The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old September 6, 2009, 10:56 AM   #1
Senior Member
Join Date: November 15, 2007
Location: Outside KC, MO
Posts: 10,128
AARP members; legitimate threats?

A question came up in a now-closed thread: Is an unarmed 61 year old man a legitimate threat?

One poster mentioned that Chuck Norris is in his 60's.

That made me think of a dojo I trained at in Orlando.

The head instructor is around 70, and has myasthenia gravis (sp?). There are times when he can barely walk. There are other times when he can fling much younger people through the air and onto the ground with force that leaves them breathless for a while. I've been a recipient of one of his open palmed slaps (I left myself in a poorly guarded position while trying a wrist-lock on him, and he gave me the slap to let me know) that left my ear ringing for over a day.

A couple of the higher level belts (4th dan and 3rd dan) are in their mid-60's. One is the father of some of my high school classmates. It used to amuse him to work out with me; my wrists have finally healed. The other is a very young looking 64, looks more like 50. Either of these gentlemen would pose a very serious threat to your average adult male.

We had a couple other, lower black belts in their 60's. I wouldn't want to initiate conflict with them, either.

Note: At the time I was working out with these guys, I was actually in shape, late 30's, 6ft/205lbs, and benching around 315. I would have considered these men to be very serious threats.

Just something to think about.


MLeake is offline  
Old September 6, 2009, 01:01 PM   #2
Glenn E. Meyer
Join Date: November 17, 2000
Posts: 18,907
You never know if someone is unarmed, IMHO. Out of the pocket comes a blade. I've posted several times of a young stud who got into an argument with an old coot over a fender bender. He advanced on the coot who stuck a paring knife in stud's chest - stud dropped dead. Magic hit!

Thus, avoidance is the way to go.
NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc. - Aux Armes, Citoyens
Being an Academic Shooter
Being an Active Shooter
Glenn E. Meyer is offline  
Old September 6, 2009, 01:17 PM   #3
Senior Member
Join Date: July 8, 2009
Posts: 125
Reminds me of the video that was on one of those shows on Spike (Most incredible etc...).

Old guy at the counter in a store, think he was scratching lottery tickets, had a wad of cash in back pocket. Youth behind spots and decides to pick grandpa's pocket, after all how dangerous can he be....

Unfortunately the old man had previously been a Marine, a boxing champ and worked as a steelworker the rest of the time.... it took him a meer few seconds to knock the snot out of the young guy

Found it Its a full report so has all the MSNBC fluff too.

He reacted because he didnt want to loose his wifes ATM cash
docpadds is offline  
Old September 6, 2009, 01:42 PM   #4
Staff In Memoriam
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,069
I was attacked by a huge fella on MLKJ Day. He was 63 and dealt out 2 round house blows to the side/back of my neck as I ducked my head before I finally lit him up... I guessed him at 52-55 y.o. Lucky for me, I called 911 to report it before him as first caller gets a little bonus. I could have faced "felony assault on an elderly person" for knocking his molar out of his jaw.

Last edited by hogdogs; September 7, 2009 at 06:13 PM.
hogdogs is offline  
Old September 7, 2009, 05:23 PM   #5
Senior Member
Join Date: April 16, 2008
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,891
Too me, anyone no matter how old, can be considered a threat. In the previous thread there were a few posts referring to the 60yr-old as "the old man"... as if to imply the guy needed a cane or Rascal scooter.

I gotta say that in general your average 60yr-old can still hold his own and would usually have a strength advantage over most young mothers. Heck I'm 29 and a well built (or so I've been told ) 5' 11" / 185lbs. Not a huge guy but I can take care of myself. Regardless, I can think of at least 3 guys more than 2x my age that I would NOT want to mess with in a fist fight!

Bottom line ... AARP or not, a healthy 60yr-old man can most definitely pose a serious threat. As a side note, my 90yr old grandfather still has a grip like a small gorilla
Hopp Custom Leather <------ click for HOLSTER awesomeness!!

-There is no theory of evolution... Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.
Sixer is offline  
Old September 7, 2009, 05:25 PM   #6
Senior Member
Join Date: May 27, 2007
Location: DFW Metroplex (well, McKinney)
Posts: 858
Everyone is dangerous. Girl Scouts, grandmas, everyone. Even you. Even me.
I believe in a world which consists of America, her friends, and her dead enemies.
LightningJoe is offline  
Old September 7, 2009, 08:37 PM   #7
Senior Member
Join Date: April 17, 2009
Posts: 237
Any one can pose a threat at anytime, the old man walking down the street or the little kid on a bike, both could pull a knife or a gun, or the old man could just whoop the stuffing out of you, You just never know what a stranger is capable of.

Last edited by JohnKSa; September 7, 2009 at 09:18 PM. Reason: Terminology adjustment.
StiveC2007 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 10:55 AM   #8
Senior Member
Join Date: March 29, 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 117
I'm in my 60's & if it's ever on, I don't plan on it going long enough that the younger stronger guy will win.
"Blessed be the Lord my strength,which teacheth my hands to war and my fingers to fight".
Psalm 144:1 KJV Be safe: Paul
besafe2 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 11:18 AM   #9
Senior Member
Join Date: December 13, 2001
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 1,090
Funny but will start folks talking about the witty comment which isn't T and T.

I take the leech that's bleeding me
Can't stop to save my soul
I take the leash that's leading me

Last edited by Glenn E. Meyer; September 8, 2009 at 11:20 AM. Reason: Ha ha - not relevant.
Omaha-BeenGlockin is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 12:52 PM   #10
Bud Helms
Join Date: December 31, 1999
Location: Middle Georgia
Posts: 13,155
I'm in my 60's & if it's ever on, I don't plan on it going long enough that the younger stronger guy will win.
Ditto. The older you get, it's less like a game and more like survival. No time for wrestling matches and confrontations of sheer strength.


I have a friend about three years older than me. He has a saying, and I've heard him use it: "You probably can whup my butt, but it's gonna catch you by surprise when you have to."

"The irony of the Information Age is that it has given new respectability to uninformed opinion." - John Lawton, speaking to the American Association of Broadcast Journalists in 1995
Bud Helms is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 01:37 PM   #11
Senior Member
Join Date: January 12, 2007
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 4,728
I've always heard, "Don't ever mess with an old man, if he's too tired to fight he'll just kill you".

Anyone can be a threat. Depends more on their intentions, and opportunity to carry them out, than their appearance.
NRA Member
NC Hunter's Education Instructor

PCCA Member (What's PCCA you ask? <- Check the link)
rantingredneck is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 02:09 PM   #12
Jim March
Senior Member
Join Date: February 14, 1999
Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA
Posts: 7,413
The good news is that anybody with the self-discipline to get that good in the dojo by that age is NOT going to randomly commit crimes or attack people. Odds of that are so far against it's just not worth worrying about.

What you have to watch out for is the old ironworker or whatever.
Jim March
Jim March is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 02:15 PM   #13
Join Date: July 2, 2009
Location: DFW
Posts: 31
My dad is 66 and has swung a hammer almost every day of his life for the last 50 years. I could probably take him now, but I wouldn't want try. He can still drive a nail with one blow. He played basketball until he was about 55, before the soreness started affecting his work the next day. Don't mess with "old men".
“ The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people. ”
Texasborn is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 02:22 PM   #14
Senior Member
Join Date: June 18, 2008
Location: Pac.N.W.
Posts: 1,804
Age not a big factor IMO. I have a 50ish year old brother who is the nicest person I know but the best martial artist I know. He's 6 ft 155# and the things he can mentally do are amazing. As in mind over matter, like if it was on, in his mind you don’t matter.
As for the 61 year old this thread is based on, ya he was a threat and would be tread as such. I think it really depends on who he is "threatening". Like it has already been stated who known’s what they might me caring, SLY OLD GUYS
Be Smarter Than A Bore-Snake!
comn-cents is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 02:27 PM   #15
Senior Member
Join Date: December 18, 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 193
I am more afraid of an old guy than a younger one.
tacticalmedic is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 02:39 PM   #16
Junior member
Join Date: September 28, 2005
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 6,465
Another martial arts practitioner here....

Been thrown across the room by an 80-something year old man who underwent hip replacement surgery earlier that year, when I was 17 years old.

That man ended up dying of smoke inhalation while running into a burning building to save his life's work from a fire. (Smart or not, it was his decision and he paid the price alone...)

All you old coots play nice. I've heard the old saw: "Old men know better than to fight fair... they'll just kill ya."
azredhawk44 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 03:21 PM   #17
Senior Member
Join Date: November 20, 2004
Posts: 3,150
The question addresses only the general context and includes those in their 60's who, at the time of the incident, won't be relevent to your situation involving a specific individual.

Since you don't know he's armed, you might consider that some ol' coots, the older they get, the more likely they'll be armed--which has been pointed out already.

As we get older, our physical SD capabilities lessen, and so does our ability to take a good fanny whipping.

Could he be a threat? Anybody want to take on George Foreman?
Nnobby45 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 03:33 PM   #18
Senior Member
Join Date: June 18, 2004
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 2,566
I'm within spitting distance of 65m , . . . got one bad knee, . . . had my aortic valve on my heart replaced, . . . and I don't breathe as well as I would like to.

But I got a 1911, 55+ years of experience, and an attitude.

I don't consider myself dangerous or anything, . . . just ready and willing, . . . if necessary.

But in answer to the question the OP posed, . . . no, . . . AARP members are not much of a threat. Their official organization's position is pretty much anti-gun, anti-ccw, anti-shooting, . . . and anti just about anything else that has to do with the 2A.

May God bless,
If you can breathe, . . . thank God!
If you can read, . . . thank a teacher!
If you are reading this in English, . . . thank a Veteran!
Dwight55 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 03:55 PM   #19
James K
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 24,294
I'm 76 and am not as strong as I once was, but my favorite .45 is ten years younger and hasn't lost any of its skills.

Jim K
James K is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 04:07 PM   #20
Senior Member
Join Date: July 10, 2008
Location: Live Free or Die state
Posts: 259
Age. It really sucks, but is much better than the alternative.

But is an older man weak? I'm quite sure that mostly depends on where he started from. I used to run and lift a lot. Now only an inch away from 50, i still have enough stamina and strength to outwork my teenage sons and their friends all day long. (Just now i may not be able to walk quite right the next day...)

Jack Lalane was pretty darn tough at 80. Tougher than most men ever are. The martial artists mentioned are other great examples. However a valid point was made - the MA experts probably aren't going to be starting fights, but you never know.

So when a deranged, angry or just nutjob 60 year old threatens an attack, it should be taken seriously unless proven otherwise. Plenty of murders are carried out by septuagenarians.
"To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness... How pathetic." - - Ted Nugent

"Cogito, Ergo Armitum Sum" - (I Think, Therefore I Am Armed)- - anon.
Daugherty16 is offline  
Old September 8, 2009, 09:58 PM   #21
Join Date: April 24, 2009
Posts: 89
study the arts

For many years but I am not as flexible nor do I have the stamina I once had. But my trigger finger is still pretty good.

Last edited by buck9; September 9, 2009 at 01:10 PM.
buck9 is offline  
Old September 9, 2009, 02:19 PM   #22
Senior Member
Join Date: May 22, 2007
Location: In the oak studded hills near Napa
Posts: 2,203
Former brawler now 51 years old, fat and easily winded; I now go out of my way to avoid conflict. I figure if the need arises, either I'm puttin' 'em down for good in the first 15 seconds, or I'll need an oxygen bottle. That's the thing with older guys; they know they have to get the job done, so they don't mess around.

When I was about 17,young bad-boy that I was, I thought I could take my 52 year old dad. He, having spent the majority of his days barroom brawling, kicked the crap out of me, lickity split. I didn't try again for four years.
grymster2007 is offline  
Old September 9, 2009, 11:22 PM   #23
Bud Helms
Join Date: December 31, 1999
Location: Middle Georgia
Posts: 13,155
Getting old ain't for sissies.
"The irony of the Information Age is that it has given new respectability to uninformed opinion." - John Lawton, speaking to the American Association of Broadcast Journalists in 1995
Bud Helms is offline  
Old September 10, 2009, 12:17 PM   #24
Senior Member
Join Date: May 23, 2009
Location: Nevada
Posts: 644
Is an unarmed 60-year-old a threat? Depends. First,*which* 60-year-old? Second, how well prepared are you to deal with a threat? Third, what are the circumstances?

I'm 48 and female. What advantage I get from being only 80% of a 60-year-old man's age is probably negated by his being larger and probably stronger. A lot of 60-year-old men are in excellent physical health these days. They might not be as fast or as strong as they were at 20, but on the plus side they've got a *lot*more experience.

If you'd asked about an eighty-year-old guy, I might think that his age would trump some of this. Not sixty. Not nowdays.
sakeneko is offline  
Old September 10, 2009, 12:28 PM   #25
.300 Weatherby Mag
Senior Member
Join Date: September 6, 2008
Posts: 1,777
Old Age and Treachery.... You must respect the old farts.... My grandpa trained the precursors to the seals in combat juido (sp?)... Get him aggravated and bad things can happen ...
.300 Weatherby Mag is offline  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:45 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent:
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09588 seconds with 7 queries