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Old June 12, 2009, 04:38 AM   #51
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Shoot to wound.
Most law, in a self defense situation is quite clear, you as a reasonable person, on seeing a threat that would cause you death, or grievous injury, can use as much force as reasonably necessary, and again "up to, and including causing death" to stop that threat.

A bad end to shooting to wound comes from Israel, a young Army Officer, on leave, is awakened by neighbor, "there is a man, crazed, stabbing people in the market" he goes outside with his pistol (a BHP) the young soldier calls on the man, to drop the knife, he does not, and is shot in the leg, then the other leg (thigh? hard ball 9mm) by this time the distance is a mere 3 feet, and the soldier is stabbed to death.

Shooting to stop a threat, one you, the armed for self defense person sees as real! Shots to center of mass, repeated till the threat is no longer there, that is a valid, and legal response.

And let us face it, why would you shoot someone if your life was not in danger? or the life of some one under your care and protection.
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Old June 12, 2009, 07:43 AM   #52
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Brit, nice story. Have a source? The only reason I ask is because it has all the earmarks of an internet myth. These earmarks include being a lesson learned tragic hero story with too much detail about the event without necessary detail to be able to actually research or identify it. In other words, we know the main actor was an army officer on leave and was asleep when awakened by his neighbor. We know he has a BHP and is shooting 9mm ball. We know the opposition is in the market stabbing people with a knife and ends up shot in each leg, the last time from a very specific distance away from the hero.

What we don't know is when this happened, where it happened, or the names of any of the participants.

The story may be true. I don't know. How it is presented, however, is in the form typical of internet myths.
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Old June 13, 2009, 06:59 AM   #53
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Hi Double naught,

Sorry I can not be more specific, this was told to me by one of Station Chiefs of the Israeli Consulate in Toronto, not an Embassy, that was (and still is) in Ottawa.

I leased a Range for my classes, and in turn sub let to the El Al and Consular armed staff. The last time I was involved was 2003, otherwise I would not be mentioning this on a site such as this. No detail of their training was to be discussed, and no one, other than them, and I, knew the days they were down the range.

There must be more detail, but not known, or remembered by yours truly.

Is this a true event? I believe so, but have no facts to add.
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Old June 16, 2009, 01:57 PM   #54
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Blindmandsbluff, while I don't agree with your language, I do agree with your point. I actually said something along those lines recently in the L&CR forums under the Assault Weapons Ban discussion.

Most of the people on this forum have never shot anyone or come close to having to shoot someone. Statistically, only a very small percentage of Americans ever had. So it stands to reason that an internet forum should follow suit as representative sample.

I agree that, often times, the pro-gun crowd is its own worst enemy. People being so preoccupied with the notion of killing someone gives all a bad name. Many of them have a point in that you must be prepared to use your gun if necessary. That is true. But, their delivery and choice of words often makes it sound like they are just looking for a reason to shoot someone, a task most people aren't psychologically prepared to handle as well as they might think.

Just so you feel better, I posed a question about obviously, mentally impaired people who have a history trying to harm themselves. The idea was that someone with a history of violence, toward one's self or others, and who is under the influence of a mind altering drug should have not have access to firearms. Most posters have been very insightful as to how we, as a nation, could or could not handle that in a Constitutionally sound way, but some people just screamed, basically, let the crazy folks have all the guns they want until they shoot someone. I'm just thinking, "Way to give the anti-gun folks some easy ammo, guys. Way to go."

In this case, of course its a great thing that the outcome is what it is!!! But, BMB, you're going to have to accept that not everyone is as reasonable and appreciate of human life as you or I or most of the people on this forum are. Most of us carry guns to protect that which hold so dear, life. Some want guns because they just want some excuse to go Jack Bauer on something.
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Old June 19, 2009, 05:49 PM   #55
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robber come in store,clerk gives him the money he has her lay down in back room shoots her in back of head.manning sc may 2009.
two men enter house want money get money walk out one turns around an shoots home owner in face kills him sumpter sc june 2009.
in depresion men went all over country looking for work crime low.2009 crackheads go around robbing and killing.
good luck to you do gooders.
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Old July 7, 2009, 01:55 PM   #56
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Mind set vs Instinct

The mind set of shoot them all, and let God sort them out, is not that prevalent on the Firing Line.

Maybe a few, individuals who joined two months ago!

Mind set is a learned response, so to speak, instinct? well that is body operating on an instant open circuit, not a switch, but rather pressure behind a gate that causes the gate to open, but just as a pressure gate, more of a toggle than bolt pulling, a device that swivels, instant application of power.
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Old July 7, 2009, 04:06 PM   #57
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They called it a shotgun??? Stupid reporters. That is a hipoint carbine, looks like a 9mm...

That is the same idiocy that makes everyone think that every AK47 style rifle is an "assault rifle". And helps nurture fear in the minds of the ignorant.

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Old July 8, 2009, 06:20 PM   #58
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A gun is, at its core, a tool for causing injury and death to whatever is on its recieving end. If you dont have ammo, your tool doesnt work, and theres no point using it
Didn't work? Come on Zack. The empty shotgun induced a guy to surrender, become a begger, and convert to Islam. All that before leaving with enough money to buy a case of beer and go see Johnny Depps' new Dillinger movie complete with coke and popcorn, and have money left over.

And let's not forget the warm feeling left with the store owner, PLUS the promise never to rob anybody again.

Jeez, all that accomplished with an unloaded shotgun.

Last edited by Nnobby45; July 8, 2009 at 06:28 PM.
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