwanted events to a minimum.
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Old May 19, 2011, 07:29 PM   #30
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In Germany starting in early 1971 we didn't draw our weapons for Guard Duty, didn't have broom sticks or anything else. In 1979-1980 I recall reading an article in Infantry Magazine entitled "Managing around Marksmanship"
in which the author-an active duty officer-noted that not only did many units skip Annual Qualification but they went on FTXs and left the small arms locked up in the Arms Room. One of the unfortunate consequences of the Vietnam Bungle was the relationship between officers and men became antagonistic and as a consequence seeing live ammunition in the hands of troops gives the brass anguish and heartburn. Plus the Army does a lousy job of training people with firearms.

Last edited by SIGSHR; May 19, 2011 at 11:23 PM.
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Old May 19, 2011, 10:26 PM   #31
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Air Force

When I was an Air policeman in 1967. I was assigned to a SAC base. We were issued a M1 carbine with 3 fifteen roll mags. the top round in each mag had a red round. at the end of shift when you cleared the weapon you had to show the NCO at the clearing barrel the mag in the weapon and then rack the bolt. Because we guarded nuclear weapon we were a authorized to use deadly force. When I whet to Vietnam I worked in air transportation. I was assigned to a remote airfield to support some freebases. I was issued a M16 and 5 twenty round mags. no side arm. the ncoic had to fight with command to get each member of the team a .38 cal SW combat masterpiece. early on we had to get permission to fire back when fired on. we stopped asking after we were damn near overrun by VC. We did not have any army or marine support. I was sent to Saudi Arabia in 1984 no weapons guarded my the locals. the Hotel was attacked by a car bomber. he was killed by an SP who happened to be running around the perimeter and snatched a M16 for a Saudi guard who was standing there watch the bad guy drive thru the barrcads. the SP was shipped home that night. caused some problem for the US. And Yes He Saved a bunch to American lives.
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Old May 21, 2011, 03:08 AM   #32
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Honestly? The military would rather sacrifice a troop than teach them proper weapons handling and keeping weapons in a state of readiness.

I was an active duty MP for over 8 years and only remember once or twice that weapons were charged on duty outside the range.

Then I got out and went to the police academy where the Gunsite modern technique was taught. Talk about an eye opening experience..... For once I actually had to quickly learn to think for myself and determine the state of readiness I wanted my weapon in.
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Old May 21, 2011, 10:12 AM   #33
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While on guard duty in Vietnam, our orders were to keep over M16s unloaded untill ordered to load them.
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Old May 21, 2011, 04:28 PM   #34
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The only time I have had a loaded magazine while in CONUS was doing ammo watch on the ranges overnight and that was handed off to the oncoming 'firewatch.' The other time was doing a Joint Task Force mission along the border. We were always condition 4 though.

Down range on the larger bases, we're almost always condition 4 but you are required to carry a magazine. Whether you do or don't is on you. I have never seen anyone denied a magazine, unless of course they have had psycological issues..Earlier in this deployment (Afg), we slept with our weapons condition 1 in our sleeping bag while having someone on the condition 3 crew served in the truck. However, we were living out of our trucks in the middle of the desert. The only other time I haven't had rounds was flying into country or driving in Kuwait. In Kuwait though, at least one person on each bus had a full mag for the m16.
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Old May 21, 2011, 09:21 PM   #35
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This is all blowing my mind that there were ever unloaded weapons carried by military police. Like someone said earlier^ a lot of things have changed since 9/11. For example, they're not unloaded anymore.
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Old May 21, 2011, 10:20 PM   #36
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This is all blowing my mind that there were ever unloaded weapons carried by military police. Like someone said earlier^ a lot of things have changed since 9/11. For example, they're not unloaded anymore
Quite often even now they are unloaded..
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Old May 22, 2011, 12:56 AM   #37
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Public; armed forces; articles of war, UCMJ, ROEs-SOPs...

This is going slightly off subject but many citizens or members of the general public have little or no clear understanding of how/when/where most active duty or reserve military carry/use small arms(pistols shotguns rifles etc).
US service members must obey & follow lawful orders. They must also adhere to formal SOPs or ROEs(rules of engagement). Some US citizens working as PSCs(private security contractors) like the shooting event in Pakistan or the Blackwater(Xe) events in OIF/Iraq are under the same legal conditions re; SOFAs(Status of Forces Agreements) or the UCMJ(uniform code of military justice).
Many people watch shows like NCIS or 24 and think real military events are the same way but it does not work. For details see; the JAG section of .

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Old May 22, 2011, 09:50 PM   #38
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From E-1 to E-8, I've only carried a round in the chamber a very few times

Classified Documents: 1911 .45 round chambered, normally a 12 gauge, 870 or sometimes a Ithaca 37, No round in the chamber

Cash Transfer: See above

G7 meeting in 1987 in Venice: I had the honor of being a BM2 for President Reagan, and had the the SS take my magazines away from my 1911

Gulf war part I: only had one round in a 1911, when the Marine's were playing with certain things at the piers at Earle NJ.

Gulf war part II: I ermmmmm. kinda borrowed a 1911 from the armory at Little Creek Va, I did bring it back

My last posting was Henderson Hall, they tried to issue me a M9, I found an old marine E-7, He had a 1911 still hidden somewhere
Round in the chamber, always

Edit, OK I have a 1911 thing LoL
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